Women in charge???

Discussion in 'Free-For-All Archives' started by tamborine lady, Sep 17, 2004.

  1. tamborine lady

    tamborine lady
    Expand Collapse
    Active Member

    Joined:
    Oct 22, 2003
    Messages:
    1,486
    Likes Received:
    0
    [​IMG]

    In checking out the scripture, I came across this one:

    1 Tim 5-14-I will therefore that the younger women marry, bear children, guide the house, give none occasion to the adversary to speak reproachfully.

    In checking the Strongs Concordance for meaning of the word guide, this is what it means:

    from 3617; to be the head of (i.e. rule) a family:--guide the house.

    Does this mean that women are actually allowed to RULE something??

    Tam
     
  2. Debby in Philly

    Debby in Philly
    Expand Collapse
    New Member

    Joined:
    Oct 31, 2003
    Messages:
    2,537
    Likes Received:
    0
    Like be in charge of the servants, her household staff. The business of running a home.
     
  3. GrannyGumbo

    GrannyGumbo
    Expand Collapse
    <img src ="/Granny.gif">

    Joined:
    Apr 15, 2002
    Messages:
    11,414
    Likes Received:
    0
    I never had servants or staff, but the other things pertaining to our home was MY domain, heh-heh. I loved being over all that...making the menus, doing the shopping/cooking, the cleaning, the decorating, the sewing, the ironing, the raising of the children, etc. I LOVE being a girl/wife/mama. But in all these things, especially the ones that required decision-making, my mister had the final say and God led the way.

    Each day begins and ends with prayer and the devil knows he is never welcomed in my house.
     
  4. dianetavegia

    dianetavegia
    Expand Collapse
    Guest

    I think we should not take this verse out of context either.

    1 Timothy 5:11 But refuse the younger widows; for when they have begun to grow wanton against Christ, they desire to marry, 12 having condemnation because they have cast off their first faith. 13 And besides they learn to be idle, wandering about from house to house, and not only idle but also gossips and busybodies, saying things which they ought not. 14 Therefore I desire that the younger widows marry, bear children, manage the house, give no opportunity to the adversary to speak reproachfully. 15 For some have already turned aside after Satan. 16 If any believing man or woman has widows, let them relieve them, and do not let the church be burdened, that it may relieve those who are really widows.

    ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
    See teknogonia in Titus 2:15. Rule the household (oikodespotein). Late verb from oikodespoth├č (Mark 14:14), twice in the papyri, only here in N.T. Note that the wife is here put as ruler of the household, proper recognition of her influence, "new and improved position" (Liddon)
    ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
    Titus 2:1 But as for you, speak the things which are proper for sound doctrine: 2 that the older men be sober, reverent, temperate, sound in faith, in love, in patience; 3 the older women likewise, that they be reverent in behavior, not slanderers, not given to much wine, teachers of good things-- 4 that they admonish the young women to love their husbands, to love their children, 5 to be discreet, chaste, homemakers, good, obedient to their own husbands, that the word of God may not be blasphemed.

    It amazes me that the older women are exhorted (To urge by strong, often stirring argument, admonition, advice, or appeal: exhorted the troops to hold the line. To make urgent appeal.) to love their husbands and children! It also speaks so strongly to me that we are commanded to do so to keep the word of God from being blasphemed!
     
  5. tamborine lady

    tamborine lady
    Expand Collapse
    Active Member

    Joined:
    Oct 22, 2003
    Messages:
    1,486
    Likes Received:
    0
    [​IMG]

    The woman in Proverbs 31 is pretty busy too. Seems like she is running things too.

    Tam
     
  6. tamborine lady

    tamborine lady
    Expand Collapse
    Active Member

    Joined:
    Oct 22, 2003
    Messages:
    1,486
    Likes Received:
    0
  7. SpiritualMadMan

    SpiritualMadMan
    Expand Collapse
    New Member

    Joined:
    Nov 10, 2003
    Messages:
    2,734
    Likes Received:
    0
    Tam,

    You are right...

    In CHRIST there is niether Jew nor Gentile, Bond, or Free or Male or female...

    However, for the sake of 'Propriety' and 'Good Order and Discipline'...

    God has ordained a 'Chain of Command' that places 'man' in *positional* authority.

    Now, having said that, and speaking as a Man, Christ did not *ask* the church to submit to His Authority until He had Proven His Love for the Church and given Himself for Her....

    Even now, after proving His right to do so, Christ does not demand His Rights or force His will on His Bride...

    Should I as a man not also follow that example? And, lead by love and example?

    Further, if it was improper for an elder to 'Lord it over' God's Flock...

    Doesn't it also follow that it would be improper to 'Lord it over' one's own household?

    The woman of Proverbs 31 had enough autonomy and financial self-reliance to go out and buy a field...

    How much liberty and encouragemewnt do we as 'Christian Husbands' in a 'liberated society' give our own wives???

    It *is* something to think about...

    Lastly, that God gave us 'positional authority' does not mean it is due to 'merit' but due to God's Sovreign Choice...

    (One might also want to consider Paul's discourse on natural and wild Olive Branches?)

    It might have been because as first created man was not as 'completed' as woman. (Second Revision?) And, to assauge man's ego God gave him positional authority to make up for a womans emotional depth and responsiveness towards her creator...
     
  8. tragic_pizza

    tragic_pizza
    Expand Collapse
    Banned

    Joined:
    Oct 30, 2001
    Messages:
    3,395
    Likes Received:
    0
    Taking the argument to its logical conclusion, of course, means that we should worship on Saturday, etc.
     
