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Socialism Is Bad for the Environment

Discussion in 'Political Debate & Discussion' started by KenH, Jun 5, 2019.

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  1. InTheLight

    InTheLight Well-Known Member
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    Hiring by US businesses hits a record high

    The total number of workers hired rose to a new high in April, according to Labor Department data released Monday. But despite this, the amount of available jobs still vastly outnumbers unemployed workers.

    Hirings increased to 5.9 million for the month, a gain of 240,000 from March, the Job Openings and Labor Turnover Survey indicated. The hiring rate rose to 3.9%, an increase of one-tenth of a percentage point. The total hirings was the most recorded in the data series’ history going back to December 2000.

    Hiring by US businesses hits a record high
     
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  2. GoodTidings

    GoodTidings Well-Known Member

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    Yes, and those statistics torpedo the claim that Trump's tax cuts only help the wealthy.
     
  3. FollowTheWay

    FollowTheWay Well-Known Member
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    This is from Forbes. I don't consider it to be a "liberal" publication.
    Who Benefits From The Tax Cut 10 Months Later

    But so far, the cuts have not been linked to an increase in labor share or more investments. The Federal Reserve Bank of Chicago’s current capital spending index indicates private business investment plans have remained in negative territory since 2015. The most certain effect of the tax cuts has been to help fuel a massive increase in the federal deficit and debt.

    So where is all the money saved from corporate tax cuts going? First, to companies’ bottom lines and second to stock buybacks, which were recently at a record high. So far, in 2018, the 500 corporations in the S&P Index have received $30 billion from the corporate rate cut, which in turn accounts for over 40 percent of S&P equity earnings growth. When economies are strong, equity values rise because the issuing corporations are engaged in innovation and other fundamental strategies to raise the real performance of the company. However, innovation and fundamental performance do not seem to be the cause of the rise in equity values. The Shiller PE ratio, which compares share prices to earnings, is now over 30, the highest since the expansion began mid 2009.

    Buybacks are attractive because most CEO pay is directly linked to stock values and not to productive capital expansion. Increasing pay for the wealthiest Americans and reducing their taxes will boost equity values, but America’s inequality will get worse. The Economic Policy Institute (EPI) documented that 2017 average compensation for the CEO of large companies increased by 17.6%. And that was before the tax cuts kicked in. (Disclosure: I am on the board of EPI.)

    Unfortunately, corporations have not used the money they've saved from the tax cut to raise workers’ pay and any potential increase in compensation could be soaked up by health insurance premiums. And, of course, paying more for health insurance doesn’t help households buy food or shelter. Without substantial income growth for most Americans and without new productive investment by businesses, tax cuts will not boost economic growth. Worse, government spending cuts triggered by cuts in tax revenue could cause a recession.
     
  4. GoodTidings

    GoodTidings Well-Known Member

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    First of all that article is from Sept. 2018. Secondly, Forbes has commentators and journalists from every political persuasion.

    Thirdly, the article focuses on corporations. Small businesses do the lion's share of hiring, not major corporations. Small business owners are also the ones having raise pay in order to compete for new hires. With their being more jobs than people to fill them, business owners have to sweeten the pot to attract applicants. Even some major companies in the retail industry like McDonalds have to compete and are offering higher wages and more benefits than they ever had to in the past do to a competitive hiring market. Even Walmart is raising wages.

    Lowering taxes has benefited small businesses allowing them to expand and/or hire more employees. Lowering taxes benefits directly those who create jobs and wealthy people create jobs and by doing so, create tax payers since their new employees mean more tax revenue for the government. So yes, we want wealthy people to benefit because those tax cuts, combined with fewer job killing regulations, provides more incentive for the private sector to create jobs and that benefits average Americans.

    People who have jobs, who didn't previously have jobs, are now making more money than they were when they were unemployed. We now have record unemployment across the board and in every demographic. Food Stamp rolls are decreasing. The situation isn't perfect and not everyone benefited from everything Trump has done, but overall, the situation nationwide is markedly better now than it ever was under Bush or Obama because Trump is unleashing the private sector to do what it does best.

