women wear skirts at all times?

Discussion in '2003 Archive' started by Girla, Mar 20, 2003.

  1. Girla

    Girla
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    Could someone please explain to me why women should wear skirts at all times? I see many good reasons why...but I guess I'd appreciate more material on what transition in our culture caused women to start wearing pants? Were the reasons behind it: in order to be more independent as women, to show more figure, etc.?
    thanks
     
  2. Helen

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    Hi Girla,

    We have been over this subject dozens of times on this board! In brief, pants are not confined to men historically! Neither are gowns or robes or skirts confined to women historically. They are purely cultural and need to be understood as such.

    However, understanding that, in western countries right now, many women feel that the use of pants by women is either
    1. too masculine
    or
    2. too sexy

    I guess the type of pants and the viewer have a lot to do with whichever it is!

    And some women simply feel more feminine in a dress than in pants and do all their work quite comfortably in dresses.

    So understanding that the biblical directive is that women and men are not to dress so as to try to look like a member of the opposite sex, and that modesty is also a biblical imperative, it is up to a woman and either her parents or husband or, if adult and single, up to her and God, about how she will dress.

    Here are some good questions a woman might ask herself about her dress:

    1. Whether skirt, dress, or pants, is it provocative? Is it revealing? (It should be noted that the WAY one wears even modest clothes can be provocative...)

    2. Is there something about the clothing which would embarrass anyone else in the environment in which you will be? In other words, are you dressed appropriately for the occasion?

    3. Are you dressing to attract attention, or is it your Christian character people notice?

    Sometimes a person can be so noticeably "modest" in their dress that they attract enormous amounts of attention, and in my personal opinion, that also is unbiblical -- for we are told that we should be noticed because of our character, not because of what we wear.
     
  3. Headcoveredlady

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    Hello Girla,
    You asked a few questions.
    1) Why should a woman wear skirts (dresses,) at all times?

    A. In 1 Timothy 2:9, "In like manner also that women adorn themselves in modest apparel, with shamefacedness and sobriety; not with broided hair, or gold, or pearls, or costly array."

    In Vines Expository Dictionary: Apparel means a Long, Loose Flowing Garment. Modest means in order.

    Long and loose can only be a dress. Something that covers the form. We all know that men are visually stimulated by the female form.

    Deuteronomy 22:5, "The woman shall not wear that which pertainith unto a man, neither shall a man put on woman's garment; for all they that do so ARE AN ABOMINATION unto the Lord they God."

    I do not think He changed His mind about what is and what is an abomination.

    And we see now in the end days much wickedness and abominations. Unisex is not right.

    2) Why did women begin doing this? There are probably many reasons. Rebellion is probably the biggest one. And the other one you mentioned, to show the form.

    When did the pants come on? During the same time women were asserting their rights. Would you agree that the pants came on and dresses came off around the same time that women were leaving the homes for careers? I see a link between the two.

    And now we see the pants getting tighter and tighter and young girls showing more and more. Last summer we observed young girls with their bathing suits on at Burger King. I could hardly believe my eyes. I wonder what is next.

    I think you will find this website very interesting, as it shows that throughout history men and women have had different apparel.http://alpha.furman.edu/~kgossman/history/

    You might say well men would not wear pink pants. Maybe most men wouldn't but why won't most men still not wear a dress with masculine fabric?

    I am interested to hear more of what you think. Do you wear dresses only?
     
  4. Ben W

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    Go have a look at a pair of womens pants, you will find the hips cut differently and the buttonon the other side. Is it ok for a man to wear those pants? No. Why? because they are womens clothing.

    Is it o,k for a Scotsman to wear a kilt? Yes. Why? Because it is traditional mens clothing.

    Loose Fitting Pants are far more morally suitable for women that dresses that flap about and expose there legs.
     
  5. I Am Blessed 24

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    If the dresses are long enough...no leg will show when they flap about. :D

    Blessings,
    Sue
     
  6. Maverick

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    Remember men are aroused by sight and we have a sex obessed age. The more you show the more they have to lust over. Indeed, most women wear pants and blouses that only leave skin tone and freckles to the imagination. As an old soldier, I would love to tell you how men think graphically because I have served with men from all classes and races, but the moderators would have cardiacs. To saythe least, many of you have been inaginary sex partners with multiple men because of your attire. You are naive if you think otherwise.

