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Featured Is Creation BY or THROUGH Jesus Christ?

Discussion in 'Baptist Theology & Bible Study' started by SavedByGrace, Jan 14, 2022.

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  1. SavedByGrace

    SavedByGrace Well-Known Member

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    You said that the translators at a LATER time use the plural, when it is in the ORIGINAL HEBREW!
     
  2. AustinC

    AustinC Well-Known Member

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    Tell me, when was the Hebrew translated into English?
    You're acting like a dog just looking for a fight when there is nothing to fight over. What is becoming clear is that you really don't understand what has been said. In essence, you are fighting with a boogeyman of your own making.
     
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  3. agedman

    agedman Well-Known Member
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    You are welcome to attempt to correct me with Scripture. I do my best to be open and responsive to correct error if I am shown from Scripture the error.

    Now in these last few posts, I presented you with the Scripture foundation of which I posted.

    Will you also give me the same courtesy as I have extended, in being open to admitting and correcting my error if shown by Scripture the error?

    From another place I was in error concerning Luke 2. When politely shown, I quickly corrected my error, conformed to the Scriptures, and ask the original two postings containing error be removed that others will not be lead astray.

    I have no problem “contending” over Scriptures, even sometimes sharply, and must with equal zeal be aware when shown by Scriptures to be corrected.
     
  4. SavedByGrace

    SavedByGrace Well-Known Member

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    Dude, it matter ZERO about our English languare, the HEBREW Original is PLURAL. Translators have nothing to do with that, they only gave us as it IS.
     
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  5. SavedByGrace

    SavedByGrace Well-Known Member

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    From what YOU have written, it seems to me, that you do not believe that God is One, and that there there are ONLY THREE distinct PERSONS? You speak of SEVEN Holy Spirit's, and the Bible says there is only ONE.

    Ephesians 4:4, "There is one body and ONE SPIRIT"
     
  6. percho

    percho Well-Known Member
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    and, confessedly, great is the secret of piety -- God was manifested in flesh, declared righteous in spirit, seen by messengers, preached among nations, believed on in the world, taken up in glory! 1 Tim 3:16

    Was it the heart and intent of God, the Word, manifested in flesh?

    ἀλλ᾽ ἔρχεται ὥρα καὶ νῦν ἐστιν ὅτε οἱ ἀληθινοὶ προσκυνηταὶ προσκυνήσουσιν τῷ πατρὶ ἐν πνεύματι καὶ ἀληθείᾳ· καὶ γὰρ ὁ πατὴρ τοιούτους ζητεῖ τοὺς προσκυνοῦντας αὐτόν πνεῦμα ὁ θεός καὶ τοὺς προσκυνοῦντας αὐτὸν ἐν πνεύματι καὶ ἀληθείᾳ δεῖ προσκυνεῖν John 4:23,24
    ταῦτα δὲ αὐτοῦ ἐνθυμηθέντος ἰδού, ἄγγελος κυρίου κατ᾽ ὄναρ ἐφάνη αὐτῷ λέγων, Ἰωσὴφ υἱὸς Δαβίδ, μὴ φοβηθῇς παραλαβεῖν Μαριὰμ τὴν γυναῖκά σου· τὸ γὰρ ἐν αὐτῇ γεννηθὲν ἐκ πνεύματός (in her generated? out of Spirit? Spirit the God of John 4:24?) ἐστιν ἁγίου (the Holy One?) Matt 1:20

    How was the Word made flesh?
     
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  7. agedman

    agedman Well-Known Member
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    I agree it is in the Hebrew. I recall pointing it out.

    Perhaps you didn’t comprehend or I didn’t write in a comprehendible style.

    Elohim is plural, yet it was latter in the account the translators used the plural form.

    The Genesis doesn’t open with the trinity being mentioned, but it is seen in the Hebrew narrative.

    I’ve got no problem with the translators, if that is your focus. For God is one God.

    The post concerned the trinity, which I thought was a part of the thread of “by” or “through” and “creation.”
     
  8. agedman

    agedman Well-Known Member
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    Did I not post the Scriptures accurately?

    I am not disputing the is one Spirit, “another comforter” as Christ states.

    However, God is Spirit, the Holy Spirit is Spirit, and the Revelations declare what I posted.

    Do I take your word for it or the Scriptures?
     
  9. SavedByGrace

    SavedByGrace Well-Known Member

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    By God the Holy Spirit, as the Bible says!
     
  10. percho

    percho Well-Known Member
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    Manifested.

    he who is doing the sin, of the devil he is, because from the beginning the devil doth sin; for this was the Son of God manifested, that he may break up the works of the devil;
     
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  11. agedman

    agedman Well-Known Member
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    Perhaps you are of the sort that believe that Christ was a created being and not part of the Elohim of the OT?
     
  12. SavedByGrace

    SavedByGrace Well-Known Member

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    This is not correct. The word Elohim is masculine plural, which is because GOD is a PLURALITY of PERSONS, Father, Son and Holy Spirit. The use of the PLURAL in verse 26, for example, is because God is a PLURALITY of PERSONS, and The Father, Jesus Christ and the Holy Spirit, are CREATORS. As is seen in the PLURAL "CREATORS" in Ecc. 12:1, and MAKERS in Isaiah, etc
     
  13. percho

    percho Well-Known Member
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    Per OP

    By or Out of and I am not speaking of essence but from.

    In John 4 you have the Word made flesh, named Jesus, speaking of Spirit the God who he says is Father.
     
  14. SavedByGrace

    SavedByGrace Well-Known Member

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    You said, "In the Revelation, the God (Father) Lord (Jesus) are shown as two, co equal along with the seven Spirits of God". This says to anyone who understands English, that God the Father and Jesus Christ are TWO, and then there are SEVEN SPIRITS, which makes NINE! You take the "seven Spirits" to mean "SEVEN HOLY SPIRITS", which is not correct. There is only ONE Person The Holy Spirit
     
  15. percho

    percho Well-Known Member
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    Is the devil still doing works or is he bound? Maybe asterisktom will check in.
     
  16. agedman

    agedman Well-Known Member
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    Again,
    Jesus says to him, "Am I with you so long a time, and you have not known Me, Philip? The one having seen Me has seen the Father. How can you say, 'Show us the Father'?
    Never said they were the same person, yet they are for there is ONE God, is there not?

    Like I posted early, the trinity really cannot be contain in human reasoning, and exampled by human descriptions.
     
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  17. SavedByGrace

    SavedByGrace Well-Known Member

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    Huh?

    Jesus Christ is saying in John 4:24, that GOD is Spirit, that is, a Spiritual Being, not seen by the human eye. This context is only about God the Father, and not Jesus or the Holy Spirit.
     
  18. SavedByGrace

    SavedByGrace Well-Known Member

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    more nonsense! HOW can you say that I believe that Jesus Christ is a created being, when the OP shows that He is THE CREATOR?

    ALL of my threads on here about the Trinity, shows that Jesus Christ is YHWH, as are the Father and Holy Spirit!

    You cannot seem to understand what I wrote in the OP?
     
  19. SavedByGrace

    SavedByGrace Well-Known Member

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    Not LITERALLY!
     
  20. SavedByGrace

    SavedByGrace Well-Known Member

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    is there any sin in this world?
     
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