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Featured The Amorality of Music

Discussion in 'General Baptist Discussions' started by Sapper Woody, Jul 9, 2012.

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  1. Bro. James

    Bro. James Well-Known Member
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    A 5:30 a.m. CST kibbitz

    "Whatsoever is not of Faith is sin"

    How can a sinner define sin? We are totally depraved-- including our definitions of that which is divine. Our ways are not His; His ways not ours.

    We live in a world of self-righteous narcissists.

    Even so, come Lord Jesus.

    Peace,

    Bro. James
     
    #61 Bro. James, Jul 16, 2012
  2. 12strings

    12strings Active Member

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    RIGHT! So we must not define sin in ways that the bible does not!
     
    #62 12strings, Jul 16, 2012
  3. OldRegular

    OldRegular Well-Known Member

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    In my former life as an engineer the term semantic engineering was often used in reference to certain engineering reports, that is, words were used to obfuscate an issue!

    Sometimes I believe there is more semantic engineering on this forum than theological or Christian discussion. This issue related to music is certainly evidence!

    Sapper Woody,

    Your remarks above are well said, appreciated by me, and I believe correct.

    I know little about music other than it is/was at one time defined as a sound pleasing to the ears. Therefore, a lot of noise is made and called music that I reject.

    I believe I made this point earlier but instrumental "music" alone can excite both positive and negative emotions. I simply refer to the musical scores for movies, particularly the "no talkies".

    Much of the music I have listened to over the years is instrumental only, some classical, some folk, some 40"s, 50"s, 60's. I listen to music that is pleasant to the ears, not "negative thought" inducing noise; and by negative I mean music that invokes sinful/evil thoughts! And "folks" please don't say that instrumental music alone cannot produce such thoughts. We all know it can and does!
     
    #63 OldRegular, Jul 16, 2012
  4. 12strings

    12strings Active Member

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    -Some music is pleasing to some ears, but not others.

    Just for the record...this is me saying that "instrumental music ALONE cannot produce such [sinful] thoughts..."
     
    #64 12strings, Jul 16, 2012
  5. 12strings

    12strings Active Member

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    BTW, I'm still waiting for someone to describe specifically and MUSICALLY what moves an instrumental music from being edifying to sinful...

    If I were to adopt that there is such a thing, and I were sitting down with my guitar, At what point would my practicing become sinful?
    -loud strumming?
    -slow, minor keys that cause me to become depressed?
    -What if I started a metronome and only strummed on beats 2 & 4?

    Or...if a guitar alone cannot produce sinful music, what about drums?
    -is a simple [Bass, Bass, Snare, REST] beat sinful?
    -Is it the 2 & 4 emphasis? (if so, is all 3/4 music OK?)
    -Is a syncopated latin beat sinful?


    I know this sounds Like I'm beating this thing to death, but I want to show that there is way BIBLICALLY to make a link to something MUSICAL and declare it sinful for all people at all times.
     
    #65 12strings, Jul 16, 2012
  6. Bro. James

    Bro. James Well-Known Member
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    More semantics engineering:

    "The part is not per drawing"--use as is--form, fit, function not affected. We use such engineering dispositions to go into near earth orbit. Shuttle Columbia plus crew were lost--human error. Challenger could probably be on the same list--human error plus politics.

    We seem to be hung up on what amorality means. There may be some nuances. "A"--in front of a root word usually means without. If one thinks of this as lacking good or bad tendancies, some would agree. i.e. Music of itself is not good or bad--it is what one does with it that makes it good or bad. The basic definition of amoral which I have is: lack of a moral code--in the human sense. i.e. If it feels good it is O.K. indicates a loose moral code. We live in an amoral society. Abortion is legal--now called freedom of choice not murder. Homosexuality is now alternative lifestyle instead of abomination. Curious: we have a lot of white collar crime--some get caught and go to jail. Many seem to have impunity. Some even get re-elected. Where are the conspiracy folks?

    Man is totally depraved.

    Even so, come Lord Jesus.