    Paul taught about modest clothing and the word describes a long robe that is not slit. Gals actually had a slit robe in those days but only prostitutes (enticement and ease of access) and yound children (toileting reasons) wore them. If we are going to look at history and culture we need to look at the one given to us in the Scriptures and what it teaches us there for indeed cultures come and go and are usually not godly hence we cannot base any argument for what the saints do upon what the culture does.

    Most wome are concerned about their thighs, hips, and buttocks and yet wear pants that reveal all of them. Some even give themselves a wedgie both fore and aft. How they walk I do not know, but indeed it is a sensual sight as they wiggle down the road. The song says, "Lord, have mercy, Baby has her blue jeans on."

    A properly fitting dress is still the most modest and beautiful thing a woman can wear. In our age of androgny it also celebrates her womanhood.
     
  7. Maverick

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    By the way, Ben, years ago we had ladies jeans designed like men's. Sears advertised them as such then but now that style is just standard. Women seem to prefer the men cut over the "women's" cut. Tighter and more revealing it seems.
     
  8. donnA

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    I for one don't care what the dictionary says, I'll take the bible. And no where does it say women are to wear dresses only. And they only time anything like pants are mentioned it is not saying men only wear pants/breeches, but that priests were to wear them, under their clothes, in effect they took the place of our modern day underware. The bible teaches us to dress modestly, and thats what I plan on doing.
    Now I'm going to go put on my pants.
     
  9. Artimaeus

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    I attended Hyles-Anderson College in the fall of '74. They had a rule that said that married male students had to agree that their wives would not wear pants EVER, even inside their own home. We abided by the rule but thought that was the stupidest thing we had ever heard.
     
  10. Pastor_Bob

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    I believe there are (4) biblical principles that need to be taken into consideration when deciding what we (men or women) are to wear.
    1. Does it appear evil? I Thess. 5:22
    I'm sure all of us would agree that there is clothing that can be worn that is certainly evil. Just sit down in the mall and observe how various people dress.

    2. Does it declare your holiness? I Peter 1:15,16
    God demands holiness from all saved people. Being holy merans being separated or being set apart from sinful things in order to be like Jesus who was Himself holy.

    3. Is it modest? I Tim. 2:9,10
    Christians ought to give much thought to what they wear and not just follow a fad or a trend in styles or a tradition.

    4. Is it gender distinct? Deut. 22:5
    The fact that this is an abomination to God make it eternal and unchanging.

    Principles 1 and 2 are somewhat left up to our own personal discretion. But, points 3 and 4 are very clearly laid down in the Word of God. I would be glad to share them with you if you'd like.

    I understand that Hollywood had a big part in the change in women's clothing. Shows like I Love Lucy and The Mary Tyler-Moore Show lead the way and exemplified the American housewife and working women wearing pants.

    In WWII, the ladies had to work the factories. They would wear a dress to work, change into overalls to work, and then change back into their dresses before leaving the plant. Not until well after the war did women become "comfortable" wearing pants in public. I believe we've lost that "shamefacedness" that Timothy talks about in I Tim. 2:9.
     
  11. donnA

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    Has nothing to do with pants on a woman.
    My grandmother worked in one of those factories, made tanks, and wore pants, anytime she wanted too.
    June Cleaver predates Mary Tyler Moore,and yesterday I saw her weeding in pants.
     
  12. C.S. Murphy

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    Thanks for the rebirth of this topic, NOT!!! [​IMG] Just kidding, post away but please let's not have another pants/dresses argument. Please.

    Murph
     
  13. Headcoveredlady

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    Pastor Bob,
    Thank you for that. I like what you said about shamefacedness being gone in our society. Funny how that is usually not a topic at women's Bible classes, how to be shamefaced...
     
  14. timothy 1769

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    thanks for bringing this up again for the new guys [​IMG]
     
  15. Pastor_Bob

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    But it has everything to do with propriety, decency, and modesty. To make a blanket statement saying that pants on women is not spoken against in the Scriptures is too simply ignore the princples that God gave us in His Word.

