Your Confession of Faith...Let's see it!

Discussion in 'General Baptist Discussions' started by Iconoclast, Jul 6, 2013.

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  1. Iconoclast

    Iconoclast
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    In another thread I asked a couple of the members who do not believe in catechisms and Confessions of faith to put their view of the bible only to the test...I will expand that challenge to all on BB....No Cheating, No looking anything up,

    If all books and bibles were confiscated and you had to write what you believe and teach others what would you say....starting from scratch.....??

    Have fun....

    here..write out what you believe here offering any verses you think support your position
    Pick out a few 3,4,5 topics and write here on BB what you would want us to know...from being as well taught as you have been without such study tools.

    I challenge everyone here as a spiritual exercise....get a note book and write out your own CONFESSION OF FAITH......no cheating!!! let's see what you have got..... GO....:wavey:
    Offer a brief paragraph and supporting verses..


    Of God and the Holy Trinity

    Of God's Decree

    Of Creation

    Of Divine Providence

    Of the Fall of Man, of Sin, and of the punishment thereof

    Of God's Covenant

    Of Christ the Mediator

    Of Free Will

    Of Effectual Calling

    Of Justification

    Of Adoption

    Of Sanctification

    Of Saving Faith

    Of Repentance unto Life and Salvation

    Of Good Works

    Of the Perseverance of the Saints

    Of the Assurance of Grace and Salvation

    Of the Law of God

    Of the Gospel and the Extent of Grace thereof

    Of Christian Liberty and Liberty of Conscience

    Of Religious Worship and the Sabbath Day

    Of Lawful Oaths and Vows

    Of the Civil Magistrate

    Of Marriage

    Of the Church

    Of the Communion of Saints

    Of Baptism and the Lord's Supper

    Of Baptism

    Of the Lord's Supper

    Of the State of Man after Death, and of the Resurrection of the Dead

    Of the Last Judgement


    If you do not cheat...I will guarantee you will not exceed what the confessions already contain.....can you be honest enough to do it.???
    __________________
     
  2. Winman

    Winman
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    Give me a break, even if I were to do this, it would take sometime to put it altogether, probably several weeks.

    Would you read it when I am finished? Right.

    Would you believe what I wrote? If you did I think I would probably fall dead.

    If you want to ask one subject at a time, folks here could answer and show those scriptures that support their view. I MIGHT participate in that if I had plenty of time.

    Fact is, I have been showing scripture here for years to support what I believe. It is you that shows creeds and catechisms.

    I think I am going to start calling you Icreedoclast, or Icatechismsoclast. :laugh:

    So, why don't you start? I have been showing scripture for years here, I am WAY ahead of you.
     
  3. Iconoclast

    Iconoclast
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    Good one Winman...:applause::applause::laugh: I like it,lol

    listen...i know it is a big task...that is why I said..pick out 3, or 4, or 5 topics then write a descriptive paragraph, then some supporting verses....the way you would teach to other believers if there was no study books or internet...

    no cheating Winman!!!!
     
  4. Iconoclast

    Iconoclast
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    Well do what you can....
     
  5. DrJamesAch

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    If you notice however, there are a plethora of terms that are DISTINCTLY CALVINIST ("Of Effectual Calliing"). So of course, his "test" is already skewed from the beginning because no Non Calvinist or Arminian is going to write a Biblical explanation for terms they don't agree with.
     
  6. Iconoclast

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    Wrong...i asked for your confession of faith...

    so you could say...I reject effectual calling completely if that is your confession of faith....try again ACH:wavey:
     
  7. Winman

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    Oh, I can explain that one;

    Effectual Calling- A Reformed/Calvinist term not found in scripture. Effectual Calling is a circular reasoning, if a person answers God's call to repentance by trusting in Jesus, then that call was effectual. If the person rejects the invitation to trust in Christ and be saved, then they were not called by the Effectual Calling, but by the powerless and meaningless General Call.

    General Calling- A Reformed/Calvinist term not found in scripture. General Calling is a circular reasoning, if a person answers God's call to repentance by trusting in Jesus, then that call was not general. If the person rejects the invitiation to trust in Christ and be saved, then they were called by the General Calling.

    There are no such terms as these in Arminian/non-Calvinist thought.
     
  8. Iconoclast

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    Thats the idea winman,,cut and paste the list and give your statement for each one, or as many as you can....:wavey:
     
  9. Winman

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    Sure, I am going to waste hours if not days writing out something you will not pay attention to anyway.

    You really believe people are stupid don't you?
     
  10. Iconoclast

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    I will pay attention and read your confession Winman.You and others ridicule me for using and posting My links...so let's see what i am missing out on...give it a try...you already posted two paragraphs on effectual calling...the bb is slow right now anyway...go for it!:wavey:
     
  11. preacher4truth

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    Not one anti-cal has a thing to offer other than denigration.

    Not that this was an 'unexpected' reaction.

    Excellent OP Icon. :thumbsup:
     
  12. Benjamin

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    I believe this rather than what some one with a cult-like reputa...err faithful follower of some creed would try to shove down my throa...err..."help me" understand through some man-made phikosophical scriptural interpretations:

    Col 2:8
    (8)
    Beware lest any man spoil you through philosophy and vain deceit, after the tradition of men, after the rudiments of the world, and not after Christ.
     
    #12 Benjamin, Jul 6, 2013
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  13. DrJamesAch

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    This is what he's really going to do.

    It is obvious that there are several Non Calvinists on here that have listed verse after verse after verse of what we believe and why we believe it. Icon knows that. What he's attempting to do is create a catch 22 by tempting others to create a creed with simple terms that he KNOWS any one of has several verses memorized in support of each one, and then once finished, accuse you of creating a creed and doing the exact same thing he thinks we've accused them of.

