Why Protestants and Roman Catholics are unbaptized and thus unsaved....

Discussion in 'Other Christian Denominations' started by Jacob Dahlen, May 6, 2006.

  1. Jacob Dahlen

    Jacob Dahlen
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    Roman Catholics sprinkle and Protestants use only a single immersion and most Protestants don't have priests:

    Baptism and Chrismation

    Baptism. (Gr. "immersion into water for purification)". A sacrament instituted by Christ Himself, this is the regeneration "of water and the spirit" (John 3:5). An Orthodox baptism is administered by the priest (in case of absolute emergency, however, by a layman (aerobaptismos)) through three complete immersions and by pronouncing the individual's name along with the name of the Trinity, "the Father and the Son and the Holy Spirit. Amen" Chrismation follows immediately after baptism.

    Baptismal Font. (see kolymbethra).

    Baptismal Garments. (Gr. Fotikia or baptisika; Sl. krizhma). The garments brought by the godparent to dress the infant immediately after the immersion in Baptism. In Orthodoxy, these garments are considered sacred and must be either kept safely or destroyed by fire.

    Baptismal Name. (Gr. onoma). The individual's name given in baptism, commonly the name of a saint, who becomes the individual's Patron Saint. The baptismal names of the first-born are usually those of their grandparents.

    Baptistry. A special room or area in the form a pool for baptizing in the ancient Church. Gradually it was replaced by the baptismal font (see kolymbethra).

    Kolymbethra. A large, often movable, circular basin on a stand, containing the water for immersion in Baptism. It symbolizes the Jordan River or the pool of Siloam.
    [non-Baptist links removed]

    [ May 06, 2006, 08:42 PM: Message edited by: DHK ]
     
  2. JFox1

    JFox1
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    I'm a Lutheran, so I guess I'm going to have a very hot time in the afterlife. I can't tell you the number of people who think I'm going to hell because I don't believe exactly as they do, each using their own scriptures and/or traditions to "prove" I'm not really saved. Here are two examples:

    In 2004 on one of the AOL message boards, a Muslim guy told me that I was going to be "brought forth on the Day of Judgment for all of your mischief and crimes and for all of the pain you caused humanity, and most of all for denying the communications of you Lord." The last sentence was a reference to the Qur'an. He was upset because I criticized his call for the destruction of Israel.

    In 2006, a certain Seventh-Day Adventist said that since I don't believe in Seventh-Day Adventist teachings, I believe the devil's lie and I will share the devil's fate.

    So if you think I'm going to hell, you will just have to get in line. Many people on the Internet think I'm not going to Heaven, mostly because I don't believe exactly as they do.

    :rolleyes:
     
  3. xdisciplex

    xdisciplex
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    Oh boy.... talking about dogmatic.
     
  4. Chemnitz

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    I think it is kind of funny to see the foot on the other foot. For once, the Baptists and other prot immersers are finding out they were not properly baptized.
     
  5. StefanM

    StefanM
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    I sense a ban coming.
     
  6. JFox1

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  7. Claudia_T

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    I dont recall reading in the bible that you have to be dipped three times in the baptismal waters.
     
  8. DHK

    DHK
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    Baptists (and many Protestants) go by the Bible (as their final authority in all matters of faith and doctrine), and thus immerse after one has put their faith in Christ for salvation. The RCC sprinkle infants contrary to Biblical teaching. The Bible teaches about pastors, elders, overseers: different names or descriptions for the same office. The word priest is used in the New Testament only as it describes the postion of every believer before God. Thus the RCC's definition of priest is wrong and unbiblical.

