Why Believe One can Lose Salvation??

Discussion in 'Other Christian Denominations' started by Tazman, Jan 24, 2006.

  1. Tazman

    Tazman
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    What are the Pro's and or Con's to believing one can lose their salvation for the reader of the bible?


    No fights here, just thoughts


    Grace and Peace
     
  2. eloidalmanutha

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    1 Tim 4:1 But the Spirit expressly says that in latter times some will depart from the faith, cleaving to deceiving spirits and teachings of demons,
    2 in lying speakers in hypocrisy, being seared in their own conscience,

    2 Tim 3:13 But evil men and pretenders will go forward to worse, leading astray and being led
    astray.

    2 Peter 3:17 Therefore, beloved, knowing beforehand, beware lest being led away with the error of the lawless, you fall from your own steadfastness.
    18 But grow in grace and in knowledge of our Lord and Savior Jesus Christ. To Him be the glory, both now and to the day of eternity. Amen.

    1Ti 1:19 Holding faith, and a good conscience; which some having put away concerning faith have made shipwreck:

    Luk 8:13 They on the rock [are they], which, when they hear, receive the word with joy; and these have no root, which for a while believe, and in time of temptation fall away.

    Heb 6:4 For it is impossible for those once having been enlightened, and having tasted of the heavenly gift, and becoming sharers of the Holy Spirit,
    5 and tasting the good Word of God, and the works of power of a coming age,
    6 and having fallen away, it is impossible for them again to renew to repentance, crucifying again for themselves the Son of God, and putting Him to open shame.

    Rev 22:19 And if any man shall take away from the words of the book of this prophecy, God shall take away his part out of the book of life, and out of the holy city, and [from] the things which are written in this book.

    2 Thessalonians 2
    1 ¶ And, brothers, we entreat you, by the coming of our Lord Jesus Christ, and of our gathering together to Him,
    2 for you not to be quickly shaken in the mind, nor to be disturbed, neither through a spirit, nor through speech, nor through letter, as through us, as if the Day of Christ has come.
    3 ¶ Do not let anyone deceive you in any way, because that Day will not come unless first comes the falling away, and the man of sin is revealed, the son of perdition,
     
  3. drfuss

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    The term "lose their salvation" has caused misunderatandings amoung many christians. Many christians believe they can forfiet their salvation by making a decision to stop trusting Christ alone for salvation. These christian know they are saved as long as they continue to trust Christ. "Losing your salvation" implies that salvation is lost without the christian realizing it.

    I have heard Calvinistic preachers say those who do not believe in their version of eternal security, do not know if they are saved or not, i.e. saved this week, not saved the next, saved the nest week, etc. This is a good preaching technique since no one will stand up and state that it is not true. This is not to say the preacher is lying; he has heard it for so long that he believes it.

    Most Calvinists believe that you must be trusting in Christ when you die to go to heaven. So do many Non-Calvinists. In both cases, works and performance have nothing to do with it. The issue is if a person trusts Christ as Savior, and then decides to stop trusting Christ, was he really a christian in the first place. Calvinist say he was not christian; Non-Calvinists say he was a christian. For practical purposes, the difference is only a play on words.
     
  4. Alcott

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    Con: If a reader of the Bible thinks he has lost his salvation, he would believe he has lost his enlightenment, and much more than that; therefore he can never regain it (Hebrews 6). If that event is believed to have happened, then hope is lost and he will have given up.

    Pro: If there is no way to lose one's salvation, then one cannot lose it by believing he can lose it. If believing he can lose it is what keeps him "in line," then there is no logical reason to not believe such.
     
  5. steaver

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    I don't see this as a "pro". If I believe I can lose my salvation then I will waste my time concentrating on myself rather than on Jesus and others. Understanding OSAS has freed me to focus on serving Jesus Christ out of love rather than out of necessity "for me".

    There are no pros for believing you can lose your salvation. It is a spirit of the deceiver in an effort to make God's rebirth meaningless. I would not believe in OSAS if it wasn't for the regeneration. This is something God performs ALONE. If it could be undone by me, I would be greater than God!

    God Bless!
     
  6. Linda64

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    Romans 8:35 Who shall separate us from the love of Christ? shall tribulation, or distress, or persecution, or famine, or nakedness, or peril, or sword?
    Romans 8:36 As it is written, For thy sake we are killed all the day long; we are accounted as sheep for the slaughter.
    Romans 8:37 Nay, in all these things we are more than conquerors through him that loved us.
    Romans 8:38 For I am persuaded, that neither death, nor life, nor angels, nor principalities, nor powers, nor things present, nor things to come,
    Romans 8:39 Nor height, nor depth, nor any other creature, shall be able to separate us from the love of God, which is in Christ Jesus our Lord.

    That's an interesting question--the name of this thread "Why Believe One Can Lose Salvation??" If one wants to believe that they can lose salvation, it will keep them pre-occupied in "works" instead of "grace". Remember, Jesus does the "keeping"--not us.
     