    Peace,

    Bro. James
     
    #66 Bro. James, Jul 16, 2012
  7. Berean

    Berean Member
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    There are two kinds of sounds; music and noise. Music is that which is pleasing to the ear and noise is that which is displeasing. Children laughing is music while the same children fussing is noise. Music may be the sound of water from a babbeling brook or the sound of rain in July or August while yet thunder is noise.
     
    #67 Berean, Jul 16, 2012
  8. Sapper Woody

    Sapper Woody Well-Known Member

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    After giving it lots of thought, I am willing to make a concession here.

    First, I want to talk about some things that people cite as being wrong in music, since people seem too afraid to answer you about the 3/4 beat, etc. I personally do not hold to all of these ideas, but want to explain the position of those that do, again since it seems no one will answer you.

    We'll start with the 3/4 beat. Those that hold that the beat has to be on the 1 and 3 believe that the 3/4 beat has to have a diminishing emphasis. That is the first beat is emphasized, the second less so, and the third beat least. ONE, Two, three. If you listen to traditional waltzes, the bass kick will be on the one, followed by either a snare or closed hi hat for the two and three.

    6/8 is similar, with ONE, Two, three, FOUR, Five, six. 2/4 is ONE, two, ONE, two.

    Another example used is unresolved suspended 4ths. If I play the notes C, F, G on the piano, this is a C sus4. The natural resolution is to then change the F to an E, making a Cmaj. This is supposed to create a tension without a resolution. THe mind wants the resolution, and the body reacts to it (especially if you are OCD at all), but it does not "pay out". This is a form of "defrauding", and the Bible states that we are not to defraud one another. Defrauding in the modern sense is closely related to taking money, but also has the meaning of raising expectations and not following through.

    Somnething else typically talked about is the "sliding in" of a note of a vocalist (which I realize isn't exactly the topic, as we are discussing instrumentals), used often in Country music, where the vocalist will hit the note a half step below the correct note and slide in. Some have said that this is portraying the vocalist as inept and unable to perform, when in reality they can. Another type of deception, and also a bad picture of the Christian who is to strive to be perfect.

    This same thing is often used by country pianists. There is a move called the "Floyd Cramer", or simply, "The Floyd". It was discovered by Floyd Cramer when he accidentally hit a wrong note and and quickly corrected, and it actually sounded good. Using the key of C as an example, you'd hit the D and G, and quickly correct the D to an E.

    Yet another example is the "driving beat", or playing an emphasis on every beat. This is most typically found when a bass kick will hit every beat, or when a bass guitarist plays something actually called a "driving bass". For the drums, a typical rock rythm is to play the bass kick every beat, or 4x per measure. Play the closed hi hat 2x per beat, or 8x per measure, and play the snare on the 2 and 4. This creates a very driving rythm.

    On the bass guitar in a 4/4 song, a driving rythm is created when the bass is strumming the same note 2 times per beat, often walking the 8th hit to the next bass note. (C,C,C,C,C,C,C, E, F,F,F,F,F,F,F,A,G,G,G,G,G,G,G,F,C,etc.) Even though this is associated with the drums and bass guitar, it can easily be emulated by the piano. Especially is ballads, where you add the 2 to the chord. In the key of C, you'd be playing the C, D, E, and G. And you'd be hitting that chord on every beat, creating the driving rythm. Similarly, the guitar can be used, but it sounds monotonous, as it would be a single downstroke and a single upstroke on every beat.

    A driving rythm is very appealing to the flesh, and is often used in montages in movies, and if "pump up" music, such as fighter introductions in boxing or UFC. It's used in techno/dance/electronic music a lot. The physical effect of these musics is literally mind numbing. That is why it is associated with the use of ecstacy, etc, in clubs, as the music contributes to the high that has already been gotten by the drug.

    The problem people have with syncopation is similar to the beat being emphasized on the 2/4 instead of the 1/3. However, I have found that what most people call synchopation when they use this as a negative example isn't even synchopation. Synchopation is simply hitting a note slightly before or after the beat, instead of on the beat. The problem that some people have with this is that it breaks the even flow of the music, alerting you again to the music. It is something of an attention getter, bringing the focus back to the music instead of whatever the music is about, ie; glorifying God.

