Why are christians judged according to their works?

Discussion in 'Other Christian Denominations' started by xdisciplex, Feb 20, 2007.

  1. xdisciplex

    xdisciplex
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    Gal 6:7 Be not deceived; God is not mocked: for whatsoever a man soweth, that shall he also reap.

    Rev 20:12 And I saw the dead, small and great, stand before God; and the books were opened: and another book was opened, which is the book of life: and the dead were judged out of those things which were written in the books, according to their works.

    2Co 5:10 For we must all appear before the judgment seat of Christ; that every one may receive the things done in his body, according to that he hath done, whether it be good or bad.

    I don't understand this. Does this mean that christians get a reward for a good work and a punishment for a bad work? What is a bad work? Does this mean sin? But I thought that God forgets our sin if we ask for forgiveness and now suddenly he still remembers it and punishes us for it? :tear:
    How can God even punish a christian? Does this mean that he'll somehow make those christian suffer in heaven?
     
  2. BobRyan

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    Romans 6 "The wages of sin is death -- not less heaven".

    Rev 20 the reward for bad deeds - is the lake of fire.

    Matt 7 the reward for bad fruit is no entry into the kingdom of heaven.

    Romans 2:13 the reward for rebellion against God's law is no justification.

    1 Peter 1:17
    17 If you address as Father the One who impartially judges according to each one's work, conduct yourselves in fear during the time of your stay on earth;
    18 knowing that you were not redeemed with perishable things like silver or gold from your futile way of life inherited from your forefathers,
    19 but with precious blood, as of a lamb unblemished and spotless, the blood of Christ.

    To "solve" the problem some people -
    #1. Ignore these texts - never read them from the pulpit or teach from them.
    #2. Invent the idea of "Soul LOST but spirit saved" a thread to that effect is on this sectn of the board
    #3. Pretend that these texts are "written to someone else besides Christians" The BAD Bible for Bad people.
    #4. Accept what it says and accept the fact that ALL scripture is still useful for doctrine 2Tim 3:16.
     
  3. billwald

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    Christians don't commit real sins, only virtual sins. <G> I the same way, Jewish theology has concluded that David didn't "really" sin with his girlfriend because if he had not diddled Bathsheba then Solomon would never had been born.
     
  4. Tazman

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    DUDE!!!!?????? WAH...THE... WHAT???????:BangHead:
     
  5. J. Jump

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    Tazman I was kind of wondering what Bill was really saying myself.

    xdisciplex yes Christians will be judged according to their works, because judgment starts with the house of God and works are the only thing that is left to be judged.

    Unfortunately the word reword has lost its true Scriptural meaning. When folks talk about rewards these days it is only in a positive sense. You will either be rewarded positively or you will lose what positive rewards you could have had.

    That's just not Scriptural. Reward means that you receive your due whether good or bad. Reward is positive and negative at least in the sense that we as humans see it.

    But even if you receive discipline at the JSOC it will be a positive thing, because God is a loving Father and His discipline is out of love for us.

    I will PM you some study material that will help you in this study.
     
  6. Rufus_1611

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    David did this...

    4 And David sent messengers, and took her; and she came in unto him, and he lay with her;...​

    There is no mention of "diddling". Your use of this word is crude and I pray your use of it was unintended. Further, David did sin and I don't know where you get this "Jewish theology" idea that he didn't. Finally, the child bore of Bathseba in that sin was cursed and died, the child bore of Bathsheba in marriage was Solomon and he was blessed.


    [Edit: Removed claim of inaccuracy as one use of the term could be accurate.]
     
    #6 Rufus_1611, Feb 20, 2007
    Last edited by a moderator: Feb 20, 2007
  7. Amy.G

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    :laugh: :laugh: :laugh:
    ditto.
     
  8. DHK

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    "only virtual sins"
    That sounds like "in cyberspace" ?? Just wondering on the terminology used.
     
  9. xdisciplex

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  10. Brother Bob

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    Maybe that is why everyone uses David to justify adultery. He only ****** :rolleyes: :rolleyes: edit (removed word for it was correct by some)
     
    #10 Brother Bob, Feb 20, 2007
    Last edited by a moderator: Feb 20, 2007
  11. DHK

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    At the Judgment Seat of Christ described in 1Cor.3:11-15, (for believers only) it describes how we will be judged each one according to our works. But the idea there is one of reward, not punishment. We will be rewarded according to our works. There is no punishment meted out, only a loss of reward.

    1 Corinthians 3:13 Every man's work shall be made manifest: for the day shall declare it, because it shall be revealed by fire; and the fire shall try every man's work of what sort it is.
    --Your works shall be revealed. What kind of works for Christ have you done?

    1 Corinthians 3:15 If any man's work shall be burned, he shall suffer loss: but he himself shall be saved; yet so as by fire.
    --Your works will symbolically pass through fire. It will either be purified or burned up. Notice you will not suffer a loss of salvation. You will not lose your salvation. You will suffer loss. The loss that you will suffer is simply a loss of reward that you would have gotten had you been more faithful in your service for him.
     
