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How is can this be prophecy?

Discussion in 'Baptist Theology & Bible Study' started by Deacon, Apr 8, 2017.

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  1. Deacon

    Deacon Well-Known Member
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    Matthew 2:15 CSB
    He stayed there until Herod's death so that what was spoken by the Lord through the prophet might be fulfilled: out of Egypt I called my son.

    The verse refers to a passage in Hosea 11:1 "When Israel was a child I loved him, out of Egypt I called my son."

    Contextually Hosea is referring to Jacob/Israel.

    How can this be a prophecy? What's going on here?

    Rob
     
    #1 Deacon, Apr 8, 2017
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  2. TCassidy

    TCassidy Late-Administator Emeritus
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    If God said it was a prophecy it was a prophecy. Whether we understood it or not. :)
     
    #2 TCassidy, Apr 8, 2017
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  3. Yeshua1

    Yeshua1 Well-Known Member
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    The Holy Spirit allowed matthew to understand that the immediate fulfillment was Israel, but the full one was now in life of Christ!
     
    #3 Yeshua1, Apr 8, 2017
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  4. JonC

    JonC Moderator
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    I don't know, but I have my suspicions. Perhaps many of these things had dual meanings (a meaning specific for the immediate time...e.g., some hold that Psalm 22 signified one thing while prophesying another). If this is the case, then could not God's desire for his people be a foreshadowing of God's desire for his "Anointed One"?
     
    #4 JonC, Apr 8, 2017
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  5. Deacon

    Deacon Well-Known Member
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    I've been teaching through the OT with another gentleman for the past couple of years.
    Last month the elders asked me to teach a NT book (Isaiah will have to wait).
    I choose Matthew (there have already been studies on Luke and John as well as some of the epistles).

    It's been awhile since I've studied a gospel; really enjoying the discovery of Matthew.

    So... in my research about this question last evening... what do the commentaries say?

    Cornerstone Biblical Commentary, (vol. 11, Matthew, Mark) pointed me to three varying approaches, some of which we observe in the posts above.

    Approach 1 - Matthew saw a prediction not originally intended by the original author.​

    Approach 2 - Revelatory insight or sensus plenior ​

    Approach 3 - Matthew is following an eschatological motif, that being divine sonship. What was true of Israel (Jacob) on a metaphorical level is true of Jesus the Messiah.​

    A number of different commentaries mention this third approach as being the one that best characterizes the way Matthew writes his gospel, NICNT Matthew (France), Commentary on the New Testament Use of the Old Testament (Carson).

    Rob
     
    #5 Deacon, Apr 9, 2017
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  6. Ben W

    Ben W Active Member
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    The problem here is that people are attempting to use western theology and exegesis to understand a Jewish Text of Prophecy. The Talmud and the Midrash understanding of prophecy does not mirror how many today try and expound upon Scripture. To understand this Scripture, understand that Jewish Prophecy is always about 'Pattern', not 'Prediction'.

    Consider this, Abraham comes out of Egypt when Pharaoh was given Judgement by God. Abraham's descendants then came out of Egypt when their wicked king was judged. Then we see yet another wicked king judged and the Messiah then comes out of Egypt. Thus the prophecy of Hosea is fulfilled three times. Israel is a midrash term that Matthew uses to mean the Messiah, understood in a Jewish context, but not really in a modern context.
     
    #6 Ben W, Apr 9, 2017
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  7. Darrell C

    Darrell C Well-Known Member
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    We see at times Prophecy having multiple applications (a near and future, for example), so I would agree that the context immediately refers to Israel.

    However, there is a clear reference to Christ which would not have been understood in their day due to the limitations of the revelation provided them, which thankfully we are not under:


    Hosea 11:10
    King James Version (KJV)

    10 They shall walk after the Lord: he shall roar like a lion: when he shall roar, then the children shall tremble from the west.

    11 They shall tremble as a bird out of Egypt, and as a dove out of the land of Assyria: and I will place them in their houses, saith the Lord.

    12 Ephraim compasseth me about with lies, and the house of Israel with deceit: but Judah yet ruleth with God, and is faithful with the saints.


    Revelation 5:5
    King James Version (KJV)

    5 And one of the elders saith unto me, Weep not: behold, the Lion of the tribe of Judah, the Root of David, hath prevailed to open the book, and to loose the seven seals thereof.


    A number of things are being looked at, one of which being idolatry which led to captivity (and the need for redemption/restoration which, in the limited revelatory scenery, was basically only viewed in the physical and in physical terms). I see judgment concerning the Northern Kingdom a primary theme, and I wonder if we might not consider the condition/state of Israel when the Lord appeared. We might say there is a separation between the Lord and Israel that might be pictured in physical separation, just as we know there is a spiritual separation between God and man.

    Thanks for the thread, it has sparked a desire to do more extensive study in Hosea.


    God bless.
     
    #7 Darrell C, Apr 9, 2017
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