    Now that I've explained several of the positions held by people, I'll get to the concession that I am willing to make. I am going to liken music to alcohol for the sake of discussion. You've made it known that you believe that alcohol is ok for a Christian. For the sake of this example, I am going to agree with you. Where do you draw the line? I am going to make the assumption that you draw the line at getting drunk, as many on the board have stated.

    So, how many beers is that? Well, it's different for each person. For a teetotaller, it would be smaller than for someone who regularly partakes. It's different for people of differeing weights and body fat content. It's different for men and women.

    So, the concession that I am going to make is to retract my statement of an absolute line for all, and that there is no strict line found in the Bible, because each person has a different "tolerance". Right now, my roommate is playing some heavy metal, rage screaming music, and it isn't making me angry at all. I am not enjoying it, but it isn't affecting me.

    So, for the strictest definition of amoral as you put forward, I will agree that music in and of itself cannot be sinful. But I will still stand by my statement that the act listening to certain music can be sinful, and that certain types of music cannot be reconciled to the glory of God.

    Remember, Satan was the music maker in Heaven. He knows a lot about music. And he likes to create perversions of things that God has made. It's no jump to me that there is music that inherently glorifies God (even devoid of lyrics) and music that inherently glorifies Satan (again, even devoid of lyrics). Now, my roommate is playing some other song ( I don't know it), and it has no lyrics. But just the sound of the heavy metal does not bring into my mind images of beauty and holiness. It brings into my mind images of death and destruction.

    I apologize for the wall of text, but I believe that some stances needed to be explained, as it seems that no one was willing to step forward and explain them.
     
    #68 Sapper Woody, Jul 17, 2012
  9. Gregory Perry Sr.

    Gregory Perry Sr. Active Member

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    The "smoke and mirrors" of neutrality

    It has been many months since I last posted on the BB but this one definitely aroused my interest as it is something that has generated more than one discussion between myself and others including the very talented and dedicated music director at my own church. To say that music (of any genre) is amoral is to basically say that it is for all practical purposes NEUTRAL and without effect in and of itself for good OR evil. I say that the burden of proving that assertion should fall to those who would attempt to use <insert your favorite genre here> for the purpose of worshipping a HOLY GOD...which by the way,in my opinion, IS the purpose of the gift of music as spoken of in Colossians 3:16-17. Worship music is OUR music..given to us as a gift of God for the purpose of praising and worshipping Him.If it,of itself, appeals to the lost people around us then something may be wrong. That OUGHT to "raise the bar" as to what is and isn't acceptable SIGNIFICANTLY and cause us to have a very high standard in the matter....don't you all think? Let's not allow overly liberal,self-justifying views of "Christian liberty" to cheapen the level of excellence the worship of our Holy God deserves. Just my humble opinion. By the way...I have enjoyed this discussion immensely though it has been,at times,somewhat polarised. God Bless Ya'll.(I'm from South Cacalacky):smilewinkgrin:

    A.W.Tozer said," Worship is no longer worship when it reflects the culture around us more than the Christ within us."

    I think that statement would fit this subject under discussion rather nicely.

    Blessings to All,
    Greg Perry Sr.
    Pickens,SC
     
    #69 Gregory Perry Sr., Jul 17, 2012
  10. Gregory Perry Sr.

    Gregory Perry Sr. Active Member

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    Thank You Woody

    While I'm thinking about it .....Woody....I take it you are deployed right now and I just want to take the opportunity to thank you for your service for our country and let you know that I am (as soon as I finish this post) praying for your safety and the safety of those with whom you serve. God Bless You and keep your head down. I pray you'll get to come home soon. Watch your six...many of those people over there are just plain crazy! I have a son in the National Guard and one that recently got out of the Marine Corp. If you'd like to email me directly sometime my email is: [email protected] God Bless you brother.

