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Featured Who’s Right … Torture Defenders Or Critics?

Discussion in 'Political Debate & Discussion' started by poncho, Dec 12, 2014.

  1. Crabtownboy

    Crabtownboy Well-Known Member
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    One cannot be against abortion and pro-torture.
     
  2. FollowTheWay

    FollowTheWay Well-Known Member
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    Waterboarding is defined as torture. The person being waterboarded believes that they are drowning. Would you like to try that? Besides, waterboarding is only one torture method that the U.S. has used.

    —The agency assigned unqualified personnel to run the secret prisons where it held, in often-inhuman conditions, at least 119 detainees, at least two of whom died. Some were beaten, deprived of sleep for up to 180 hours, sometimes with their hands shackled over their heads, and subjected to unauthorized interrogation methods, including death threats.
    —At least 26 detainees were wrongfully imprisoned.
    —Multiple detainees who were subjected to the interrogation techniques and kept in extended isolation developed "psychological and behavioral issues, including hallucinations, paranoia, insomnia and attempts at self-harm and self-mutilation."

    Sleep deprivation involved keeping detainees awake for up to 180 hours, usually standing or in stress positions, at times with their hands shackled above their heads,” the Senate report reads in part. “At least five detainees experienced disturbing hallucinations during prolonged sleep deprivation and, in at least two of those cases, the CIA nonetheless continued the sleep deprivation.


    In one instance, the CIA subjected a detainee, Abu Hudhaifa, to “ice water baths and 66 hours of standing sleep deprivation,” then released him because it was realized that, according to the report, “he was likely not the person he was believed to be.” Another inmate, Arsala Khan, reportedly suffered from “disturbing hallucinations” after being kept awake for 56 hours, at which point the CIA determined that he did not appear to be “involved in...current plans or activities against US personnel or facilities.”
    [FONT=&quot]
    Details about the CIA’s desire to use insects on detainees first surfaced in 2009, when a declassified DOJ memo revealed that the agency wanted to place Zubaydah in a small confinement box with a bug because “he appear[ed] to have a fear of insects.” Interrogators would then tell Zubaydah that the insect’s sting "would produce death or severe pain."

    [/FONT]
    According to another excerpt, Saudi detainee Abd al-Rahim al-Nashiri was placed "in a forward-facing position (Trendlenberg) with head lower than torso,” then rectally “fed.” Another prison, the report reveals, was given a “lunch tray” of hummus, pasta with sauce, nuts, and raisins, which was “pureed” and anally infused.
    “[W]hat I infer is that you get a tube up as far as you can, then open the IV wide. No need to squeeze the bag — let gravity do the work,” one officer wrote of the process.


    When the CIA responded to the Senate panel’s inquiries about the practice ahead of the report’s publication, the agency called rectal rehydration a "well acknowledged medical technique.” At least one detainee, however, was subsequently diagnosed with chronic hemorrhoids, an anal fissure, and symptomatic rectal prolapse after being rectally fed. The CIA also said that doing as much to a detainee was necessary in instances where prisoners became uncooperative, but the Senate panel found that records suggested such was done to inmates regardless of whether they were willing to cooperate.
     
  3. OldRegular

    OldRegular Well-Known Member

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    And when did you retire from the CIA Crabbie. Careful they may put a hit on you for revealing their methods.

    *********************************************

    I can show you where Jesus Christ used a whip on certain people:

    John 2:15 And when he had made a scourge of small cords, he drove them all out of the temple, and the sheep, and the oxen; and poured out the changers’ money, and overthrew the tables;

    I can also show you where He is going to condemn certain people to far worse than anything you list above, for eternity:

    Matthew 10:28 And fear not them which kill the body, but are not able to kill the soul: but rather fear him which is able to destroy both soul and body in hell.

    I can show many more of the above.

    ******************************************************

    Crabtownboy, you say:
    Now, PLEASE, Crabtownboy show me one place in Scripture where Jesus Christ approves of those who slaughter the unborn child or those who support the slaughter of the unborn child.

    So CTB your assertion I quote above rings hollow when confronted with the truth!
     
  4. OldRegular

    OldRegular Well-Known Member

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    So you are ex-CIA like CTB. Those folks are going to do abetter job vetting those they hire!
     
  5. Revmitchell

    Revmitchell Well-Known Member
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    Why is it liberals cannot make legitimate comparisons. One has nothing to do with the other. Unlike abortion and PP.
     
