Who does God Love?!

Discussion in '2005 Archive' started by Brian Hildebran, Aug 17, 2005.

  1. Brian Hildebran

    Brian Hildebran
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    I am new to "this" forum, so be easy with your answers. I will rephrase the question.

    Does God Love EVERY single human being that ever lived or will live?

    Did God say He loved Esau?

    Does God love everyone except Esau?

    I am very interested in the answers and explanations that you give. But before you jump the gun and answer too quickly let me point out some interesting FACTOIDS!

    1)There is only one verse in the Gospels that even hints that God loves everyone, i.e. John 3:16. You will search in vain for any other.

    2) Nowhere(!) in the Book of the Acts of the Apostles will you find God's Love even mentioned! Funny this should be, because it is the recorded evangelistic efforts of the early Church. Yet not once is God's Love used in any sermon that is recorded. This should teach those who produce tracts that start out "GOD LOVES YOU."

    3) It is "only" in the Epistles (which are written to Believers) that God's Love for them is expounded upon. I believe God's Love is ONLY for His Elect/Children which is expressed in God's electing, redeeming, calling, justifying, and regenerating.

    Some may speak of "common love." Such will be hard pressed to provide Biblical proof. Some may say it is "common grace" of which I am still not sure exactly what the benefits of such grace would be or even what "grace" means in such a case. (For grace given and not acted upon, in the case of the reprobate, would only heap more condemnation upon them) This may seem hyper-Calvinist to some and assuredly someone will attribute this name to me. A name to me is neither here nor there! It is truth Biblically proved and applied that strokes the chords of my heart!

    I look forward to the Cal and NonCal answers and explanations hopefully leading to a healthy dialogue leading down the path of truth.

    In Christ
    Brian H. ;)
     
  2. johnp.

    johnp.
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    Hello Brian.

    Good to meet you man. :cool:

    Love never fails therefore those God sends to Hell have always been hated.
    Common grace can only lead to greater condemnation therefore it is not grace but further hostility to those He hates.

    john.
     
  3. TomMann

    TomMann
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    Sheep!!!!!
     
  4. johnp.

    johnp.
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    "He is the LORD; let him do what is good in his eyes."

    john. :cool:
     
  5. obscureone

    obscureone
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    I would suggest the following priorities of God's love: first, Himself; second, His elect people; third, His non-elect people. Each of these experience a different expression of His love.
     
  6. philg

    philg
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    Who does God hate?
     
  7. GrannyGumbo

    GrannyGumbo
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    God's love for the world is at the cross. He does not love everybody.

    He hates the workers of iniquity.(Psalms 5:5) -that would be your sodomites, among others.

    He hates the hands that shed innocent blood.(Proverbs 6:17) -that would be the baby murderers, among others.

    He hates a proud look, a lying tongue, a heart that deviseth wicked imaginations, a false witness.(Proverbs 6:16-19) -these are attached to people.

    God's love abides on those who love Him. There IS a stipulation for abiding in God's love...John 15:10 "If ye keep my commandments, ye shall abide in my love; even as I have kept my Father's commandments, and abide in his love."

    Sorry, just some thoughts from someone who is neither C nor A.
     
  8. billwald

    billwald
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    (most)Parents seem to love their good kids and their bad kids.
     
  9. johnp.

    johnp.
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    God loves all His Children. The reprobate are not His Children but His slaves.

    john.
     
  10. Bro Tony

    Bro Tony
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    "God demonstrated His love for us in that WHILE WE WERE YET SINNERS, Christ died for us."

    Romans 5:8

    Bro Tony
     
  11. JohnB

    JohnB
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    Brian,
    Perhaps your question should be "Does God love all men with "saving" love?"

    I ran across something recently regarding love and election that really made me think.

    Here's the scenerio:

    I have children. I love them and desire their salvation. But, under Calvinism's unconditional election, I have to concede that any one of them, or all of them, may not be elect.

    If (hypothetically) God gave me the choice of guaranteeing their election by accepting my own damnation, I would not hesitate to save them. That's how much I love them.

    Yet, if they are indeed non-elect, this means that I love them more than God does, more than Christ does. How could I as a sinful, fallen, human father possibly love them more than the perfect, holy, God who "is love?"

    Praise God that this cannot be true.

    Does God love all men, women and children who have ever, or will ever live, with a saving love? How much more clearly could He have stated this than John 3:16? Or Romans 5:8?
     
