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Featured Totalitarianism

Discussion in 'Political Debate & Discussion' started by Crabtownboy, Mar 7, 2017.

  1. Crabtownboy

    Crabtownboy Well-Known Member
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    Hannah Arendt said this in an interview with The New Yorker in 1974. Her words have very scary contemporary ring describing our current situation in this country.
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    Totalitarianism begins in contempt for what you have. The second step is the notion: “Things must change—no matter how, Anything is better than what we have.” Totalitarian rulers organize this kind of mass sentiment, and by organizing it articulate it, and by articulating it make the people somehow love it. They were told before, thou shalt not kill; and they didn’t kill. Now they are told, thou shalt kill; and although they think it’s very difficult to kill, they do it because it’s now part of the code of behavior. They learn whom to kill and how to kill and how to do it together. This is the much talked about Gleichschaltung—the coordination process. You are coordinated not with the powers that be, but with your neighbor—coordinated with the majority. But instead of communicating with the other you are now glued to him. And you feel of course marvelous. Totalitarianism appeals to the very dangerous emotional needs of people who live in complete isolation and in fear of one another.


    http://www.nybooks.com/articles/1978/10/26/hannah-arendt-from-an-interview/


     
  2. Yeshua1

    Yeshua1 Well-Known Member
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    That described the Obama administration pretty well!
     
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  3. just-want-peace

    just-want-peace Well-Known Member
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    The ZERO's mantra was 'HOPE AND CHANGE' ! Course he very conveniently neglected to specify what "CHANGE" he had in mind, and the "HOPE" part was just psychological mumbo-jumbo.:Mad
    Trump has spelled out his "CHANGE", and the "HOPE" part just automatically comes with his proposed changes.
    Could this be a trap??? Sure, but there was/is no doubt what the alternative would have been, and that alone is reason for "HOPE" now!:):)
     
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  4. JonC

    JonC Moderator
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    I was thinking exactly the same thing. In fact, "change" was Obama's platform. (In truth, it could be applied to just about any political race...to include President Trump).
     
  5. Yeshua1

    Yeshua1 Well-Known Member
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    President Obama was the anti Reagan, as President Clinton was bad, but not THAT bad!
     
  6. FollowTheWay

    FollowTheWay Well-Known Member
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    President Obama could have done some great things for America. Instead the do-nothing Republicans in Congress made blocking everything he tried to accomplish as their one and only objective for 8 years.
     
  7. InTheLight

    InTheLight Well-Known Member
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    Why didn't he do these things in the years 2009-2010 when the Dems controlled all three branches? Nothing the Reps could have done to stop him. In fact, he got the stimulus bill passed with only one Republican vote and he got ObamaCare passed with no Republican votes. Why didn't he pass tax increases? Why didn't he close Gitmo? Why didn't he do a bunch of stuff he could have done?
     
  8. JonC

    JonC Moderator
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    Looking at what President Obama did accomplish, who can blame the Republican Congress? Maybe those unrealized plans would have been great for our country. But it is only logical to judge the man by his fruit, not his promises.
     
  9. InTheLight

    InTheLight Well-Known Member
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    Liberals only need good intentions. It doesn't matter what, or even if, they do anything. Just wanting to do something is good enough.
     
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  10. Crabtownboy

    Crabtownboy Well-Known Member
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    Then Trump has already failed miserably. He has created division, hate and bigotry during his campaign and is continuing during his term in office. He fits the description in the OP perfectly.
     
  11. JonC

    JonC Moderator
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    The division, hate, and bigotry that you are now attributing to President Trump is the same division, hate, and bigotry that you've always spoken of on this forum. It is the same thing that you accused others of creating against BLM, against President Obama, and against the Obama administration. It is the same division, hate, and bigotry that you've accused those who opposed illegal immigration of holding. It is the same division, hate, and bigotry that you've accused of the political "pro-life agenda". It is the same division, hate, and bigotry that you see in law enforcement, and in businesses.

    When I was taking psychology and working in the mental health field, one of the points that was driven home was to be observant. When a person accuses a multitude of people they oppose of certain negative attributes it is typically projection. They see division, hate, and bigotry under every rock because it is one of their own defining traits, although perhaps they are unaware. I'm not saying this is you, but I am saying you've been crediting everyone who does not hold your agenda as divisive, hateful bigots. Having read this for so long, please understand why it is so easily dismissed now.
     