    Greg Perry Sr.:godisgood:
     
    #70 Gregory Perry Sr., Jul 17, 2012
  11. 12strings

    12strings Active Member

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    Thanks for the reply, and I'm going to respond briefly to your descriptions below, even though I understand that these are not YOUR personal positions...I'm simply giving my reasons for anyone else reading as to why I don't think these musical items necessarily bring sinful effects.

     
    #71 12strings, Jul 17, 2012
  12. Yeshua1

    Yeshua1 Well-Known Member
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    MUST Christians ONLY listen then to christian music? If yes, I have to repent,as I still like to listen to Elvis and motown! Along with Imperials, Steven Curtis Chapman, Third Act etc!

    And BOTH my Childrens church admin and Sr pastor like still the beatles!
     
    #72 Yeshua1, Jul 17, 2012
  13. nodak

    nodak Active Member
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    The real issue is the immoral way music is being used in churches!

    And no, not any specific type of music.

    What I speak of is the mountains of research showing how humans react to different musical forms, beats, tones, dissonance, etc.

    Advertising industry has done so much study on it that it is amazing--those guys know exactly what music will get which response from our bodies and our minds.

    And now the churches are using it to manipulate, rather than depend on the Holy Spirit.

    ALMOST enough to send me packing to the Presbies and use just the Psalter and no instruments:)
     
    #73 nodak, Jul 17, 2012
  14. Gregory Perry Sr.

    Gregory Perry Sr. Active Member

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    Rock Music as Christian Music...I Don't Think So!

    The following are selected excerpts from an article published by David Cloud of WayOfLife.org on the "Character and Philosophy Of Rock & Roll Music".I had to edit it due to the length of the article but I strongly encourage all to go to his website and read it in it's entirety for an honest look at the subject. The article focuses primarily on the quoted statements of the musicians and music industry professionals as to the character,purpose,musical make-up and nature of their "product". Anyone who can read this stuff and still try to tell me that Rock music should be used to attempt to worship our Holy God has....and I say this with genuine sadness....rocks in your head (no pun intended). Colossians 3:16-17 sets,I think,the appropriate tone for where we ought all to go musically...not back to the most base and carnal form of "entertainment" ever created. Check out the following...but be honest and objective as you read it....please:As always...my personal disclaimer is that this is just my own humble opinion....BUT I'M STICKING TO IT!

    ROCK AND ROLL IS NOT JUST MUSIC; IT IS A LIFESTYLE, AN ATTITUDE

    The book Rock Facts, which is published by the Rock and Roll Hall of Fame and Museum in Cleveland, Ohio, admits that rock is not just a type of music, IT IS A LIFESTYLE. “… rock and roll has truly become a universal language … rock and roll also refers to an attitude, a feeling, a style, a way of life…” (Rock Facts, 1996, p. 7)


    ROCK AND ROLL IS ABOUT REBELLION AND LIVING AS YOU PLEASE

    “It’s my life and I’ll do what I want/ It’s my mind, and I’ll think what I want” (The Animals, 1965)


    “The whole Beatles idea was to do what you want … do what thou wilst, as long as it doesn’t hurt somebody” (John Lennon, cited by David Sheff, The Playboy Interviews with John Lennon and Yoko Ono, p. 61).


    “Most of it [rock music] is used as a vehicle for anti-Christian propaganda” (Graham Cray, appendix to J. & M. Prince, Time to Listen, Time to Talk, cited in Pop Goes the Gospel, p. 86).

    “Rock music has got the same message as before. It is anti-religious, anti-nationalistic and anti-morality. But now I understand what you have to do. You have to put the message across with a little honey on it” (John Lennon, spoken not long before his death in 1980, Pop Goes the Gospel, p. 84).


    “Rock concerts are the churches of today. Music puts them on a spiritual plane. All music is God” (Craig Chaquico, Jefferson Airplane guitarist, Why Knock Rock?, p. 96).


    “Rock ‘n’ roll marked the beginning of the revolution. … We’ve combined youth, music, sex, drugs, and rebellion with treason, and that’s a combination hard to beat” (Jerry Rubin, Do It!, 1970, pp. 19, 249).


