You must hear this... thoughts please.

Tali...

... He's trying to split off some Southern Baptists (the "narrow gate") into "Lordship Salvation." Trying to get em lost so they can be saved by works (the "narrow path").

It is interesting that "Lordship" Reformers end up just like their Catholic predecessors. Only their "sacraments" distinguish the 2.

1) Both start with a regeneration you mostly do nothing about --- Catholicism starts with infant baptismal regeneration, Reform starts with "passive," monergistic regeneration not attributable to any act on our part.

2) Then both require works to "prove" the effecaciousness of initial salvation/regeneration -- Catholics through sacraments, Reform through certain biblical, NT behaviors.

To me, it's just Augustinianism come round full circle.

skypair

 

This was posted several months ago here, and I listened to it. I believe Washer is sincere and cares about people very much.

But he is too legalistic in his theology. He needs to dig into the scriptures that speak of our freedom in Christ, and our justification being through through faith alone.

God certainly wants us to live consistantly with who we are in Christ, but only from the perspective of our complete security, and never based on fear.

These are the New Covenant truths that our standing before God is based upon.

Mike

 

My hero :thumbs:

Everyone ought to hear this!

 

I can't open the link but is this a Paul Washer video?

I have heard and see stuff from him before and some of it is pretty scary. He can easily make you doubt your salvation.

In 1 sermon Washer said he can tell wether you're saved or not by going in your room and looking at what you have there.

And then this whole "you can't get saved when you accept Jesus only as savior" stuff. This is scary, because then everybody can ask himself if he's really saved and if he has really made Jesus Lord enough. What if he's not enough Lord? Then you can forget it.

 

There are those in the Baptist church that do not fall for the error of OSAS - they would certainly see the wisdom of Christ's Words in Matt 18 regarding "Foregiveness revoked" or in the words of Matt 7 regarding the narrow way.

There are thos who DO fall for the error of OSAS but who ALSO accept the Bible truth regarding the doctrine of perseverance and "holding firm" (as Paul states in Col 1) - They TOO would be inclined to accept Christ's words in Matt 7 regarding the need of obedience and perseverance and following the "narrow way".

How then is this "news" ??

Only 4 point calvinists who reject the Bible teaching on Pereverance and those Arminians that join them in doing that - in their beliefs in OSAS would find this teaching in Matt 7 to be a problem...

This is what I gather from the comments made so far

What am I missing?

in Christ,

Bob

 

I agree, that you have to see a change in people which are saved but then again what about christians which do not show enough change according to Washer?
How can he determine who is saved and who isn't and who's only having a bad time?

 

xdx,
You don't have to answer to Washer - You have to answer to Christ.
If the creator of universe has taken up residence within someone (which happens at salvation), He will bring about change that pleases Christ. It may take a little longer in some, but it will happen.

 

But what if you're not making any more progress? Is it up to us to basically keep us making progress and if we fail and trip on the spot then we're at danger of being removed because we bear no fruit?

 

Hi Tali,

but the thing is that most of the time I feel bad about myself and I can't tell if this is just me feeling bad about myself for whatever reason or if this because it's true and I'm really as bad as I think I am and then God might feel the same way about me as I do. If I only knew what God thinks but I don't. This drives me insane sometimes.

 

We all feel that way sometimes. Some folks more than others. If you're are on this board long enough, you will read some post which applies to your sin thus the conclusion must be that you're not saved.

God looks at the heart, only he knows whether you are saved. It's his decision.

Being saved isn't a feeling. Your posts reflect a saved person imo.

 

xdisciplex,

We are not saved by being "good enough", but rather by acknowledging that we can never be good enough, and that we need a savior. We then place our faith in Christ, embracing Him through faith alone.

The thief on the cross:

Christs verdict?

The publican in the temple:

Christs verdict?

Paul:

Fruit follows justification, but it has no part in the attaining of our justification. I get the impression, not just from this thread but other threads of yours as well, that you are spending too much time fretting, and worrying....and not enough time PRAISING, WORSHIPPING, and THANKING Him for what He has done on your behalf.

Luke 12:32...

Would you mind posting a testimony concerning how you were drawn to, and embraced Christ, and how your life changed as a result?

Thanks!

God bless,

Mike