  12. All about Grace

    All about Grace
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    Brian,

    I'm not sure you have children, but if you do, please do not make the mistake of telling them God loves them. You might want to let them know ahead of time that God may actually hate them.


    If God is love by nature, is there any way God cannot love? I am a human by nature. There are certain traits that I must excercise because I am a human. If I did not function in a certain capacity, I would not be a human. Even so, God is love. Is it possible for God to be love and yet "not love" the majority of his creation?
     
  13. philg

    philg
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    Does this mean that God denies the salvation of those who commit iniquity.? (Notice he says “all workers”) see psalm 51:2 - Did God not love
    David? Did God desire
    Davids salvation? See Psalm 51:9 - was David a worker of iniquity?

    See Psalm 51:5 -- were you and I and everyone shapen in iniquity?

    Read Jermiaha 3:13 - if we aknowledge our iniquity do we receive the blessings of God? Read Psalm 103:3--can iniquity be forgiven? (see also Pslam 130:3-4.

    Titus 2:14 - can we be redeemed from all iniquity?

    Isa 53:5 -- was Jesus bruised for our iniquity?

    So how do we understand psalm 5:5?

    Lets let scripture interpret scripture. If you read a little further in psalm 5:10 david says “ Destroy thou them,oh God; let them fall by their own counsel; cast them out in the multitude of their transgressions; for they have rebelled against thee.

    Again, consistent with biblical doctrine, God desires salvation for all;but those who reject him, he can and does punish.
     
  14. prophecynut

    prophecynut
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    Ya did OK Brian, the elect are the recipients of God's love and his special grace that saves.

    Common grace is shown to God's creatures in general, even to his enemies.

    I like the three points of common grace given at this site:

    http://www.prca.org/articles/article_7.html
     
  15. philg

    philg
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    Who has not been guilty of these?
    1:10
    If we say that we have not sinned, we make him a liar, and his word is not in us. 1 John 1:10

    --------------------------------------------------------------------------------
     
  16. rc

    rc
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    If God is love by nature, is there any way God cannot love?

    Yes, but God is MORE than that also. You must make distinctions in the attributes of God in the context being dealt with. You can not make sweeping generalities about God with texts that are not proof texts. God is Holy also and kills men at a whim if He wishes, was that loving when He killed Nadab and Abihu? His love is in ACCORDANCE to all of His other attributes as well.
     
  17. prophecynut

    prophecynut
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    Mt. 10:288
    "Do not be afraid of those who kill the body but cannot kill the soul. Rather, be afraid of the One who can destroy both the soul and body in hell." NIV
     
  18. JohnB

    JohnB
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    RC,

    God kills on a whim? Do you think Nadab and Abihu were killed on a whim?

    A whim is defined as:

    1. A sudden or capricious idea; a fancy.
    2. Arbitrary thought or impulse: governed by whim.

    I am sure whim was not the word you meant to use, was it?
     
  19. All about Grace

    All about Grace
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    Are you saying "God is love" is a sweeping generalization? Are you saying "God is love" should not be used to prove God by His very nature loves?

    Of course God is holy, that does not diminish his love in any way.

    "God kills on a whim." Wow. Now there's a telling statement for you.

    If Calvinists of this stripe truly believe that God does not love everyone, I simply ask that they be consistent and tell their children and congregations that there is a strong possibility God hates them along with the majority of His creatures.

    Also admit that if you truly believe God does not love the majority of His creation, you must take one of the clearest passages of Scripture (Jn 3.16) and twist it to mean something different than what is evident from a simple reading of both the Greek and every major translation.
     
  20. johnp.

    johnp.
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    Hello All about Grace.
    You seem to have a notion that Calvinists believe few are saved. We have scripture to back us not opinion: REV 7:9 After this I looked and there before me was a great multitude that no one could count, from every nation, tribe, people and language, standing before the throne and in front of the Lamb. They were wearing white robes and were holding palm branches in their hands. 10 And they cried out in a loud voice: "Salvation belongs to our God, who sits on the throne, and to the Lamb." Uncountable by us. I don't understand why you say that we should tell our kids that God hates them though. Scripture again I'm afraid: PS 103:17 But from everlasting to everlasting the LORD's love is with those who fear him, and his righteousness with their children's children Which just goes to show that if I did as you said I would not be telling the truth would I?

    ..."He will rule them with an iron scepter." He treads the winepress of the fury of the wrath of God Almighty. Show me where the love of God is in Revelation 19:15.

    For God so loved the world that He cut Israel off to get it.

    john.
     

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