    “The main purpose of rock and roll is celebration of the self” (Daryl Hall of Hall and Oates, interview with Timothy White, 1987, Rock Lives, p. 594).

    “There is actually very little melody, little sense in the lyrics, only rhythm [in rock music]. The fact that music can both excite and incite has been known from time immemorial. … Now in our popular music, at least, we seem to be reverting to savagery … and youngsters who listen constantly to this sort of sound are thrust into turmoil. They are no longer relaxed, normal kids” (Dimitri Tiomkin, Los Angeles Herald-Examiner, Aug. 8, 1965; Dr. Tiomkin is a famous composer and conductor).


    Gene Simmons of Kiss said: “What I write is pretty much a belief in a certain lifestyle which is a free soul, a free person, doing basically what he wants to do without hurting anybody else” (WCCO-TV, Five P.M. Report, Feb. 18, 1983).


    ROCK AND ROLL IS ABOUT SEX AND LICENTIOUS LIVING

    “If any music has been guilty by association, it is rock music. It would be impossible to make a complete list, but here are a few of the ‘associates’ of rock: drug addicts, revolutionaries, rioters, Satan worshippers, drop-outs, draft- dodgers, homosexuals and other sex deviates, rebels, juvenile criminals, Black Panthers and White Panthers, motorcycle gangs, blasphemers, suicides, heathenism, voodooism, phallixism, Communism in the United States (Communist Russian outlawed rock music around 1960), paganism, lesbianism, immorality, demonology, promiscuity, free love, free sex, disobedience (civil and uncivil), sodomy, venereal disease, discotheques, brothels, orgies of all kinds, night clubs, dives, strip joints, filthy musicals such as ‘Hair’ and ‘Uncle Meat’; and on and on the list could go almost indefinitely” (Frank Garlock, The Big Beat, pp. 1 2-13).

    “That’s what rock is all about--sex with a 100 megaton bomb, the beat!” (Gene Simmons of the rock group Kiss, interview, Entertainment Tonight, ABC, Dec. 10, 1987).

    “The throbbing beat of rock-and-roll provides a vital sexual release for its adolescent audience” (Jan Berry of Jan and Dean, cited by Blanchard, Pop Goes the Gospel).

    “Rock ’n’ roll is synonymous with sex and you can’t take that away from it. It just doesn’t work” (Steven Tyler, Entertainment Tonight, ABC, Dec. 10, 1987).

    “When you’re in a certain frame of mind, particularly sexually-oriented, there’s nothing better than rock and roll … because that’s where most of the performers are at” (Aerosmith’s manager, USA Today, Dec. 22, 1983, p. D5).


    “Rock is the perfect primal method of releasing our violent instincts” (Ted Nugent, rock musician, Circus, May 13,1984

    “Rock and roll aims for liberation and transcendence, eroticizing the spiritual and spiritualizing the erotic, because that is its ecumenical birthright” (Robert Palmer, Rock & Roll an Unruly History, p. 72).


    “Listen, rock ‘n’ roll ain’t church. It’s nasty business. You gotta be nasty too. If you’re goody, goody, you can’t sing or play it...” (Lita Ford of heavy metal group The Runaways, Los Angeles Times, August 7, 1988).

    “Rock ‘n’ roll is pagan and primitive, and very jungle, and that’s how it should be! The moment it stops being those things, it’s dead … the true meaning of rock … is sex, subversion and style” (Malcolm McLaren, punk rock manager, Rock, August 1983, p. 60).


    “The present rock ‘n’ roll scene, Lennon’s legacy, is one giant, multi-media portrait of degradation--a sleezy world of immorality, venereal disease, anarchy, nihilism, cocaine, heroin, marijuana, death, Satanism, perversion, and orgies” (David Noebel, The Legacy of John Lennon, 1982, p. 15).

    “The themes of rock 'n' roll include rebellion, homosexuality, satanism, the occult, drugs, murder, suicide, incest, vulgarity, sadomasochism, anti-patriotism and above all, free sex” (Fletcher Brothers, Rock Report, Lancaster: Starburst Publishing, 1987).