    Nice try :))
     
  14. Winman

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    I have been posting scripture to support what I believe since I came here four years ago.

    Whatever subject I have participated in, I have shown the scripture that forms my view. All you have to do is go back and read my posts.

    And what have I gotten for showing scripture that supports my view? I have been called all sorts of names like heretic, Pelagian, recently I was called a Christadelphian (which I actually am familiar with) and all sorts of other false accusations.

    The criticism that I find most laughable is that several times I have been criticized for believing what the scriptures "say" and not what they "mean". Now that is the most ridiculous criticism in the world, because God says what he means. It is you folks that try to say scripture doesn't mean what it clearly says that are ridiculous. When I have showed probably dozens of verses that all say you must first believe to be regenerated, you folks ignore these many scriptures and insist you must be regenerated to have the ability to believe. If I ask for scripture to support this, you will not show scripture (because none exists) but say scripture "implies" your doctrine. What a load of pure BS!

    No thank you, I am not going to write out everything I believe to hear you and others call me names. I have been doing this from the beginning.

    It is you that cannot think for yourself. All you do is parrot what others tell you, I doubt you even understand what you profess you believe.

    If you did truly understand Calvinism, you would reject it in a heartbeat.
     
    #14 Winman, Jul 6, 2013
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  15. Iconoclast

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    Quit stalling Winman and get to it!.these are excuses.In the other thread AIC claims he uses only the scripture, but he could not post anything.Benjamin also was lame and would not even attempt it.
    So all of you..."scripture alone GUYS" have no confession of faith to the unsaved or young Christians out there worldwide ????
    If you have NO Confession of faith...perhaps you might want to be a little slower to be critical of us who use such tools...
     
  16. Winman

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    Nope, ain't fallin' for it. I have been showing scripture since I came here. If you have a particular subject you want to discuss, put your question out there, and if I think I can answer (because there are many subjects I do not have knowledge of), I will give you tons of scripture that you will simply ignore.
     
  17. quantumfaith

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    Hey Icon,

    I agree with reformers on two (but only two), The Apostle's and Nicene Creed.
     
  18. preacher4truth

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    A thing of beauty right here -- 1 Peter 3:15 -- and they have nothing.
     
  19. Benjamin

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    The first confession I might make to the unsaved is to begin on the surety that "in truth" that he understands that Jesus died for them and that they genuinely have "real" hope in the promises of God.

    If he started telling that he heard some of this pre-selected election doctrine nonsense and was thinking he might be one of the "unlucky" ones I'd possibly start my confession here about the fables he had heard and what I was about to tell him.


    2Ti 4:2-4
    (2)
    Preach the word; be instant in season, out of season; reprove, rebuke, exhort with all longsuffering and doctrine.
    (3) For the time will come when they will not endure sound doctrine; but after their own lusts shall they heap to themselves teachers, having itching ears;
    (4) And they shall turn away their ears from the truth, and shall be turned unto fables.
     
    #19 Benjamin, Jul 6, 2013
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  20. DrJamesAch

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    When I was 12 years old, I was forced in my childhood to memorize Genesis-Deuteronomy (You could say my parents were half Jewish, half Calviinist :)

    Between November and December of 2012, I finished memorizing the New Testament (finishing with Revelation). Thus, I do not need to carry a CREED around with me in order to give a ready defense of the gospel because I use different verses to prove the same doctrine to different people.

    For example, a person who does not believe the Trinity, but does not DENY the Trinity, I would simply use 1 John 5:7, John 1:1, 1 Tim 3:16, Matthew 28:19-20 (in the NAME [not names]), Acts 20:28, Genesis 1:26-28 (to show the pluralty of the Hebrew name for God), Romans 9:5, Titus 2:13, etc..

    But with a Jehovah's Witness I may use something entirely different. I would use Genesis 18:3-19:18 that shows that while Abraham was talking to 3 messengers in which he addressed all 3 as LORD, when the JW argues it was "the one in the middle" you can show how that Lot addressed the other 2 as Lord in chapter 19, thus showing that all 3 were the Lord.

    Thus there are some verses that need to be explained further, of which I would not put into a particular statement because it merits its own explanation of which is not obvious on its face (John 1:1 is obvious, Genesis 18:3-19:17,18 is not).

    I would also not use the same verses with the average unbeliever that I would use with a Jew. With the average unbeliever, I BEGIN with the New Testament. With a Jew, I begin with the OLD Testament beginning with the prophecies of Christ, verses that are not typically contained in a statement of faith because it is already implied or conceded that Jesus is the Messiah.

    I also have a system to memorize the New Testament within 5 years posted on another website, with an offer to provide at least 5-10 verses on EVERY major doctrine of the Bible of which I will explain if necessary. Thus I do not need to write out a creed or confession to support my views.

    But again, I do not have a problem with churches that use a statement of faith, or even the Confessions in and of themselves (although they are full of self-defeating and blatantly contradictory statements). It is when other RELY on those creeds as their FIRST and/or FINAL AUTHORITY ABOVE SCRIPTURE that I have a problem with.

    For example, Calvinism asserts that Calvinism IS the gospel. An unbeliever can not understand the gospel because of their depravity. But can an unbeliever understand how to be saved from the BIBLE ALONE? Not according to Calvinism because in Calvinism, the only way to understand Calvinism is to understand the CREEDS of Calvinism which presumptiously define "THE Gospel". Thus in order to understand the gospel, you have to understand Calvinism, in order to understand Calvinism, you have to know the Creeds: THAT ELEVATES THE CREEDS ABOVE THE BIBLE BECAUSE THEY NEED TO BE UNDERSTOOD FIRST BEFORE THE BIBLE CAN BE UNDERSTOOD ON ITS OWN.
     
    #20 DrJamesAch, Jul 6, 2013
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