    #11 DHK, Feb 20, 2007
    Last edited by a moderator: Feb 20, 2007
  12. DQuixote

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    Amen. DHK has answered this as clearly as it can be answered. Use it for guidance in evaluating some of the other posts.
     
  13. xdisciplex

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    @ DHK

    But what about this verse here?

    2Co 5:10 For we must all appear before the judgment seat of Christ; that every one may receive the things done in his body, according to that he hath done, whether it be good or bad.

    If it was only about rewards for good things then why does it say "good or bad"?
    What is a reward for a bad deed? A punishment? :confused:

    And what I also ask myself is wether all good deeds count or wether a good deed only counts if God made you do it. For example if I think that it's a good idea to send somebody a gospel tract then how do I know if it was only my idea or if God made me do it? If it was only my own idea then maybe it doesn't even count because it was only a work of the flesh?
     
  14. DQuixote

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    Each deed is weighed in the balance. Is it good, or is it bad? What was the purpose and intent of the deed? Was it done out of a genuine desire to follow Christ, to identify with him as the giver? If you open a food pantry with the intent to feed the poor, do you pocket the contributions from donors and eat the food yourself? You hang a big sign on your building. FOOD FOR THE POOR. Under the sign you have the Christian Cross, and the words "Do unto others as you would have them do unto you." But very little food is actually delivered. Suddenly, you live in a much bigger, nicer home, drive a new car, and wear only the best clothes. Hmmmmm..............

    Your deeds will be weighed in the balance. In the above scenario, rewards will vanish right before your eyes.

    To answer the rest of your question: I think you need to avoid creating muddy situations and then wrestling with a conclusion on your own. Much better to look to the bible.
     
  15. xdisciplex

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    Hmmmm...
    but the passage where Jesus divides the 2 groups and says to the one group "you fed me, when I was hungry..." sounds like it's all about charity and those which donated money and helped others will be saved while those which didn't will go to hell. I think that this passage is confusing. Many people use it to demonstrate that the religion doesn't matter as long as you help others.
    Why does Jesus not explain that this passage is about christians and non-christians?
    And what about a christian who didn't feed the poor? Which group does he belong to?
     
  16. J. Jump

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    xdisciplex as I think I pointed out in my previous post modern-day Christendom thinks rewards is only a positive thing. As you have correctly stated we will be rewarded whether good or bad. Reward is not just a positive thing at least in humans eyes. We will also be disciplined if need be, and unfortunately we look at discipline as a negative, but really it's positive.

    The Bible tells us that God will not be mocked for what a man sows he will reap. If he sows to the Spirit he will reap life, but if he sows to the flesh he will reap corruption.

    Christendom can try as hard as they might to destroy God's word, but Scripture says what Scripture says, and we can either believe it and adjust our lives accordingly or we can snooze and act like slothful servants and we can have a tremendous shock when we stand before the Judge on that day.

    You are to be praised for seeing Scripture for what it says!

    Wish I had more time, but I've got to go pick up my son and take him to his birthday party - he turned four today :) How time flies!
     
  17. DHK

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    There are several judgements mentioned in the Bible, and sometimes it is easy to get some of them confused. Notice that you are quoting a parable here. It is the judgment of the sheep and the goats, otherwise known as the judgement of the nations. If you read the context of the chapter in which you quoted it from you see that it takes place in the end times. It will take place immediately after the Tribulation and just before or at the beginning of the Millennial Kingdom. "The brethren" that Jesus refers to are the Jewish nation." He is dividing those nations who have been friendly to the Jews and supported them, as opposed to those who have been against the Jews and have been their enemy.
    This judgement has nothing to do with us.
     
  18. xdisciplex

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    I have heard sermons about this passage before but I have never heard that this judgement takes place after the tribulation and that it's about how the different nations behaved towards the jews. :confused:
    Somehow everybody has a different opinion about those passages.

    @ J.Jump

    Have fun at the party. :)
     
  19. D28guy

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    If you mean when we stand before the "Bema" seat of judgment...as opossed to the Great White Throne judgment seat, wich christians have no part of...we will be judged and will recieve either rewards or loss of rewards.

    It has nothing to do with heaven or hell. The born again person has been permanently "sealed into the body of Christ" for the "day of redemption" and is completly secure.

    Grace and peace,

    Mike
     
  20. xdisciplex

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    Does this mean that for a good deed you get a reward and for a bad deed you might actually lose a reward which you already got for a good deed? Because otherwise the bad deeds wouldn't even "count". Let's say you have 10 good deeds and 200 bad deeds then you would get 10 rewards and the 200 bad deeds wouldn't even count at all. But if they count then this would mean that the 200 bad deeds negatively affect your 10 rewards.
     

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