    So, your little ancient article from 9 months ago, doesn't really tell the whole story. I pay attention to the real world, not the misleading information put out in by Liberals.
     
    #84 GoodTidings, Jun 15, 2019
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  5. FollowTheWay

    FollowTheWay Well-Known Member
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    Please show me an analysis from a credible financial institution that supports your claims. The jobs that were created are not ones that provide a living wage. They're primarily retail jobs that barely pay more than the minimum wage.
     
  6. GoodTidings

    GoodTidings Well-Known Member

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    >>> February Jobs Report Preview - Indeed Hiring Lab Wage growth is actually going up the most for those who in the lower wage jobs. Their pay is going up.

    When employees have to compete for jobs, wages stagnate, or decline because employers have no incentive raise pay. Plenty of people desperate for a job, will work for whatever is offered. But, that is not the case now. Employers have to compete with each other and that means they have to offer higher wages and benefits to attract new applicants. They can't get away with offering only minimum wage.

    In addition, because employers have to offer more benefits and higher wages, it makes the Democrat push for a $15 min. wage superfluous. If employers are already offering more than what a $15 min wage offers, why would a job seeker work for $15 an hour?

    There are millions of jobs in the US that are competing not only with each other, but are competing with colleges and universities. These are jobs that offer $50,000 a year and require no college degree and will train you on site.

    Again, that doesn't fit the liberal narrative, but there are all kinds of good paying jobs out there, but you might have to get up early, you might have to sweat and you might have sore muscles at the end of the work day. I guess people are too lazy to do that kind of work and would rather have their safe spaces and lattes.

    A lot more good things are happening in the job market than Liberals have the honesty, integrity or the courage to admit.
     
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  7. just-want-peace

    just-want-peace Well-Known Member
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  8. InTheLight

    InTheLight Well-Known Member
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    EXACTLY.

    I posted a thread called "Economic Expansion is Just Getting Started" back in August 2018. I basically beat Forbes to the punch by a month. Here's my opening statement:

    Whenever there is a significant tax cut stock buybacks, investment in R&D, executive bonuses (as well as debt retirement) always takes precedence over wage increases. It's a historical fact. Not only that but wage increases take a while to "hit" the market because wage increases depend on the ability of workers to leave their current job and go to another one. This doesn't happen until the employment picture improves, which takes time. We're at that time, and have been for several months now. Indeed the economic expansion is past the "just getting started" phase and is entering the "starting to pick up steam" phase.

    That is for sure.
     
    #88 InTheLight, Jun 15, 2019
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  9. InTheLight

    InTheLight Well-Known Member
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    For Pete's sake, just look at any monthly employment report from the Bureau of Labor Statistics. You realize we are at FULL EMPLOYMENT--there are more job openings than workers to fill them.

    Here's the latest one, from June 2019, covering May:

    Employment in professional and business services continued to trend up
    over the month (+33,000) and has increased by 498,000 over the past 12
    months.

    Employment in health care continued its upward trend in May (+16,000).
    The industry has added 391,000 jobs over the past 12 months.

    Construction employment changed little in May (+4,000), following an
    increase of 30,000 in April. The industry has added 215,000 jobs over
    the past 12 months.

    Employment Situation Summary


    Here's a table showing the average hourly wages jobs. I've highlighted the occupations that are mentioned as having shown growth in May 2019. Are these jobs that don't provide a living wage? Thirty dollars ($30) an hour?! [click to enlarge table]

    Average-Hourly-Wages.jpg


    Here is an excerpt from last month's report, covering April, showing good paying jobs are increasing:

    Professional and business services added 76,000 jobs in April. Within the
    industry, employment gains occurred in administrative and support services
    (+53,000) and in computer systems design and related services (+14,000). Over
    the past 12 months, professional and business services has added 535,000 jobs.

    In April, construction employment rose by 33,000, with gains in nonresidential
    specialty trade contractors (+22,000) and in heavy and civil engineering
    construction (+10,000). Construction has added 256,000 jobs over the past 12
    months.