  9. SpiritualMadMan

    SpiritualMadMan
    Expand Collapse
    New Member

    Joined:
    Nov 10, 2003
    Messages:
    2,734
    Likes Received:
    0
    Hey... *IF* people'll meet to *really* worship Jesus I'll meet with them any day they choose... [​IMG]

    What is a "Tragic_Pizza"?

    One with anchovies? :D
     
  10. tragic_pizza

    tragic_pizza
    Expand Collapse
    Banned

    Joined:
    Oct 30, 2001
    Messages:
    3,395
    Likes Received:
    0
    The point is that, in disallowing women to participate actively in church leadership, you're taking a single passage in the New Testament quite out of its context, and ignoring the many times Paul saluted women in various cities as instrumental in the operation of that city's church, in particular Junia, mentioned by Paul in Romans 16:7.

    And "tragic_pizza" is a world-famous/infamous screen name comprised of two words that sound interesting together.
     
  11. MTA

    MTA
    Expand Collapse
    New Member

    Joined:
    Jun 11, 2004
    Messages:
    216
    Likes Received:
    0
    I find that the context has been preserved exactly. God never instructs us to serve outside of our capacity to do so. By that I mean that we are to serve as He has equipped us to serve in our roles as men and as women.

    God has used many women: the Samaritan woman, Rahab, Ruth, Lydia, Priscilla, Mary, etc., but he never crossed gender lines in how their service was rendered and they didn't either. They were never doing work in a man's capacity and likewise the men in the Bible are never found working in a woman's capacity. God does not violate the social order He established in the beginning.
     
  12. music4Him

    music4Him
    Expand Collapse
    New Member

    Joined:
    Feb 7, 2004
    Messages:
    3,333
    Likes Received:
    0
    --------------------------------------------------
    God has used many women: the Samaritan woman, Rahab, Ruth, Lydia, Priscilla, Mary, etc., but he never crossed gender lines in how their service was rendered and they didn't either. They were never doing work in a man's capacity and likewise the men in the Bible are never found working in a woman's capacity. God does not violate the social order He established in the beginning.
    --------------------------------------------------

    What about Debora the prophetess? Barak asked her questions didn't he? To fight or not to fight... [​IMG]

    music4Him

    ~\o/~ waves to Tam! I'm back ya'll..
     
  13. Terry_Herrington

    Terry_Herrington
    Expand Collapse
    Banned

    Joined:
    Jul 26, 2002
    Messages:
    4,455
    Likes Received:
    1
    Very well put!
     
  14. tamborine lady

    tamborine lady
    Expand Collapse
    Active Member

    Joined:
    Oct 22, 2003
    Messages:
    1,486
    Likes Received:
    0
    [​IMG]

    MTA said:

    God has used many women: the Samaritan woman, Rahab, Ruth, Lydia, Priscilla, Mary, etc., but he never crossed gender lines in how their service was rendered and they didn't either. They were never doing work in a man's capacity and likewise the men in the Bible are never found working in a woman's capacity. God does not violate the social order He established in the beginning.
    ---------------------------
    Soooo,---I guess you're against women doing jobs that are normally done by men, such as electrician, plumber, construction worker,etc??

    Tam
     
  15. Terry_Herrington

    Terry_Herrington
    Expand Collapse
    Banned

    Joined:
    Jul 26, 2002
    Messages:
    4,455
    Likes Received:
    1
    Under most situations, yes.
     
  16. Gina B

    Gina B
    Expand Collapse
    Active Member

    Joined:
    Dec 30, 2000
    Messages:
    16,944
    Likes Received:
    1
    No reason to disagree with Terry. I'm perfectly content to let men be the ones to unplug toilets and risk getting electrocuted. [​IMG]
    Gina
     
  17. music4Him

    music4Him
    Expand Collapse
    New Member

    Joined:
    Feb 7, 2004
    Messages:
    3,333
    Likes Received:
    0
    What about women fire fighters? Would that be too manley a job for a little old lady with two granbabys? :eek: Or what about a lady who builds a house to live in......would that be a "woman" no no?
    (*warning this is just an question be nice!)... Could it be that some just want to say what a woman can do, especially when whatever she might be doing shows some others up in areas where they lack? :confused:


    [​IMG]
    Music4Him
     
  18. Debby in Philly

    Debby in Philly
    Expand Collapse
    New Member

    Joined:
    Oct 31, 2003
    Messages:
    2,537
    Likes Received:
    0
    Deborah the Judge had authority to settle disputes for all of Israel. Pretty high position. Barak? He was a wimp. Couldn't make up his mind, and then refused to go to battle unless she accompanied him. And who sang the song afterwards? Deborah.

    And speaking of that story, what about Jael and her tent stake? Any ladies you know who would be willing to do that?
     
  19. music4Him

    music4Him
    Expand Collapse
    New Member

    Joined:
    Feb 7, 2004
    Messages:
    3,333
    Likes Received:
    0
    [​IMG] Debbie,
     
  20. Terry_Herrington

    Terry_Herrington
    Expand Collapse
    Banned

    Joined:
    Jul 26, 2002
    Messages:
    4,455
    Likes Received:
    1
    Yes, Barak was a "wimp." But, God wanted a man to do this and not a woman. Even Deborah did not want to lead, she was forced to do so because the man would not.

    Many times in churches today godly women are forced to do things they should not do simply because there is not a man who is willing to step up to the plate.
     

Share This Page

Loading...