  6. poncho

    poncho Well-Known Member

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    Why is it conservatives tell us in one thread that we have to obey the law even if we feel it's silly or unfair but have no problem disregarding the law when it comes to torture?
     
  7. OldRegular

    OldRegular Well-Known Member

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    I recommend that the CIA replace waterboarding with exposure to endless conspiracy theories by, who else but poncho!
     
  8. poncho

    poncho Well-Known Member

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    This doesn't answer my question.
     
  9. poncho

    poncho Well-Known Member

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    Why is it conservatives complain about the non transparency of the Obama administration in many other threads then claim "national security" and "only those who were there can really know" INO "It's secret" when it looks as though the information being presented might be incriminating to a republican?
     
  10. poncho

    poncho Well-Known Member

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    Interrogation Experts From Every Branch of the Military and Intelligence Agree: Torture DOESN’T Produce Useful Information

    http://www.ritholtz.com/blog/2011/0...ee-torture-doesnt-produce-useful-information/

    Looks like quite a few have been interviewed over the years.
     
  11. Bro. Curtis

    Bro. Curtis <img src =/curtis.gif>
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    During some of my Navy training, I was under so much pain and mental stress, (tear gas, smokehouse, jumping into a pool of 55 degree salt water, holding a pushup position until there's a puddle of sweat underneath you.), that I definitely would have told them anything they wanted to know. Heck, I might have actually turned over my mom to get out of that pool.

    I don't know who's right on this. But the folks on both sides throwing Jesus around simply to pound on the other side, or exalt their own super morality, are both wrong. I'll have no part of it.
     
  12. OldRegular

    OldRegular Well-Known Member

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    I hope all the whiney naysayers on this thread watch Megan Kelley's interview with the psychologist who helped in the interrogation of the 9/11 terrorists!
     
  13. poncho

    poncho Well-Known Member

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    Did they all confess?

    I bet you'd confess to being Al Qaeda after a couple hours.
     
  14. poncho

    poncho Well-Known Member

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    One of the 2 main architects of the American torture program – Air Force psychologist James Mitchell (who personally waterboarded detainees) – still claims that torture produced actionable intelligence:

    Mitchell, who admitted he is “biased,” said valuable intelligence was obtained, particularly in the case of Abu Zubaydah, who Mitchell said provided interrogators with the operational structure of al Qaeda that the CIA continues to rely upon.

    The claim is not entirely surprising. As shown below, Abu Zubaydah was the poster boy for the alleged necessity and effectiveness of the torture program.

    There’s just one wee little problem with his claim …

    The Washington Post documents that Abu Zubaydah was literally crazy – as he had suffered a serious head injury years before 9/11 – and that the FBI agent involved in interrogating Abu Zubaydah and reviewing documents at his house (Daniel Coleman) said that everyone knew that Abu Zubaydah was an unreliable source for information.

    This is confirmed by the the New Yorker. Pulitzer Prize winning journalist Ron Suskind writes that interrogator Coleman advised a top FBI official at the time:

    “This guy is insane, certifiable, split personality.”

    Indeed, the government has since backed away from all claims that Abu Zubaydah had any role in Al Qaeda or 9/11. For example – in September 2009 – the U.S. government admitted in writing in a court proceeding that Abu Zubaydah had never been a member or associate or supporter of al-Qaeda, was not involved in 9/11, and had no prior knowledge of 9/11:

    http://www.washingtonsblog.com/2014/12/torture-911-evil-last-13-years.html
     
  15. carpro

    carpro Well-Known Member
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    This committee, didn't interview any of the people involved in setting up or running the program.

    Doesn't look to me like they were interested in what really took place, only what they could use for their agenda.

    Democrats had a predetermined outcome and they made sure their "investigation" gave them the outcome they were looking for. No dissenting views allowed.
     
  16. poncho

    poncho Well-Known Member

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    I really don't care about the politics and agendas of either party.

    Wrong is wrong.
     
  17. carpro

    carpro Well-Known Member
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    Makes you a useful tool in this case.
     
  18. poncho

    poncho Well-Known Member

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    Like you aren't? Without guys like you arguing their case for them the politicians could never get away with doing things like this.

    Wrong is wrong. There is no left or right to it.
     
  19. Melanie

    Melanie Active Member
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    Some poor sap will be made accountable. History of course will be judge of who was right etc.
     
  20. poncho

    poncho Well-Known Member

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    You need history to tell you the difference between right and wrong?
     
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