    Employment in health care grew by 27,000 in April and 404,000 over the past
    12 months. In April, job growth occurred in ambulatory health care services
    (+17,000), hospitals (+8,000), and community care facilities for the elderly
    (+7,000).

    Financial activities employment continued to trend up in April (+12,000). The
    industry has added 110,000 jobs over the past 12 months, with almost three-
    fourths of the growth in real estate and rental and leasing.

    Manufacturing employment changed little for the third month in a row (+4,000
    in April). In the 12 months prior to February, the industry had added an
    average of 22,000 jobs per month.

    Employment in retail trade changed little in April (-12,000). Job losses
    occurred in general merchandise stores (-9,000)
    , while motor vehicle and
    parts dealers added 8,000 jobs.

    [Oh, look at that---the lower paying retail service jobs are losing jobs. But, but, you said the jobs being created by the Trump tax cuts were, "primarily retail jobs that barely pay more than the minimum wage". Just look at how wrong you are. And I wonder where these retail workers are going? Oh, I see, they're getting higher paying jobs in other sectors.]

    Employment Situation News Release

    If you want to look at the historical employment reports here's a link.
    Employment Situation Archived News Releases : U.S. Bureau of Labor Statistics
    I invite you to take a real good look. Stop saying the jobs being created are low paying jobs.
     
    #89 InTheLight, Jun 15, 2019
    Last edited: Jun 15, 2019
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  10. GoodTidings

    GoodTidings Well-Known Member

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    Liberals don't like to deal with this in practical, real-world terms. They don't like think or talk about what is actually happening on the ground. They don't want to talk about raises and bonuses that resulted from the tax cuts.

    The Left only wants an academic discussion about corporations. They only want to talk about how "evil" corporations benefited from the tax cut. But they don't want to talk about how real people, especially those in the small business sectors, the areas that do the most hiring, are paying more as a result of the tax cuts.

    They certainly don't want to talk about how low the unemployment rate is and how small business and especially the retail sector is having to compete with each other for new workers. That competition includes offering more competitive wages and benefits. That discussion is not supposed to exist. The Left doesn't want to talk about that.

    They also don't to talk about the fact that people got to keep more of what they made in 2018. This was evidenced by small refunds this last tax season. It took people a while to realize that their refunds were small because back in 2018, they got to keep more of what they made, and that the government took less taxes from them. That, in and of itself, is like getting a pay raise 'cause you are keeping more of what you earn. Those were not the 1% getting those benefits, it was the working man, the average person benefiting from the tax cut.

    But again, the Left doesn't want to talk about that, because that doesn't feed the narrative that the tax cuts and low unemployment has had no effect on middle class. They essentially want you to commit intellectual suicide and ignore reality.
     
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  11. FollowTheWay

    FollowTheWay Well-Known Member
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    Some workers have received a pay increase or bonus due to the tax cut. How many?
    Are Americans already benefiting from the new tax law?


    ‘4 million American workers’

    President Donald Trump claimed 3 million workers in the U.S. had already received a pay increase or bonus thanks to the tax bill at the end of January. PolitiFact rated that claim Mostly True.

    PolitiFact checked Trump’s claim using data from Americans for Tax Reform, a group that advocates for lower taxes. The group supported the Republican tax bill.

    The group has a running list of companies that have announced bonuses or other benefits based on press releases and media reports since the tax law passed. At the end of January, at least 286 companies had announced benefits for more than 3 million workers.

    That number has since grown to more than 4 million workers from 408 companies, according to the group. Those workers have gotten a bonus, pay increase, 401(k) hike, or utility rate cut because of the new tax law, according to reports.

    That’s not a small number of workers, but it accounts for less than 3 percent of the total employed population in the U.S.

    Experts also told PolitiFact that some of the bonuses may have already been planned before the tax law to retain workers in a tight labor market.
     