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  12. Happy

    Happy Well-Known Member
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    "Totalitarianism begins in contempt for what you have. The second step is the notion: “Things must change—no matter how, Anything is better than what we have.”"
    - Hannah Arendt

    Conservatives do not have contempt for what they have. They worked hard for what they have. The contempt is they would like to KEEP what is theirs, VOID of a Government compulsion to give what is theirs to others who WANT what the others HAVE.

    The "no matter how" is a Liberal theme particularly favored for the Government to first do the stealing, then dole it out to others the Government deems "qualified" to receive the "booty".

    1Tim.5
    1. [8] But if any provide not for his own, and specially for those of his own house, he hath denied the faith, and is worse than an infidel.
     
  13. Happy

    Happy Well-Known Member
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    Division, Hate and Bigotry?

    Trump certainly has been lawfully seated in a seat of power, but really, giving him credit for YOUR feelings of division, hate and bigotry is a tad childish, don't ya think?

    We learn from Scripture Jesus came to DIVIDE. So naturally, some will sit on the outside and complain, while others will go to the door and receive the comfort of the truth and understanding, which FYI is not on the outside.

    Everyone can choose to be an asset or a burden.
    An asset works with his hands. A burden is looking for a handout.
    Trump is looking for people to be an asset for the healing of this Country.
    If Trumps efforts are not QUICK enough for YOU, perhaps too many are still standing on the outside, waiting to see what they can GET instead of what they can DO. Be patient. God is faithful and many have sought Him for the healing of our land. :)

    Luke.12
    1. [51] Suppose ye that I am come to give peace on earth? I tell you, Nay; but rather division:
    1Tim.5
    1. [8] But if any provide not for his own, and specially for those of his own house, he hath denied the faith, and is worse than an infidel.
    2Chr.7
    1. [14] If my people, which are called by my name, shall humble themselves, and pray, and seek my face, and turn from their wicked ways; then will I hear from heaven, and will forgive their sin, and will heal their land.



    Rom.8
    1. [25] But if we hope for that we see not, then do we with patience wait for it.
     
  14. HankD

    HankD Well-Known Member
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    Thou shalt not kill CTB? - Harry Truman (D) ordered two atomic bombs to be dropped on Japan (Hiroshima and Nagasaki) disintegrating about a quarter million people; was that totalitarianism? No, it was survival.

    Today America is in survival mode.

    To quote a cliche - "Wake up and smell the napalm"

    HankD
     
  15. Crabtownboy

    Crabtownboy Well-Known Member
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    You take a post about one person and then generalize it to attempt to defend that single person. That is not logical nor correct.

    First let's look at the OP:

    Totalitarianism begins in contempt for what you have. The second step is the notion: “Things must change—no matter how, Anything is better than what we have.” Totalitarian rulers organize this kind of mass sentiment, and by organizing it articulate it, and by articulating it make the people somehow love it. They were told before, thou shalt not kill; and they didn’t kill. Now they are told, thou shalt kill; and although they think it’s very difficult to kill, they do it because it’s now part of the code of behavior. They learn whom to kill and how to kill and how to do it together. This is the much talked about Gleichschaltung—the coordination process. You are coordinated not with the powers that be, but with your neighbor—coordinated with the majority. But instead of communicating with the other you are now glued to him. And you feel of course marvelous. Totalitarianism appeals to the very dangerous emotional needs of people who live in complete isolation and in fear of one another.

    If you break this down into the ideas presented you see that Trump is at heart a totalitarian at heart. You also see that many of his followers and voters said "Anything is better than what we have." That is never true. Some things may be better, but not everything. Trump though his attacks made racism and bigotry acceptable to far too many in our society. He brought out the dark underbelly that has lurked pretty much under the surface.

    The final sentence says it all and that is what Trump tried and achieved, appealing to the dangerous emotional needs of people.

    There is nothing Christian in his approach to winning the election or in his actions as president so far.

    Remember as you respond, this is about the desire to be a totalitarian by our sitting president, not about everyone in society.

    Exambles of others who had this bent were:

    Mao in China.
    Mugabe in Zimhabwe
    [There are many more, but you get my drift.]

    Look at totalitarian governments throughout history and see how he fits their pattern. Thank God we have checks and balances and let us pray that these protections are not abridged.


    .
     