  7. Clean1

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    If you could lose your salvation then God's promise of 'eternal life' would be a lie. The Bible teaches in 1John 5:13,"These things have I written unto you that believe on the name of the Son of God; that ye may know that ye have eternal life, and that ye may believe on the name of the Son of God." If you lost your salvation then you would have to work to get it back right? And if we had to work to get our salvation then salvation would be a wage not a gift. You don't earn a gift, you receive a gift. If we had to earn our salvation then why did Jesus Christ have to give His life on the cross? Look at Ephesians 2:8-9, "For by grace are ye saved through faith; and that not of yourselves: it is the gift of God: Not of works, lest any man should boast."
     
  8. Tazman

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    Thank you Alcot for actually answering my question the way it was asked.

    For the rest:

    I don't wish to argue on this thread. Many gave statements of why they don't believe in it, but have not specifically answered Pro's and Con's not rather its true or not.

    Grace and Peace
     
  9. Tazman

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    Maybe I can help those stuck on one way of thinking:

    Example:

    OSAS

    Pro - Can enamble a person from an Ideal aspect to feel free to approach God.

    Con - Can creat apathy of the heart when reading warnings in the bible.

    See. It can be done. I don't agree with OSAS at least the way it's taught by some of the posters above, but I can see a potential in it for good.
     
  10. Clean1

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    I'm not trying to argue. i just wanted to give out some ammunition to anyone who wants to use it against people who are being led in the wrong direction such as: believing good works can get you into heaven and losing your salvation. sorry if i made it sound like an argument.
     
  11. steaver

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    Here ye go,

    OSAS

    Pro, You are believing the Word of Truth. You focus on loving Jesus and others rather than self.

    Con,

    Haven't found one yet.

    God Bless!
     
  12. Tazman

    Tazman
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    Rev 3:

    1 "To the angel[a] of the church in Sardis write:
    These are the words of him who holds the seven spiritsof God and the seven stars. I know your deeds; you have a reputation of being alive, but you are dead. 2 Wake up! Strengthen what remains and is about to die, for I have not found your deeds complete in the sight of my God. 3 Remember, therefore, what you have received and heard; obey it, and repent. But if you do not wake up, I will come like a thief, and you will not know at what time I will come to you. 4 Yet you have a few people in Sardis who have not soiled their clothes. They will walk with me, dressed in white, for they are worthy. 5 He who overcomes will, like them, be dressed in white. I will never blot out his name from the book of life, but will acknowledge his name before my Father and his angels. 6 He who has an ear, let him hear what the Spirit says to the churches.
     
  13. steaver

    steaver
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    I was reading Rev 7:14

    ...And I said unto him, Sir, thou knowest. And he said to me, These are they which came out of great tribulation, and have washed their robes, and made them white by their good deeds and works.

    Is that right? Or did I misunderstand something?
     
  14. Tazman

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    Rev3

    5 He who overcomes will, like them, be dressed in white. I will never blot out his name from the book of life, but will acknowledge his name before my Father and his angels. 6 He who has an ear, let him hear what the Spirit says to the churches.
     
  15. steaver

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    1 John 5

    For whatsoever is born of God overcometh the world: and this is the victory that overcometh the world, even our faith. Who is he that overcometh the world, but he that believeth that Jesus is the Son of God?
     
  16. steaver

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    Or is it...

    For whatsoever does good works overcometh the world: and this is the victory that overcometh the world, even our good works. Who is he that overcometh the world, but he that does good works for the Son of God?
     
  17. Tazman

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    1 John 5 is in direct Son-light of Rev 3

    I know your deeds; you have a reputation of being alive, but you are dead. 2 Wake up! Strengthen what remains and is about to die, for I have not found your deeds complete in the sight of my God. 3 Remember, therefore, what you have received and heard; obey it, and repent.

    Harmony, yep that's the ticket [​IMG]

    Grace and peace
     
  18. Tazman

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    "Overcome the World" "Born of God" absolutly!

    Those born of God will continue to serve and obey him. This is if you accept the full definition of someone "Born again". It NEVER lacks a continued connection and obedience to Christ. Never! [​IMG]
     
  19. steaver

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    Are you declaring that you are born-again and have NEVER disobeyed Christ since?

    God Bless!
     
  20. nate

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    It seems you can certainly "lose" your salvation

    "4For it is impossible to keep on restoring to repentance time and again people who have once been enlightened, who have tasted the heavenly gift, who have become sharers of the Holy Spirit, 5 who have tasted the goodness of God's word and the powers of the coming age,6 and who have fallen away, as long as they continue to crucify to themselves the Son of God and to expose him to public ridicule." Hebrews 6:4-6 ISV

    A con of believing in OSAS is often the fact that people just stop living for God they don't witness, they don't work at church, they just become pew warmers of which America today has many. The fact is OSAS produces lazy Christians.

    A con of believing you can "lose" your salvation is the fact it causes many to doubt.
     

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