  12. Revmitchell

    Revmitchell Well-Known Member
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    politifact, good grief
     
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  13. InTheLight

    InTheLight Well-Known Member
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    There was not a tight labor market prior to the passing of the tax cuts. The labor market didn't really tighten up for 8-10 months after the bill was passed. This is what historically happens.



    Sent from my Pixel 2 XL
     
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  14. GoodTidings

    GoodTidings Well-Known Member

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    Yes, but that is an article from March of 2018. Things have been improving.

    More is happening and more people are benefitting from the tax cuts by not only pay raises and bonuses, but also through employment.

    The employment numbers are phenomenal. We have historic unemployment across the board. People who didn't have jobs now have jobs to the extent that there are more jobs available than people to work them all over America. And millions of those jobs pay at or over $50,000 per year. Jobs have increased because of two big things. The tax cuts, which create an environment favorable to job creation and job growth, and the reduction of over-regulation that had also stymied job creation.

    When this article was written, it was before the US had a 4.1% quarterly GDP in the 2nd quarter of 2018. Trump predicted we could hit a quarterly 4.1% and the Liberals on CNN and MSNBC and elsewhere mocked and laughed him to scorn. Obama said it would never happen. Trump predicted bringing back millions of manufacturers that had left the US. Obama said it couldn't and wouldn't happen and said that Trump would need a magic wand.

    Well, it happened and we are seeing more and more job growth to the point that employers are having to offer more and more pay to attract candidates to their companies. Employers, and not applicants, are the ones competing now. And that means higher paying jobs. It makes little Bernie and his silly, $15 min wage such a joke. Employers are having to offer way more than that all over the country to fill positions.

    Sorry, but posting out-of-date articles that don't reflect the truth isn't helping your arguments.
     
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  15. FollowTheWay

    FollowTheWay Well-Known Member
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    Trump tax cuts did little to boost economic growth in 2018, study says

    Trump tax cuts did little to boost economic growth in 2018, study says

    Wed, May 29 2019

    Jeff Cox@JeffCoxCNBCcom

    Key Points
    • The U.S. economy gained 2.9% in 2018, but only a fraction of that came from President Trump’s tax cuts, the Congressional Research Service said this week.
    • The nonpartisan group said the economy’s strong performance came largely from factors already in place.
    • Workers received only marginal benefits, with bonuses from companies amounting to just $28 per employee.
     
  16. Revmitchell

    Revmitchell Well-Known Member
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    Middle class was anything but left behind by Trump tax reform


    There is a clear disconnect between the rhetoricOpens a New Window. of the Democrats and the gains being felt in the Trump economyOpens a New Window. because of the Tax Cuts and Jobs ActOpens a New Window.(TCJA).

    The U.S. jobless rate is at a 50-year low, but according to the left, the current strong economic outlook is purely coincidental..
    Former Vice President and 2020 hopeful Joe Biden recently claimed only the wealthy received a tax cut from the GOP tax reform, a claim that received “Four Pinocchios” from the Washington Post fact checker.


    Meanwhile, self-avowed socialist Bernie Sanders claimed the strong economy was not a result of tax reform or other Trump policies but did not offer an alternative theory for why the economy is doing well.

    And House Majority Leader Steny Hoyer, D-Md. claimed that the GOP tax reform “left the middle class behind.”

    Left behind?
    Did only the wealthy receive a tax cut from tax reform? Does the strong economy have nothing to do with Trump policies? Was the middle class “left behind?”

    The data say otherwise on all fronts.

    Average hourly earnings have grown 3.2 percent over the past year and GDP grew by 3.2 percent in the first quarter of 2019.

    Unemployment has been at or below 4 percent for the past 14 months, and the economy has added an average of 218,000 jobs per month over the past year.

    And this positive economic news extends to key demographics: unemployment for adult women is at 3.1 percent, a 66-year low, unemployment for Hispanics is at 4.2 percent – the lowest rate since this data was first collected in 1973, and veteran unemployment is at just 2.3 percent – a 19 year low.