    It is a given that God wants us to be clothed. It is also very obvious that God wants there to be a distinction between the sexes. To argue that the Bible says nothing about women wearing pants is to argue from silence.

    Every man and women has to determine what God would have them do. Each one is responsible to God and will answer only to Him. My objective is not to condemn those who disagree; but to clearly state what the Bible has to say about it. You said,
    I would challange you to carefully sit down and study this issue, laying aside all pre-conceived ideas. If you can come back and say you feel the same way as you do now after a careful study, I'll say "amen."

    My point is that Mary Tyler Moore made it acceptable for the working women to go out in pants. Hollywood should never be the standard for Christians. In fact, if we look at Hollywood and then do the exact opposite, we would be better off.
     
  16. Helen

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    Today I am going to do a burn and clean out the chicken area while the burn is settling down to embers. I will be wearing a pair of 'culotte' overalls with a salmon t-shirt that has sort of a lacy edging around the collar.

    It is modest, loose, and no guy would be caught dead in it unless he was proclaiming flaming homosexuality.

    Anyone who wants to do a burn in a dress or a skirt is asking for trouble -- major time.

    I will also be working with a pup who just turned a year old and his training starts today. A dress would really get in the way of the leash work.

    Folks, pants are not masculine per se. Ask the Egyptians, or the Chinese, or a number of other cultures! On the other hand, western tight pants on women shocked the conservatives of all those other countries when they first came out.

    And there are dresses that make tight stretch jeans seem the height of modesty!

    Once upon a time not wearing a hoop under a long skirt meant you were easy, maybe even a professional. At the least you were definitely lower class!

    These dress/pants things are some of the silliest wastes of time on this entire Baptist Board. Modest and gender-appropriate are the biblical directives. Holiness is something only God can do for a character, and if any clothing at all of any style is taking the place of a character that is missing, then the entire point has been missed.
     
  17. Headcoveredlady

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    Great advice!
     
  18. Helen

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    Not to be picky, but isn't that STILL making Hollywood a standard of sorts?

    I've been working outside. I'm hot, sweaty, and messy. I'm in for a quick break. I don't look nice, I don't feel nice, I have a headache, and I am exhausted.

    Not my favorite way to be. But the work has to be done.

    It will be lovely to get in a hot shower then blow dry my hair and put on a little makeup and wear a hostess gown for the rest of the day. I will look and feel feminine again.

    And when I started thinking about that, I also started thinking about our incredible pioneer women, some in skirts and some in pants, who rarely felt feminine no matter which. The dirt and dust had dried their skin to harsh wrinkles at an early age and they worked themselves to exhaustion almost daily helping their husbands.

    And yet many of them were not only incredibly strong and faithful Christians, but they raised up strong Christian children. They wore what was available. For some, dresses were a luxury and they had only one saved for Sundays and weddings and funerals -- and some even had to share their husband's clothes for the working times.

    I doubt very much God scorned them for that!

    If I am going to look to human beings for examples, I choose these incredible women rather than Hollywood, for or against.

    I also choose to watch our budget, and choose clothes that will last and which my husband approves of as well.

    And some of them are pants. He likes me in jeans as well as dresses. Maybe I'm just more klutzy than other women, but if I were to go out and work in a dress, I would probably tear it or stain it -- and with jeans and these overalls, that doesn't matter. I can patch them and keep on going in them for another year. Both of us consider that wiser than other options.

    [ March 22, 2003, 10:27 PM: Message edited by: Helen ]
     
  19. donnA

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    If I choose or not choose certain clothing based on what holywood does or doesn't do, then my focus is not God, humility, modesty, and righteousness, but hollywood.
     
  20. donnA

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    Based on what? Bible or personal opinion? Since pants and dresses are not mentioned in these verses quoted.


    I'm sorry, but you evidently know nothing about women's clothing, there is very much a distinction between meen's and womens' clothing.


    Then you do what you believe the bible says, and I'll do the samething. I go with what it does say, I don't make it up.

    I have, and see no pants in the bible, nor do I see where women are to wear dresses only.

    But you have already made hollywood a standard for dress. Women can't wear pants becasue MTM did it.


    Some people just want to be in control of everyone else.
     

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