  16. JonC

    JonC Moderator
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    If you were to come to a family reunion, you’d find a very multi-ethnic, working class bunch. I remember my father arguing against the KKK rallies held when I was a child. And I remember some issues with the Black Panthers. He always emphasized the equality of those two groups – although the people supported and the people victimized were different, the racism was identical. Evil cannot be wielded to make good as it corrupts the one holding it. This is the nature of evil, not just racism.

    The situation of this past election was one of people being discontent with the evil in their nation. It was a circumstance where men and women voted against forwarding this evil across another term. This type of discontent and desire for change is in no way, shape, or form connected to the article of the OP. Totalitarianism exists when men and women allow evil to continue, and do nothing about it.

    I think it obvious that the Obama administration was “anti-Christ”, but insofar as racism I don’t see it any better or worse than any other form of racism (except maybe in influence). Maybe the Trump administration will offer more of the same (with different people victimized). I don’t think so, I hope not, but I do not know as it is too early to tell.

    Decades ago many Christians warned of immorality growing in our nation. But even six years ago I would have never guessed the speed into which the Democrat Party would sink into depravity, pulling the nation along with it. That was my first conclusion. But in retrospect, it could be that the Obama administration was only a reflection of what has already taken hold. If so, the Democrat Party merely reflects a humanistic type of evil that is already engrained at a grass-roots level in our nation. I now suspect that this is the case, and that my initial reaction was just that – a reaction, and a mistake. Fortunately the tide has turned for at least four years, but if my second guess is right this is only temporary.

    Looking at the numbers (the votes vs the areas represented) and considering that the internal “boarders” are all but non-existent in our nation I do think that you will have your way, Crabtownboy, and that this current administration is just a pause on the path laid out for us. I believe that the liberal Democrat agenda will gather strength, normalize evil, and push forward even more though these four to eight years in such a way that will make President Obama’s wickedness pale in comparison. But I’m a pessimist, so what else would I be expecting. “The best lack all conviction, while the worst are full of passionate intensity.”
     
  17. Crabtownboy

    Crabtownboy Well-Known Member
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    Interesting post. I see the evil in Trump and his administration, not in the voters who he fooled into voting for him. That is one of the great abilities of totalitarian politicians, they are very good at convincing people to vote against their own self-interest.

    I do agree that this is a transition administration. What follows I am not sure. It will not look like Reagan conservatism nor what is viewed at liberalism. It will be something new.
     
  18. JonC

    JonC Moderator
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    I disagree with a major point. Voters were not "fooled" into electing President Trump any more than voters were "fooled" into voting for Clinton. Those voting for Clinton knew the platform evil, they knew it "anti-Christian", and they knew it an immoral act. Those voting for President Trump knew his platform was not immoral, but that Donald Trump himself was known as an immoral man. Some people voted for evil actions (they voted for Clinton). Some voted for an immoral man to implement a moral platform (which is why I'm apprehensive), and others refused to vote for either, as their conscience dictated. But no one voted in ignorance, except it be willful ignorance (in which case, President Trump cannot be called in account for their self-delusion). I think even with President Obama’s initial candidacy, those who supported him knew he would stand for evil. They (not Obama) convinced themselves to vote for him because they wanted a change.

    The only hope that I see is in the election of President Trump. Not because he will make everything right, but because this is an opportunity to divert from the path we've been on for decades. This is the one time a new political party can arise, the "two party system" (which is really one system) can change and be removed from the hands of politicians and special interest groups...but the pessimist in me says it will never happen.
     
  19. Crabtownboy

    Crabtownboy Well-Known Member
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    And as little as I liked much of the path we have been on I strongly believe the path chosen in this election is a, in the long run, a far worse path. Diverting from one path to another does not mean it is a better path. I believe as time goes by people who voted for him will wake to the fact that the current administration does not have their interest at heart and that they will suffer greatly from this choice.

    History has clearly shown that leaders of nations who are narcissistic and totalitarian do not do much for the average citizen of their country ... regardless of what was promised.

    Look at the promises of Lenin and see what Russia got.
    Look at the promises of Mao and see what China got.
    Look at the promises of Mugabe and see what Zimbabwe got.
    Look at the promises of Ami and see what Uganda got.
    Look at the promises of Hussein and see what Iraq got.


    These are simply examples an are certainly not an exhaustive list.

    Time will tell.
     
  20. Yeshua1

    Yeshua1 Well-Known Member
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    The truth is that Obama path was one of the most ungodly path to USA, as he took the one against the reveal will of God, and tried to destroy America greatness, which has always been faith and trust in the true God, not Allah!
     
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