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Words of Christ vs Words of God

Discussion in 'Other Christian Denominations' started by BobRyan, May 5, 2007.

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  1. steaver

    steaver Well-Known Member
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    I read over what you posted carefully three times. You did not give me one definition asked for but you want me to "Show" how the edits given do NOT fit my statement.

    You give me what you believe are the definitions and I will defend my statement accordingly. Can we do one at a time to keep it more focused.

    "How much fruit counts" I asked. Example; I see a person giving a cup of cold water to another, kindness is a fruit of the Spirit. Should the act of kindness in and of itself cause me to believe that this person is a child of God? "Fruit" alone isn't enough is it? Catholics believe that good works can only be done through man by the Holy Spirit and therefore anyone with good works is a sign that they are saved even apart from faith in Christ.

    And what if it is a professing Christian that is bearing fruits of the Spirit that I can see and I have seen them do many wonderful works in the Lord's name, yet I also have seen them do a couple bad works not worthy of a Christian to partake in, are they still considered a Christian? Or must they have 100% good fruits and 0% bad?

    You tell me Bob what your definition of "you shall know them by their fruits" is. Good fruit ALL the time, most of the time, some of the time? Can there be good fruits along with bad fruits, is there a scale that we should judge the fruits by? Just what would you say is the way we should look upon this word by Jesus?

    If you do not answer any of this at least answer this one question for me, Does a good fruit tree, I am talking about a real tree here, bear 100% good fruit? Or is there always a certain percentage of rotten fruit or fruit that just doesn't fully develope coming off of a otherwise good tree?

    So UNLESS you do define bearing fruit as 100% perfection, my statement....

    ...is in no way

    God Bless! :thumbs:
     
    #61 steaver, Jun 26, 2007
  2. BobRyan

    BobRyan Well-Known Member

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    You claim the edits do NOT fit your view - but here in the post I SHOW that they in fact DO fit your comments perfectly!!

     
    #62 BobRyan, Jun 26, 2007
  3. BobRyan

    BobRyan Well-Known Member

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    "No way to know" I replied.

    And then my response is of the form "so toss that rule out the window there is just no way to rely on that text of scripture unless we edit as follows to fit your view".



    (BobRyan)..."By their fruits you shall NOT know them"? Matt 7


    Then Steaver said "You will have to define "how much fruit" counts. One pear, a bushel, a truck load?"

    Precisely sir -- there is just no way to know them by their fruits.


    Bob edits -- "
    "Not merely everyone who DOES the will of My FAther but anyone who merely SAYS Lord Lord will enter the kingdom of heaven "??? Matt 7

    As I said "TOSS that rule given to us by Christ out the window"

    How many more times do you need it said??

    No way to know - just toss Christ's words right out the window or edit as I have given it.


    (BobRyan)..."By their fruits you shall NOT know them"? Matt 7


    Then Steaver said "You will have to define "how much fruit" counts. One pear, a bushel, a truck load?"

    Precisely sir -- there is just no way to know them by their fruits.


    With the edit I proposed I think you will find all your issues go away sir


    (BobRyan)..."By their fruits you shall NOT know them"? Matt 7


    Then Steaver said "You will have to define "how much fruit" counts. One pear, a bushel, a truck load?"

    Precisely sir -- there is just no way to know them by their fruits.


    Nope - toss it out or edit that rule too!!

    good point. Let's never read Matt 7 again sir!!

    in Christ,

    Bob
     
    #63 BobRyan, Jun 26, 2007
  4. steaver

    steaver Well-Known Member
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    I understand you want a black and white, cut and dried, do it or else burn view of scripture. But one must take in the full counsel of God's word to get the full understanding of a single line of scripture.

    There is no edit needed for my view to coinside with the full counsel of God's word. You insisting on comparing one liners to my views do not do any harm to my view (only in your eyes), they only show that you are not showing yourself approved to rightly divide God's word.

    The "rule" Jesus delivered is truth, but it takes the full counsel of God's word to put it into proper context. In it's proper context, it coinsides with my view of what the scriptures teach concerning Christian behavior.

    God Bless! :thumbs:
     
    #64 steaver, Jun 26, 2007
  5. BobRyan

    BobRyan Well-Known Member

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    No way to know - just toss Christ's words right out the window or edit as I have given it.

    Then Steaver said "You will have to define "how much fruit" counts. One pear, a bushel, a truck load?"

    Precisely sir -- there is just no way to know them by their fruits.

    With the edit I proposed I think you will find all your issues go away sir


    Then Steaver said "You will have to define "how much fruit" counts. One pear, a bushel, a truck load?"

