WOMEN PREACHERS

Discussion in 'General Baptist Discussions' started by Brother James, Mar 9, 2006.

  1. Brother James

    Brother James
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    I know this is a touchy subject but I'd like to have someone here give me some authorization from the Bible for the ordination of women into the ministry. Let's try and be civil children. ;)
     
  2. exscentric

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    Okay, here we go.


    :D
     
  3. blackbird

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    Brother James----I can be civil but I can't give you reference to women preachers. There's no room for women behind the pulpit!!
     
  4. Plain Old Bill

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    I don't find any place for women prachers in the Bible. You may have better luck down in the other denominations board.
     
  5. Bro. Curtis

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    I am of the opinion that scripture bans women from pastoring, and the way I interpret the verses, there is no wiggle room.
     
  6. Rhetorician

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    Bro. James,

    When I was at Mid America Seminary one of my professors, who happened to be British, summed it up rather well I thought.

    He said something to the effect that;

    Women preachers were like dancing dogs;

    At first you were suprised they could do it!

    Then, you wanted to ask, why would anyone WANT to do it?! [​IMG]

    sdg!

    rd
     
  7. Debby in Philly

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    Taking that as a given, and also taking the thought that God does and says things for a good reason or purpose, what is that good reason or purpose? Going beyond "Because He says so."
     
  8. Joshua Rhodes

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    Specifically, are we referring to women speakers as well, or women pastors? I know of many godly women whom I've heard speak and expound on Scripture in a teaching atmosphere, but that would not pastor a church because they believe as I do that women do not belong in pastoral ministry.
     
  9. Brother James

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    I'm referring to women preachers/evangelists/pastors brother. Nothing wrong as far as I can see with women teaching women, that's Biblical.
     
  10. Joshua Rhodes

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    In that case, I hold to my original opinion that women are not to pastor.
     
  11. Salamander

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    Dont know why you'd "like" for some one to provide something that doesn't exist!

    There, was that "civil" enough? :eek: :rolleyes:
     
  12. blackbird

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    Because I'm too smart to do anything else!!!
     
  13. Debby in Philly

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    Axioms:
    1. It is unbiblical for a woman to pastor or preach.
    2. God does things and says things for good reasons and purposes.

    Question:
    What is the reason?
     
  14. Scarlett O.

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    Here's a novel idea.

    But perhaps it's a little too liberal for the BB.

    Instead of constantly, (and I mean to the point of making me nauseous), constantly pointing out that women have multiple restrictions placed on them...

    ...why don't we EVER, EVER on the BB talk about the responsibility of men behind the pulpit or in the home.

    And I'm not talking about the ruling over women. That's a grievous punishment that women are forced to bear. That's not a man's right nor privilige. He didn't earn it. That between women and God.

    I am talking about a man's responsibility before God Almighty to his church and his home.

    I know of and I know that YOU know of plenty of men who have gotten behind the pulpit and misquoted scripture, used the pulpit for political purposes or just to rant and rave, hurt people's feelings intentionally, told things that weren't true, preached unpreparedly, and generally used the pulpit as a place of vocalizing his opinions and winning popularity contests.

    I think we females on the BB get it about women.

    We should.

    There is a constant flow of threads on this board dictating to women what we can and cannot wear, what we can and cannot say, if we can or cannot work outside the home, if we can or cannot voice an opinion that is contradictory to our husbands, and .....well, it just never, never, never, NEVER ends around here!

    OK!! We get it! Women are restricted in all facets of life. We get it!

    Let's talk about men awhile. Won't that be novel?

    OK, so women are "banned" from preaching.

    It's just my personal opinion, and for pity's sake, I know I am just a woman...

    ...but I think that in discussing a woman's banishment from leadership in the church or the home or the nation should automatically lead to a discussion on a man's serious and solemn duty to preach and lead under the authority of God.

    It's serious business, being behind that pulpit.

    And there is enough stupidity behind the pulpit on television and irresponsibility behind the pulpit in America in general to warrant LOOOOONG discussions on the BB about just how men who are behind the pulpit should view themselves in a most humble manner and in a manner that is ever submissive to God and ever in constant spiritual prostration before God.

    We don't ever seem to want to talk about that.

    We have talked to DEATH, (and I mean to the DEATH of a lot of women's spirits around here), about how women are restricted in the church and in the home.

    Why dont' we talk about how that makes a man accountable before God in ways that he could never imagine and maybe never has imagined.

    Or is that too "touchy" of a subject?

