Paige Patterson removed as President of SWBTS

Read the first sentence of your post 73. You labelled all non-Calvinists as apostate. Every post of yours dealing with the opposition of Calvinism makes the assumption that Calvinism is settled fact and anyone who disagrees with you is an ignorant idiot. Calvinism is not settled doctrine. It is a minority doctrine that is not widely accepted by Baptists. Labeling all who disagree with you as apostate is a prime example of your piousness. Insulting me based on my geographic location is further demonstration of your insulting brand of arrogance. You and many other Calvinists get called rude because you are indeed rude and arrogant.

 

It could be based on an incomplete understand of the issue. It could also be based on a proper understanding of the issue. Despite the fact that you would like it to be, the issue of Calvinism is not a settled debate. You actually hold the minority position among Baptists.

The first sentence of post 73 accuses "traditionalists" of holding apostate doctrine.

 

I've already answered this multiple times. When confronted with Biblical arguments that disputes Calvinist doctrine the responses are typically:

* The translation is in error. The underlying Greek does not actually mean what the English is saying.

* The writer of those verses is not writing to unbelievers, the audience is actually believers.(Or vice-versa)

* Those verses being used to discredit Calvinism are being taken out of context.

* According to the London Confession of 1689...

No point in debating someone who changes the plain meaning of words, denies whole swaths of audiences, says verses don't apply to the subject matter, and relies on human dogma.






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Hello TIL,
I do give you credit in that you try and offer a response.....for that you will be awarded a BB participation trophy.
However your responses havebpnly a few more verses than Y 1.....so you are being asked to step it up a notch.
Unfortunately those things you keep listing are true. Let me ask you a question...
Take out a legal pad and see how often you notice it happening with others who interact...
Take the few names I listed....see how often those suspects do what we say they do....

Let me ask you.....is the all spoken of in romans5...18-21
Speaking of all men who ever lived, or is the identical word all....mean two different groups?

 

SBC Digest

"Noted author and speaker Karen Swallow Prior was hospitalized in surgery this morning (May 24) after being hit by a bus while walking in downtown Nashville yesterday."

"a research fellow for the Southern Baptist Ethics & Religious Liberty Commission, [Ms. Swallow Prior] was in Nashville for work unrelated to the commission. Many details of the accident were not available, but according to tweets by friends and family, she suffered multiple fractures and a collapsed lung."

"ERLC President Russell Moore requested prayers for Prior...'We are grateful to God that Karen was not killed. Please keep praying for her!'"

 

Agreed, except for the part about I am wrong.

 

The time around the Civil War seems to be when the more "free will" Baptist churches seem to be coming around, as before that time, Calvinism seemed to be the primary position.
I agree with the 1689 due to its Sotierlogy being derived from the scriptures.

 

"Reynolds,
Well....bless your heart Reynolds...we do not see eye to eye

Let's read it together...

To which Reynolds responds this way;

then Reynolds said this;

I did no such thing....

Reynolds...can you explain the difference between;
1] the root of doctrinal apostasy....and holding apostate doctrine?
2] the root of doctrinal apostasy....and outright heresy?

Do not worry... I will start a thread on that later on tonight, but i want to face your objections here.

Calvinism is settled fact...it is not up for grabs. Not everyone agrees with it, or understands it...but that does not mean it is not settled fact.

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Not "anyone" Reynolds.....but it does seem like there are quite a few confused persons sometime. If they are wilfully ignorant or not, that is for God to judge.

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Sure it is...that is why it has been taught for hundreds of years...

Here you reveal some bias against it don't you? Now notice...I do not say you are rude or arrogant because you reveal your bias Reynolds...did i.
No this is debate site and I do not like any form of censorship so I do not attack you personally saying you are rude or ignorant...despite some of what you have posted that might drift in that direction....
Are you okay Reynolds? do you need a safe space or a timeout?

Where did this happen??? I think I have traded barbs with about everyone on here....so can you show where I say such a thing as you accuse me of?

What might be going on is you seeing the non cals put to flight very often so it has a cumulative effect on you to a point where you make some exaggerated claims, that you cannot support.

I think I get the idea of what you are trying to say....
.

Who insulted you? I made a factual statement based on first hand experience with church leaders in the south....Should i have said...in an undisclosed location? A pastor of a local church said that if he went just slightly below surface level doctrinally...he would lose most of the people...I did not say it, He did. the same with one of the main teachers in the church.

I travel all over the country for 30 years now...I know what I see,and i know what i am talking about....I know tenn. fairly well also....and there are differences from one side of it to the other...

From where i sit it looks to me like your smug, folksy, pot shot, brand of self righteousness is more in line with arrogance than someone who speaks very plainly.

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Yeah well...I had just posted that yesterday how that is the go to escape clause...call names and run for the hills.....Sounds a bit creepy to me...sort of cheesy....because truth is truth...not arrogance.

If a JW says....the trinity is not a settled doctrine, and you say ...oh..it is settled...are you then being arrogant or rude?

 

I lost all interest in SWBTS in 1994, when Dilday was fired as President

 

Aaah, reveals quite a bit.

 

According to someone who was supposed to be "in the know" (a friend of Montgomery) in another venue I read, at this point Montgomery does not want his job back, only that there be no negative information in his employee file.

 

A lot of hay has been made over Patterson's "Golden Parachute," especially comparing it to Russell Dilday's being locked out of his office, etc. A link posted by Patterson opponent Ben Cole on his blog reminds us of a forgotten fact about Dilday's firing -- he was also offered a "Golden Parachute."

https://www.washingtonpost.com/arch...48f932f/?noredirect=on&utm_term=.f5109727cb5a

 

As an indicator of the dire situation that Southwestern currently faces, the above article from March 26, 1994, accurately stated that the trustee statement justifying Dr. Dilday's firing, noting "that the seminary's enrollment had declined from 5,070 [FTE] students during the 1985-86 academic year to 4,022 [FTE] during 1992-93." During the period where Ken Hemphill was President, the enrollment dropped from 4,022 FTE to 2,072 FTE, a drop of nearly 50%. Dr. Hemphill famously blamed Roe v. Wade providing access to abortion for the declining numbers. During Paige Patterson's presidency, the enrollment dropped from 2,072 FTE 2004-2005 to 1,393 FTE in 2017-2018, a drop of 33%.

A graduate school has to have a certain number of students in order to remain financially and academically viable. SWBTS has been struggling financially since the Dilday firing. The expensive (and unneeded) chapel that Paige Patterson had built (complete with stained glass depictions of living persons) has undermined financial fundraising for the endowment and long-term stability of the school. They are already withdrawing funds from their endowment simply to make payroll and take care of pressing maintenance needs.

Unless there was a change in leadership, that trend would have likely continued until the school completely shut down.

 

Here is latest news
Southern Baptist leader Paige Patterson removed over complaints of 'dangerous' advice to abuse victims

Seems to be a combo package of paige not being the most tactful person, making some wrong decisions, and the overall climate getting him now!

 

Unfortunately the story in your link is in error. It is correct that those are the allegations. Its just that the allegations are not true. What calvies have done to go after him is godless.

 

SBC voices lists the 2017 enrollment at 2294, not 1393.

 

You got a link? I only see data for SBC Voices for 2015-16, which has SWBTS at 1249 FTE.