Obama to sign law ending military gay ban

[SpiritualMadMan]

Salty, It looks promising.

But, when I was enlisted I had no choice when it came to which place they bunked me.

This is one reason I moved off base as soon as I was qualified to do so.

And, this housing only works for On base Housing...

Shipboard quarters are still going to be close and cramped for some time to come. Not to mention FOB's and other combat situated quarters.

Again, even non-coms aren't given a lot of choice who they are bunked with...

 

[sag38]

Besides, let's be honest, homosexuality is not the worst or most predominant of sins in the military. I think the accounts of soldiers' routine exploits speak for themselves. Having to serve next to a person who happens to be a homosexual isn't any worse than serving next to an adulterer.

It's bad enough having the enemy shooting at you without wondering whether the guy in the fox hole next to you wants to put a move on you or for a commander having to deal with two Marines having a lovers spat in the infantry platoon while out on patrol in the mountains of Afghanistan.

 

[Salty]

Again, even non-coms aren't given a lot of choice who they are bunked with...

When I was in Alaska in '86, as an E-6, (Staff Sgt) I was required to share a room with an E-5. Thought by then, I would rate a single room - oh well,
and about the Navy, I was told this story

E-9: Where are my quarters -
Navy: you get the top bunk
E-9: I am a Command Sgt major in the US Army
Navy: for this trip you are in the Navy!

Note: the story was told to me by the individual himself!

 

[abcgrad94]

When a h0mosexual who has been legally married in a State or Commonwealth that permits such immorality, joins the military, he has his "spouse" will be entitled to live in govt housing, be permitted to travel overseas at Government expense be entitled to free medical care, and received all other benefiters afforded the wife of a solider.

And for the most part, GI's will not be able to speak out against h0mosesuals. I wonder when it will be "recommended" that Chaplains not preach on Romans 8?

Exactly. This is more than homos being able to openly serve in the military. It's about forcing us to accept the lifestyle by funding it with our tax dollars. So, what happens when the federal government is paying for a "partner's" health care, etc. and the "couple" lives in a state that does not recognize their union? Guess who will be forced to accept, recognize, and possibly condone homo "marriage?"

What about a "couple" going to a chaplain for advice or counsel? Will that chaplain be forced to cater to their preferences or tell them what God says about their sin?

 

[billwald]

The obvious solution is to form all homo and all female units.

 

[poncho]

The obvious solution is to form all homo and all female units.

I was just wondering when we were going to swap in the older UN blue berets for newer rainbow berets.

 

[jaigner]

There are very few incidences among *our* troops as compared to any other force.

[snip] blown way out of proportaion by a war hating communist media [snip]

Lastly, if you have never been a LEO at a domestic disturbance call and seen how people under emotional stress are somewhat difficult to deal with, you can't even imagine what being in combat with people shooting at you..[snip]

I know the media is less than objective, but I hate war. Any Christian, no matter their convictions on the acceptability of it should still hate it. I hate that people, many of them innocent on both sides, have to be killed for any reason. I'm not saying it's always wrong, but it's still a horrible thing.

And the rest of what you said is puzzling - I never said anything about war being great or easy or that I really had any idea of what it was like, having never been in the middle of it. I don't see how anything you said relates to the homosexual issue.

Would it be acceptable to you if the military had the men and the women housed in the same common barracks. Would it be ok if they utilized the same open showers, latrines, and other "personal" areas?

I don't know how this has anything to do with the homosexual issue, either. Who said anything about coed housing? The heat of battle demands that some of the usual issues of propriety be overlooked, I'm sure. Good soldiers wouldn't let that happen.

Hey, I'll be honest. When I was in high school and college, being a musician and a music major, I had to go on many, many trips and overnight engagements in which I had to share lodging with gay men. Nobody ever made a pass at me. We were just there to do our jobs.

Plus, they were generally nice people, just as the other folks I was around were generally nice people - addicts, homosexuals, sexual deviants, gossips....whatever....

Requiring gays to conceal their homosexuality doesn't fix anything.

 

[matt wade]

I don't know how this has anything to do with the homosexual issue, either. Who said anything about coed housing?

Please just answer the questions.

Would it be acceptable to you if the military had the men and the women housed in the same common barracks? Would it be ok if they utilized the same open showers, latrines, and other "personal" areas?

 

[Salty]

... but I hate war. Any Christian, no matter their convictions on the acceptability of it should still hate it.

A real solider hates war. We train hard so we don't have to go to war. Part of the situation is that the current enemy does not think like we do. When they are willing to go on certain suicide missions - well theres not much you can do.