    Precisely sir -- there is just no way to know them by their fruits as you keep pointing out so the EDIT fits your view pefectly sir.

    [quot]Steaver
    There is no edit needed for my view to coinside with the full counsel of God's word. [/quote]

    Kind of an innexplicable response to that sequence above Steaver. At some point you need to SHOW that the edit is NOT what you are arguing since each time that ACTUAL text is quoted you offer all of your little "puzzles" against it.

    It is left as an exercise for the reader to confirm this fact.

    in Christ,

    Bob
     
    #65 BobRyan, Jun 27, 2007
  6. steaver

    steaver Well-Known Member
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    So I need to show that YOUR edit of scripture does NOT coinside with MY statement? You make a claim but do not have to explain that claim? It is I who has to explain that your claim does not fit my statement? I see!

    How about you SHOW me how my statement DOES coinside with your edit?

    You just saying it is so does not SHOW that it is so!

    Tell you what, you can explain how your edit is equal to my statement and then I can refute or concede.

    God Bless! :thumbs:
     
    #66 steaver, Jun 27, 2007
  7. BobRyan

    BobRyan Well-Known Member

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    This is the part where I SHOW that the edit of the scripture that YOU NEED and what "you are posting" are in fact the SAME thing.

    http://www.baptistboard.com/showpost.php?p=1033342&postcount=65

    It is left as an exercise for the reader to see if this is really as confusing as Steaver is claiming.

    In Christ,

    Bob
     
    #67 BobRyan, Jun 27, 2007
  8. steaver

    steaver Well-Known Member
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    Sorry brother. That is not an explanation, that is only a claim. It is left to you to explain how my statement equals your statement. Give a "puzzle" maybe. :wavey:

    God Bless! :thumbs:
     
    #68 steaver, Jun 28, 2007
  9. BobRyan

    BobRyan Well-Known Member

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    I am sorry - I did not realize that it was still being left to me to post this --

    Here it is again --

    No way to know - just toss Christ's words right out the window or edit as I have given it.

    Then Steaver said "You will have to define "how much fruit" counts. One pear, a bushel, a truck load?"

    Precisely sir -- there is just no way to know them by their fruits.
    With the edit I proposed I think you will find all your issues go away sir

    Then Steaver said "You will have to define "how much fruit" counts. One pear, a bushel, a truck load?"

    Precisely sir -- there is just no way to know them by their fruits as you keep pointing out so the EDIT fits your view pefectly sir.

    Kind of an innexplicable response to that sequence above Steaver. At some point you need to SHOW that the edit is NOT what you are arguing since each time that ACTUAL text is quoted you offer all of your little "puzzles" against it.

    It is left as an exercise for the reader to confirm this fact.

    in Christ,

    Bob
     
    #69 BobRyan, Jul 1, 2007
  10. BobRyan

    BobRyan Well-Known Member

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    You see Steaver - your opposition to the text is clearly seen in your own mincing of words regarding the text.

    As I said - your position is more more clear to the objective reader than you have been hoping. I am happy at this point to leave it to the reader to figure it out.
     
    #70 BobRyan, Jul 1, 2007
  11. steaver

    steaver Well-Known Member
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    So says you brother. :thumbs:

    ps. (anyone who clearly sees what Bob sees is more than welcome to help me see it)

    God Bless! :wavey:
     
    #71 steaver, Jul 2, 2007
  12. BobRyan

    BobRyan Well-Known Member

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    Well since we are on a "NEW page" and the reader may not know which page to go back to --- I just want to make sure we are letting Steaver's questions speak for themselves and my responses speak to the point as well when the objective reader get's around to the last page of the thread.



    No way to know - just toss Christ's words right out the window or edit as I have given it.

    Then Steaver said "You will have to define "how much fruit" counts. One pear, a bushel, a truck load?"

    Precisely sir -- there is just no way to know them by their fruits.

    With the edit I proposed I think you will find all your issues go away sir


    Then Steaver said "You will have to define "how much fruit" counts. One pear, a bushel, a truck load?"

    Precisely sir -- there is just no way to know them by their fruits as you keep pointing out so the EDIT fits your view pefectly sir.

    Kind of an innexplicable response to that sequence above Steaver. At some point you need to SHOW that the edit is NOT what you are arguing since each time that ACTUAL text is quoted you offer all of your little "puzzles" against it.

    It is left as an exercise for the reader to confirm this fact.
     
    #72 BobRyan, Jul 3, 2007
    Last edited by a moderator: Jul 3, 2007
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