    Peace-
    Scarlett O.
    &lt;&gt;&lt;
     
  15. bapmom

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    The Bible gives us two clear reasons for this.....first the woman was created second, after Adam, and secondly, the woman was actually deceived in the Garden.


    1Ti 2:12
    But I suffer not a woman to teach, nor to usurp authority over the man, but to be in silence.
    1Ti 2:13
    For Adam was first formed, then Eve.
    1Ti 2:14
    And Adam was not deceived, but the woman being deceived was in the transgression.


    edit: I posted at the same time as Scarlett, so I didn't read her's first.........

    Sister Scarlett speaks well I think.
     
  16. Debby in Philly

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    Preach it, Scarlett!!!
    (Oops, I can't use that word)
    I mean, Speak the truth!!!!
     
  17. Hope of Glory

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    A woman should never pastor. As far as preaching, I think that it's permitted in two situation, one of which is godly and one of which is not. In the godly situation, she is free to preach to women (and I would argue children, but that's a different subject that I have no desire to explore at this juncture). In the ungodly, it's when men abdicate their responsibilities and are unwilling to do what God wants. I think it's similar to Deborah: Why was she in the position she was in?

    I know of one church in which a woman preaches simply because there is not a single man who has been willing (or able) to do so. Do I think God wants the church to simply cease to exist? No. Do I think God wants a man in there preaching? Absolutely.

    This church is remote. There are no others. You can get there only by plane or ship. She refuses to be the pastor, but she preaches for the time begin. BTW, the men are mostly a bunch of alcoholics who don't attend, and the few who do attend aren't much better.
     
  18. Bob Dudley

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    I want to stir the waters a little bit. First, the catalyst:

    What about Phebe, the deaconess of the church at Cenchrea (Rom 16:1)?

    What about Philip’s daughters, the prophetesses (Acts 21:8-9)?

    How do you resolve Paul’s instructions for a woman to pray and prophecy in church (1 Cor 11:5) with his admonition for a woman to be silent and not speak (watch the Greek here) in church (1 Cor 1434) – both in the same letter?

    What about the fact that the same Greek word translated elder in Timothy is not equally translated elderess (or whatever the female equivalent might be) when talking about a woman (1 Tim 5)?

    Could the Greek word translated silence in 1 Tim 2:12 be better translated state of quietness without disturbance (as it is given in BDAG)?

    Now, I know we all believe that a woman should not preach in church – that’s what we were all taught. But just patting each other on the back and having a mutual admiration society doesn’t help the ones coming to our church that really want to know God’s Word. And telling them, “because I said so, that’s why” only works for little kids (and it’s been my experience it doesn’t even work for them very long). Anyway, women have a very big role in the church and I think we short change them a lot more than God intended.

    Now, please don’t flame me too badly – I am a rookie here. I’m just saying that “because I said” just doesn’t satisfy and our pet verses in 1 Timothy need to be balanced with Luke’s writings and Paul’s other letters. Are we short changing the women in the body of Christ?
     
  19. blackbird

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    Hit upon a nerve, have we??? :eek: :eek: :eek:
     
  20. Joseph M. Smith

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    Much is being said about its being unBiblical for a woman to pastor. On its face, that is true. But there are some issues:

    1. Is I Timothy actually from the pen of Paul? There is a long history of scholarly critique that suggests that it is not, that it comes from a later period in early church history, when the tradition of male leadership had hardened.

    2. Even if it is from Paul, and therefore presumed superior to other writers (a debatable point), is it not true that Paul here, as in I Corinthians, is giving us his personal opinion and practice and is not elevating this to the point of doctrine?

    3. And even if the above questions are answered, does not any theory of female subordination get trumped by Galatians 3:28 and similar sentiments that tell us that women and men stand before Christ on equal footing?

    Personally I do not see the relevance of the citation of the Adam/Eve story in this connection. Whether you read it literally or as a parable, it tells me that man and woman are created together in the image of God, and that woman is a companion suited to man, but not inferior to him. As the old Appalachian song tells it, woman was created "not from man's head to lord it over him, nor from his foot, to be trod upon by him, but from his side, to be his companion."

    By the way, although I support and have participated in the ordination of women to ministry, I always make it a point in these discussions to insist that no one has a right to be ordained. It is a privilege for any of us. Let no one argue that s/he MUST be ordained just because s/he feels called. The church must decide on the basis of its assessment of any such person's maturity, skill, preparation, and readiness.
     

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