 

[SpiritualMadMan]

War *is* ugly...

But, sometimes Righteous People have no choice but to resist evil...

Psa 144:1 A Psalm of David. Blessed be the LORD my strength, which teacheth my hands to war, and my fingers to fight

Heb 12:4 In your struggle against sin, you have not yet resisted to the point of shedding your blood.

Luk 22:38 The disciples said, "See, Lord, here are two swords." "That is enough," he replied.

I know that these are not in strict context.

And, I also know there are scriptures which seem to contradict the above.

But, is the Gospel we preach only for men's souls?

If so might we be no better than the Crusaders, save them then see them killed?

This would probably make a good "new" Thread?

But, it would take a very large space and much reading to delineate all the Scripture where Jesus is called the Captain of the Lord's Host.

And, where David was victorious because he was led and empowered by God to wage war against the wicked.

I know all too often America has jumped into things where angels fear to tread.

But, in spite of all our rough edges we're about the only (marginally) Righteous Nation left in this earth.

Which is why we tend to be evryone else's target.

 

[Don]

A real solider hates war....

Yep. That's why we're treating so many cases of PTSD these days, because of the mental problems that we're finally recognizing and admitting that war causes.

Real soldiers don't "like" war...but they realize it's necessity.

If you're willing to lay down your life rather than renounce Jesus, then you understand why a soldier does what he does. Not because he likes death and destruction, but because of ideas and ideals that require sacrifice.

 

[Salty]

Don, just curious, are you a VET?

 

[SpiritualMadMan]

---snip---
If you're willing to lay down your life rather than renounce Jesus, then you understand why a soldier does what he does. Not because he likes death and destruction, but because of ideas and ideals that require sacrifice.

AMEN!

As regards to PTSD our own rules of engagement and the eggshells our troops are having to walk on to limit civilain casualties cannot be helping.

Also, I think the "World Owes Me" mentality makes boot camp and war even more traumatic.

I grew up doing duck and cover, the cuban missile crisis, and Viet Nam.

I have always assumed that at some point I would be put in a kill or be killed situation. Hasn't happened, yet... But, I think that that "prepared" mind set just isn't there like it once was...

And, all the video games in the world can't prepare you for the reality of combat.

Lastly, I think the churches attitude towards war and especially returning vets doesn't help either. The church seems to have abandoned the militacy of it's faith and it is showing up by regarding our returning troops as criminals and baby killers with about as much vigor as abortion.

But, we are getting into yet another thread...

 

[Salty]

AMEN!

....But, we are getting into yet another thread...

Maybe we should

Salty
ps - SMM, did you see the message I left on your profile?

 

[jaigner]

War *is* ugly... But, sometimes Righteous People have no choice but to resist evil...

I don't think we could have called the United States righteous at any point in our history. For many, it's been an oppressive and unjust place to live.

 

[jaigner]

Please just answer the questions.

Would it be acceptable to you if the military had the men and the women housed in the same common barracks? Would it be ok if they utilized the same open showers, latrines, and other "personal" areas?

Not in general, no.

 

[SpiritualMadMan]

I don't think we could have called the United States righteous at any point in our history. For many, it's been an oppressive and unjust place to live.

I am sorry that you feel that way...

Is there any place you would rather be?

Maybe we can take a collection for you.

 

[Don]

Don, just curious, are you a VET?

Depends on what you define as "vet." I'm definitely not a combat vet...but I guess that also depends on what you define as "combat." I've been in several situations where I wasn't in a position to shoot back, or wasn't even aware I was in a situation until receiving an intel report later. How's that?

I've learned that PTSD comes in many different forms, and exhibits in many different ways. Some people re-adjust really quickly; some don't. That guy who came back six months ago, and has displayed no problems on the job...but doesn't socialize, and/or seems to get angry really quick? Guess what?....

 

[Don]

Quote:

Originally Posted by matt wade
Please just answer the questions.

Would it be acceptable to you if the military had the men and the women housed in the same common barracks? Would it be ok if they utilized the same open showers, latrines, and other "personal" areas?

Not in general, no.

So why is it acceptable when it comes to hom0sexuals?

 

[Salty]

Depends on what you define as "vet." ..

If you wore the uniform of this country, whether in Combat, rear lines, stateside, National Guard or Reserve - you are a Vet!

When I ran for State Assembly a few years ago, I was talking to my opponent, I asked if he had served in the military. He told me that he was only in the Guard as a JAG officer, and he didn't feel like he was a Vet. I told him that since he wore the uniform, he should be proud to be a VET!!!

Salty

PS I served 15 years US Active Army, 8 years in State Guard