    As for tax cuts and leaving the middle class behind, Democrats pointed to the fact that Americans were seeing lower tax refunds half way through this year’s tax season as proof that the tax cuts were bad for the middle class.

    Because of this relentless messaging, 43 percent of Americans were unsure how tax reform affected their tax bill, according to Gallup.

    Now that tax season has concluded, the data show that the average refund was down just $55 from $2,780 to $2,725.

    In reality, taxpayers made this gap up each two-week paycheck, with the average taxpayer seeing an average of $50 more according to data released by H&R Block.

    This should not be a shock.

    In total, H&R Block found that federal taxes were down almost 25 percent for 2018.

    The average household is seeing tax savings of almost $27,000 over the next decade, according to estimates released by the Heritage Foundation.

    And Americans at every income level and in every Congressional district are seeing tax reduction, a fact that even left-of-center think tanks and the New York Times have admitted.

    However, Democrats are failing to acknowledge the positive gains of the GOP tax cuts even after recent reports showing strong GDP and jobs growth.

    Middle class was anything but left behind by Trump tax reform
     
  17. GoodTidings

    GoodTidings Well-Known Member

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    That is not true. Regular people reported bonuses of over $1,000 dollars. It's funny how dishonest Liberals tend to be. All Liberals can seem to do is lie about what is happening right in front of our eyes.

    When they could not argue against the record unemployment, when they could not argue against the raises and bonuses, they praised the economy that they claimed was really the fruit of Obama's presidency. All of this prosperity was really supposed to have been built by Obama and Trump is simply inheriting the benefits of an Obama economy. Except that Obama economy never got the country much above 2% which is a pretty lagging economy. Trump inherited high unemployment, higher than ever Food Stamp rolls, and no REAL job growth in areas that actually matter.

    Now that they have to do all they can to make the economy appear to be lagging and sluggish, you don't see them connecting it to Obama. Suddenly, when they need the economy to be bad, that's all Trump. They cannot have it both ways.

    But now they want to present a failing economy and they want to blame it Trump. In order to do so, ignore the record low unemployment, they ignore amazing job growth and the return of thousand of manufacturing jobs that Obama and Co. said would never return. Liberals have to do a Jedi mind trick in order to convince you that the job growth, tax cuts, low unemployment is happening and that no one is benefitting from any of that.

    All you seem to be able to find are radical Leftists rags that say what you need them to say. Those of us who think critically and think for ourselves and live in the real world, know and see that things are far better than what many on the Left can admit.

    It would take honor, integrity, strength of character and honesty for the Liberals to admit that things are better than they were. Unfortunately, the Left is bereft of any of those qualities.
     
  18. FollowTheWay

    FollowTheWay Well-Known Member
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    You provide no facts. I did. That's because Trump says there are no facts only ratings.
     
  19. GoodTidings

    GoodTidings Well-Known Member

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    All you provided was liberal media talking points that serve as nothing more than bald-faced lies.

    Liberals credit Obama with the current economy when they can't refute how good the economy is doing. Obama said that what we have seen could not and would not happen. It did happen, and then Obama took credit for a booming economy HE said could not happen.

    Now that we are looking forward to an election season, suddenly Liberals claim that Trump's policies had NO positive effect at all on the economy, that Trump's policies have helped no one.

    You cannot have it both ways. You cannot credit Obama for a great economy and then claim the economy isn't good, was never good under Trump and then blame Trump for it.

    You are going to have to decide: Is it a good economy that Obama gets the credit for and Trump inherited, or is it a bad economy that never improved under Trump? Pick one; you can't have both.
     
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  20. InTheLight

    InTheLight Well-Known Member
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    This article is from March 9, 2018. The tax bill had been into effect for two months and one week. You expect workers to receive bonuses and pay raises within 9 weeks of a tax bill being passed and before businesses actually know what the impact will be on their bottom line?

    Three percent of ALL workers did get a pay raise or bonus in the nine weeks following passage of the bill. I think that is pretty good. What percentage of ALL workers do you think should have gotten a bonus or a pay raise in that timeframe?
     
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