    “[Our music is intended] to change one set of values to another … free minds … free dope … free bodies … free music” (Paul Kantner of the Jefferson Airplane, cited by Ben Fong-Torres, “Grace Slick with Paul Kantner,” The Rolling Stone Interviews, 1971, p. 447).


    “Rock 'n roll doesn't glorify God. You can't drink out of God's cup and the devil's cup at the same time. I was one of the pioneers of that music, one of the builders. I know what the blocks are made of because I built them” (Little Richard, The Dallas Morning News, Oct. 29, 1978, p. 14A).

    “[The Rolling Stones] are raw, sloppy, savage, oppressively intense, base, bolsh, scurvy, mean, mesmerizing, cold, perverse, raunchy, decadent, and self-indulgent revolutionaries. ... Their music is rugged, sinewy, insinuating ... IT REFLECTS THEIR WAY OF LIVING” (Michael Ross, Rock Beyond Woodstock, p. 13).


    ROCK MUSIC IS ADDICTIVE AND HYPNOTIC

    “Rock music is an ideal vehicle for individual or mass hypnosis” (Andrew Salter, Pop Goes the Gospel, p. 20).


    “Atmospheres are going to come through music, because the music is a spiritual thing of its own ... you hypnotize people to where they go right back to their natural state which is pure positive the subconscious what we want to say ... People want release any kind of way nowadays. The idea is to release in the proper form. Then they’ll feel like going into another world, a clearer world. The music flows from the air; that’s why I connect with a spirit, and when they come down off this natural high, they see clearer, feel different things...” (Jimi Hendrix, rock star, Life, Oct. 3, 1969, p. 74).


    “Don’t listen to the words, it’s the music that has its own message. ... I’ve been stoned on the music many times” (Timothy Leary, New Age guru and promoter of LSD, Politics of Ecstasy).

    “[Rock music] is the strongest drug in the world” (Steven Tyler of Aerosmith, Rock Beat, Spring 1987, p. 23).

    Janis Joplin, who died young from the rock & roll lifestyle, describes her first big concert in these words: “I couldn’t believe it, all that rhythm and power. I got stoned just feeling it, like IT WAS THE BEST DOPE IN THE WORLD. It was SO SENSUAL, so vibrant, loud, crazy” (Joel Dreyfuss, “Janis Joplin Followed the Script,” Wichita Eagle, Oct. 6, 1970, p. 7A).

    Sad but still true,
    Greg Perry Sr.
     
    #74 Gregory Perry Sr., Jul 19, 2012
  15. Bro. James

    Bro. James Well-Known Member
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    Good information.

    But it feels so good. How could it be so deviate?

    We love to assemble and applaud ourselves and others--a mutual admiration society of the depraved. Cain had a similar problem--changing the offering--produced the first murder.

    We all have sin at our doorsteps--in our houses as well.

    Do we really understand that all of our righteousness is filthy rags?

    Behold the Lamb of God which takes away the sin of the world.

    Peace,

    Bro. James
     
    #75 Bro. James, Jul 19, 2012
  16. 12strings

    12strings Active Member

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    Greg,

    I have read most or all of these quotes years ago, and am not convinced.

    1. I do agree that Co. 3:16-17 is one of the good base verses in scripture that should guide our worship or God...however, It does not define musical style. There is much debate about what "spiritual songs" were, and the OT psalms were sung with "Loud Cymbals".

    2. I'm going to go out on a limb and say that Rock music is NOT THE MOST BASE and carnal form of entertainment ever created...P*rnography would be worse, for one.

    3. I'm sorry you feel I have rocks in my head, but I am not willing to call something a sin that scripture does not call a sin.

    4. With all the debaseness that goes on around rock music in the world, it brings to mind the pagan worship that went on in Paul's day...and yet Paul was willing to take something that had been thoroughly involved in that pagan worship (the meat) and say that in an of itself there was nothing wrong with it. It could be redeemed. Secular artists can tell you all day long that they have created something that is irredeemable, but their opinion is not the one I am basing my life choices on. An Atheist Painter who paints an ape to prove evolution could do it for all the wrong reasons, and insist that their painting was created for the express purpose of disproving God, but a Christian could look at the painting and glorify God for his creative works.