    There is no such thing as a sacrament. Neither the word nor the concept are found in the Bible. A sacrament is a means of grace. Baptism simply gets you wet. There is no grace involved in baptism. It doesn't make you more holy. There is no magic in the water. There is no grace imparted. Baptism simply gets you wet. It is symbolic of what takes at salvation and thus is done after salvation, not as an infant before salvation. It is impossible for water to regenerate anyone.
    As for John 3:5; there is no baptism in that verse. The word water is mentioned but not baptism. In fact baptism is not mentioned in the entire chapter of John 3. To force the word baptism in John 3:5 is to do injustice to the Biblical discipline of hermeneutics. Eisigesis doesn't work. One needs to carefully expound the Scriptures, comparing Scriptures with Scriptures. One is not saved by water or by baptism. Nowhere does the Bible teach that.
    Did you want a medal?
    Clergy and laity? There is no division in the Bible. The so-called words you are inserting I don't find in the Bible. A priest is every believer. The only priesthood in the Bible is the priesthood of every believer (1Pet.2:5,9). There is no need or example in the Bible of a trine immersion. Every person baptized in the Bible was dunked only one time--not three times--one for each person of the trinity.
    You won't find a baptismal font in the Bible--the main reason of course is that the baptismal mode was that of immersion--complete immersion of an adult. Jesus baptized where there was much water. The Ethiopian eunuch said: "Here is water, what doth hinder me from being baptized." Sprinkling would not have required a rich man from finding a body of water. He could have used his canteen to aprinkle.
    Too bad you don't find any such ceremony in the Bible. The entire concept of infant baptism is not only foreign to the Bible, but is absolutely unbiblical, and in fact--heresy.
    The only saints in the Bible are every believer that has trusted Christ as their Saviour. All believers are saints, just as much as Peter or Paul. I also am a saint. The Bible doesn't use the word Patron. The concept of baptismal names is also foreign to the Bible. Your baptismal practices are all man-made and unscriptural.
    You are wrong. The ancient church did not have a special room. They had a river. Churches never came into existence until about 300 A.D. You find in Acts 12 that the church met in John Mark's mother's house, as they prayed for Peter. They met in houses, fields, cemetaries, wherever they could. They had no buildings of their own.
    Where? When?
    Certainly not in the Bible. And there is no Biblical precedent for it. This is a good example of Tradition superceding the Bible; an example where sola scriptura is ignored, and thus unscriptural tradition, and even heresy has been brought in.
    DHK
     
  9. Rachel

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    Why Protestants and Roman Catholics are unbaptized and thus unsaved....

    :confused: You're going by water baptism, sprinkling/immersion on how to tell if someone is saved?

    And what about the thief on the cross next to Jesus that didn't get baptized by water?

    Luke 23
    33When they came to the place called The Skull, there they crucified Him and the criminals, one on the right and the other on the left. 34But Jesus was saying, “Father, forgive them; for they do not know what they are doing.” And they cast lots, dividing up His garments among themselves. 35And the people stood by, looking on. And even the rulers were sneering at Him, saying, “He saved others; let Him save Himself if this is the Christ of God, His Chosen One.” 36The soldiers also mocked Him, coming up to Him, offering Him sour wine, 37and saying, “If You are the King of the Jews, save Yourself!” 38Now there was also an inscription above Him, “THIS IS THE KING OF THE JEWS.”

    39One of the criminals who were hanged there was hurling abuse at Him, saying, “Are You not the Christ? Save Yourself and us!” 40But the other answered, and rebuking him said, “Do you not even fear God, since you are under the same sentence of condemnation? 41“And we indeed are suffering justly, for we are receiving what we deserve for our deeds; but this man has done nothing wrong.”
    42And he was saying, “Jesus, remember me when You come in Your kingdom!” 43And He said to him, “Truly I say to you, today you shall be with Me in Paradise.”
     
  10. Claudia_T

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    Babies dont have any awareness of anything and they cant accept Jesus. Babies can be dedicated to God but baptism wont do them any good.


    Claudia
     
  11. JFox1

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    Tell me, Jacob Dahlen, Adolf Hitler was baptized as a baby, does that mean he's saved? In his case, all it did was get him wet.
     
  12. JackRUS

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  13. mcneely

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    Jacob,

    I hate to be harsh, but you have posted some of the most rediculous things I have ever read. Most of your "theories" can be destroyed by using common sense. In this case, you're basing how someone is born again by using some archaic ritual where everyone wears the right clothes, and uses the right amount of water. I think you stated in one of your other topics that you have read the Bible several times. That is OBVIOUSLY a lie, or you simply made no effort to absorb what you read.

    ---Justin
     
  14. BobRyan

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    The OP presents views from "tradition" but no scripture at all.

    Those who claim that scripture is not sufficient and tradition is the only thing that "can be read" by the common folk - "should" be tickled pink with the OP!
     
  15. JackRUS

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    Forget about Jacob. He is a spammer with no intention of ever debating on his posts. At least he hasn't yet.
     

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