Whosoever believes.... A discussion.

Discussion in '2005 Archive' started by dianetavegia, Apr 15, 2005.

  1. dianetavegia

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    “He that believeth on me, as the scripture hath said, out of his belly shall flow rivers of living water.” John 7:38

    In Hebrew, the phrase springing water is “mayim chayeem”.

    Can we discuss 'whosoever believes'?

    James 2:19
    You believe that there is one God. You do well. Even the demons believe--and tremble!
     
  2. av1611jim

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    The difference seems to be between believing there IS a god and believing what God says.
    Believing what God says will elicit action on our part that is in compliance with His revealed will. Just believing there is a god does nothing for us.


    In HIS service;
    Jim
     
  3. blackbird

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    John 3:16 says, "For God so loved the world that He gave His only begotten Son, that whosoever believeth in Him should not perish but have everlasting life."

    "Whosoever"---means Whosoever

    "Believeth"---not just believing there is a God out there somewhere----but a total surrender, adhereing to, and reliance upon the person that was given---God's Son, Jesus Christ.

    "That if thou shalt confess with thy mouth the LORD Jesus and believe in thy heart that God hath raised Him from the dead, thou shalt be saved."

    Total surrender to

    Total reliance upon

    I am nothing---Jesus is everything!
     
  4. NateT

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    I think in contrast to the council of Trent, we would say that "beleiving in" (or on etc) also involves that we have some sort of assurance of our salvation. That is, not only do we believe that Jesus is the Christ (as the demons do) but we believe that he is our savior (because of the cross).
     
  5. jacob62

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    I was taught to believe the "gospel",but many christians could not tell me the meaning of it.I thought it was strange I was in a church that couldnt tell me the meaning of that word,but to believe it!
     
  6. chipsgirl

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    Jacob has a good point. We are often taught to believe just because that is the right thing to do. Without all the facts though, sometimes that can be hard to do.
    I think a big part of believing is understanding. It's also knowing (really knowing without a doubt) we are saved.
     
  7. gb93433

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    There is a difference between intellectual belief and acting upon it making it a saving genuine faith.
     
  8. chipsgirl

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    I am not saying we have to understand everything. We can't anyways, only God knows all. I just mean that it's hard to believe in something if you aren't told more of the story but instead just a few pieces. You can't tell someone to accept Jesus and have them do it if they don't really fully understand the meaning of it. They have to have some intellect in the matter.
     
  9. jacob62

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    Yes chipsgirl I agree.For years I heard of people spreading the "gospel" but never themselves(me included) knowing its true meaning.All I ever heard was "good news"or "the truth".Well getting an A in math class was good news to me !LOL
     
  10. chipsgirl

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    Exactly. There was so much stuff people just expected me to understand and believe because I grew up in church. If I can't tell you why I believe what I believe then what good is it? As I got older, I began doing my own research on the Bible to better understand.
     
  11. jacob62

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    I found that without a revelation from God,I could not understand anything through my own intellect.Thats why it floored me after 30 some years I found out the meaning of the gospel.
     
  12. chipsgirl

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    I'm almost 28 and it basically just made some sense to me a year ago. It was kind of like a light just came on. It does strengthen your belief when this happens.
     
  13. robycop3

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    First, I had to believe in God, THE God, which I'd done since childhood. Then, I had to believe JESUS is His Son, and that His Father Yahweh had given Him all authority over earth, which I'd believed...but not acted upon...since I was a teen. Then, I had to believe that each and every sin carries the death penalty, and that JESUS, THOUGH HIMSELF GOD, paid that penalty by His own suffering and death, that He rose from the dead forever, and that ONLY HE could forgive all my sins & save me from the second death, which is eternity in gehenna. When I really believed in Jesus as God and Savior, prayed for Him to forgive my sins by His grace(undeserved merit), I knew I was saved, and that I wanted to evangelize the world & was eager to be baptized to show the world that I now belonged to Jesus.

    My full belief in Him hit me like a tank at Dad's Thanxgiving table in 1979. For a little while, it was sadness over my 31 years of hedonistic lifestyle, which was replaced by an indescribable feeling of ecstasy and relief in knowing my future was assured, same as my parents' and wife's futures already were.

    I was saved by the GRACE OF CHRIST, and not by any works. I realized He had been knocking at the door of my heart for some time, and that I'd finally gotten up & let Him in before He'd changed His mind.
     
  14. dianetavegia

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    Great Explanation.

    Now here's a dilema. A woman I worked with a long time ago was a 'believer' but because of terminal cancer and her husband leaving her because he couldn't deal with her 'disfigurement', this woman decided she hated God and wanted to go to hell instead of being in heaven with a God who could do such an awful thing to her. (BTW, she committed suicide while her kids were at their Dad's on Christmas Day.)

    In this instance, I believe this woman must have not had 'heart knowledge'. Even in the worst of circumstances, a true believer would want to be with God after death.

    I believe Whosoever means anyone CAN be saved.
     
  15. jacob62

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    I believe your friend is in heaven.God knew her pain,and only God knows a persons heart.At her last moment I believe God searched her.Every knee shall bow and every tongue will confess Jesus is Lord.
     
  16. dianetavegia

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    2 Timothy 3:14 But continue thou in the things which thou hast learned and hast been assured of, knowing of whom thou hast learned them; 15 And that from a child thou hast known the holy scriptures, which are able to make thee wise unto salvation through faith which is in Christ Jesus. 16 All scripture is given by inspiration of God, and is profitable for doctrine, for reproof, for correction, for instruction in righteousness: 17 That the man of God may be perfect, throughly furnished unto all good works.

    I think this verse supports Whosoever being everyone. [​IMG]

    Jacob, I hope so but her anger and bitterness went on for years before her suicide. We worked side by side and could talk freely.... she cursed God and claimed hatred toward God. [​IMG]
     
  17. Watchman

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    Yes, I too feel that whosoever will come may come. Faith cometh by hearing, and hearing by the Word of God. He would have all men to be saved and come to the knowledge of the truth. God has no pleasure in the wicked that they perish. Jesus would, "but ye would not."

    As for your friend, I cannot be her judge, but I did respond to another one of your posts by alluding to what I feel in this regard: that the mouth will speak of the heart's condition. Bearing such "negative fruit" is not good indeed.
     
  18. untangled

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    Agree 100% with my brother in Christ, Jim. Amen and Amen. Believing there is a God is one thing and believing God for salvation through Jesus Christ the Savior of the world is another. Amen brother!
     
  19. Soulman

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    Posted by dianetavegia: this woman decided she hated God and wanted to go to hell instead of being in heaven with a God who could do such an awful thing to her. (BTW, she committed suicide while her kids were at their Dad's on Christmas Day.)

    I also believe she is in heaven. I lost a son and was angry with God for 7 years. His patience and mercy brought me back around. We must come to the realization that when calamity strikes it is not always God doing it.

    Also, If she ever was saved she cannot lose it. It's hard to just wait and see.
     
  20. HankD

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    A Second and somewhat related issue is that this passage states "as the scripture hath said, out of his belly shall flow rivers of living water.”

    Presumably "as the scripture hath said," means that this is an OT quote.

    If so, where in the OT are these exact words used?

    Or is it an allusion and if so, again of what OT Scripture?

    HankD
     

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