    5. Again, if I did decide that Rock Music was evil...how would we define it? What makes it different than a Sousa march, or a very suspenseful, dissonant symphony from the romantic period? If I am sitting in my office with my guitar, how do I know if I'm playing good music or bad music. And remember, to have merit, this answer must be linked somehow to scriptural commands or restrictions.
     
    #76 12strings, Jul 19, 2012
  17. 12strings

    12strings Active Member

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    #77 12strings, Jul 19, 2012
  18. IANMO(IAMNTMYOWN)

    IANMO(IAMNTMYOWN) New Member

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    I had a friend who really enjoyed rock music. To tell the truth, I knew that the genre was wrong, but could hardly support my arguments. I really believed what I did just because my parents had told me so since I was small. Not that that is a bad reason, but being-college aged, it just doesn't fly as a a strong argument in our debates.

    I did some research and read the series by Jeff Godwin including his best seller Dancing with Demons. I would highly recommend his books. He can be somewhat abrasive, but he gives good insight.
     
    #78 IANMO(IAMNTMYOWN), Jul 19, 2012
  19. 12strings

    12strings Active Member

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    BTW, since we're recommending resources...I would recomend John Frame's book CONTEMPORARY WORSHIP MUSIC: A BIBLICAL DEFENSE. It is very good, and written by a man who comes from a regulative principle background.
     
    #79 12strings, Jul 19, 2012
  20. Gregory Perry Sr.

    Gregory Perry Sr. Active Member

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    Be better informed...& less compromised

    Dear Brother 12 Strings (and I love the sound of a good 12 string guitar!), I note where you mentioned reading those quotes "years ago and am not being convinced"....hummmm. That is strange to me since we must also approach the Word of God the same way and accept the quoted word for what it in fact is...The Word of God and accept the testimony of the Author,the Holy Spirit of God . As for the music....what better can we ask for than the WORDS of the ones who create and perform the music? Kind of defeats the purpose of quoting sources (bibliographies) if we are not willing to accept what they actually say about their "work". If that is the way you approach things when facts are presented then you,for all practical purposes set yourself up to be the "judge" of what is and isn't the truth (at least for yourself)(quite convenient,don't you think?) Anyway...enough about "liberty"...or "being in denial". I point everybody to another of Bro.Cloud's articles entitled,"Christian Rockers and Secular Rockers United". Again,Bro.Cloud simply allows the folks involved in CCM and "Christian" Rock to speak for themselves.Just follow the link below and read for yourselves...it is a long article...but sometimes it is best to give someone plenty of rope to hang themselves on so they can do a good job of it!
    Christian Rockers and Secular Rockers United | Rock Music

    I have no desire to be offensive to anyone. I just want us to use the common sense that God gave us when He created us in His own image and which He has begun to restore in us day by day (since He saved us)as He works out His work of sanctification in our lives. It has been my belief since being saved that when God doesn't give a specific "Thou Shalt"..or "Shalt Not" about something in scripture,He at least provides a scriptural principle to govern things with. That has always proven true to me in my view even when I didn't like what I found out(and sometimes rebelled against...to my own shame and loss). It is His desire to "conform us to the image of His dear Son". That work is hampered when we 'conform more to the world around us than to the Christ within us'...as Dr.Tozer once said. If we are to win as many as possible to Christ before He comes we need to live holy,separated lives and be the salt and light God left us here to be. Make no mistake...God has His music....and the Devil most certainly has his as well. We need to always inspect the fruit from the standpoint of Biblical and doctrinal purity (as well as the nature of the music itself)and pray for godly discernment as to what is truth and what is error. There is much error in the day we live in and the spirit of apostasy is growing as the time of the end nears. Much to think about but most necessary.

    Peace Ya'll,
    Bro.Greg Perry Sr.:type:
     
    #80 Gregory Perry Sr., Jul 19, 2012
    Last edited by a moderator: Jul 19, 2012
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