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Discussion in 'General Baptist Discussions' started by JesusFan, Jul 18, 2011.
As both are SBC, and both hold to jesus died for all, and all can be saved?
Neither are Arminian.
Both of them would see themselves though as '4 point Arms" as they feel Eternal security IS for us as Christians....
I don't consider one an Arminian if they don't hold to all points any more than I consider one to be a Calvinist that doesn't hold to all petals of the TULIP.
I agree with Dr. Stanley's theology, but I am NOT an Arminian. I would be one of those who have a "nameless theology". :laugh: But I'm in very good company with the likes of Charles Stanley, Adrian Rogers, Chuck Swindoll, Erwin Lutzer......
One can still be considered an Arminian even if they inconsistently hold to "eternal security" which is a watered-down form of the Calvinistic 5th point.
The Remonstrants weren't very decisive on their fifth point.
Stanley is as Arminian as Norman Geisler.
Both strong Arminians.
I would classify Swindoll and David Jeremiah as wavering Calvinists.
He's a full-fledged Calvinist!
By definition, Arminians believe that one may lose his salvation. So Billy Graham and Dr. Stanley are not Arminians. They are a kind of hybrid. We need to come up with a better label than "no-name," though, for people like Amy G and other non-Cals.
How about "Swindler?" Nah. Okay "Swindollite?" Nah. "Swindollist?" Possible.
I've got it! How about "Swindollian?"
"Grahammer, Grahamite, Grahamanian?"
Billy Graham was a typical Baptist of his generation, 1948ish...It was a wish-washy theology of free-willism.
Amen. I've lost interest in Swindoll, Rogers, and Stanley.
Swindoll denied the Omniscience of God in a message saying basically "God knows everything? Come on! Don't go there." and the context supported God doesn't know all things. No wonder I lost interest in him years ago.
Rogers? I can't listen to him any longer. I used to, at first saved, loved listening to him. But I can't get into him any longer. To me there is no depth there. Lot's of quips, rhyming points, illustrations, philosophies, poems, quaint sayings, but little, and I mean very little exposition.
...better ask Dr. Graham while you still can. And Charles Stanley, too. Can't ask dead guys.
If Swindoll REALLY said that God does not know everything, then NOBODY should listen to him.
He really said it, I was listening to bottradionetwork, here on 7:30 a.m. and he definitely said it. It was a while back. I literally could not believe it, but that is almost word for word what he said.
That is plainly false teaching. It was the context of God Almighty, not in the context of Jesus saying things are reserved only for Gods knowledge while Christ was on earth.
They aren't Arminans
Before you label Swindoll as a "false teacher", you'd better provide better evidence than you "heard" it once.
Neither believe you can lose your salvation, so the answer is no.
Stanley is a tried and true Free Grace theologian down to the eschatology and all.
I guess that just goes to show that even a "wishy washy theologian, free willer" can lead millions of people to Christ. :thumbs:
I sure can't make that claim, can you?
I've stated what he's said on my Christian honor knowing that I'll give an account.
He said what I put on here.
Also, I mentioned this before on here, around the time he did it.
And one more thing, since you've added to my intentions, I said that is false teaching, I never said he is a false teacher.
Exactly. And just like any other human, Stanley is not perfect, but I've been listening to him and reading his books for years and they don't come any more solid in their theology than him.
I'm not calling you a liar. But what you've quoted was certainly not containing any context. I can do the same with any reformed theologian as well.
No they can't.
Listen...I just overflook his...listen to this... FG millenial exclusion teaching.