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Featured Speaking evil about others

Discussion in 'General Baptist Discussions' started by JonC, Jun 20, 2019.

  1. JonC

    JonC Moderator
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    I’ve noticed a trend to speak about other people rather than doctrines that those people may advocate. Sometimes this is due to false assumptions of other people, sometimes it is due to doctrinal disagreements, and sometimes simple miscommunication.

    When I consider the topic there are passages that come to mind (James 3:2 teaches us to control our speech; Titus 3: 2-2 tells us that Christians are to “speak evil of no one”, and 1 Peter 2:1 has Christians laying aside all evil speaking).

    We are told to test doctrine by the test of Scripture (1 Thessalonians 5:21).

    We are also told that there are false teachers who teach true doctrine (Philippians 1:18) and that people are known by their fruit (Matthew 7:16; Luke 3:9; 1 Corinthians 12:3).


    Is it really a sin to speak evil of other Christians?

    Is it a sin to speak evil about professing Christians who bear evil fruit?
     
  2. JonC

    JonC Moderator
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    Is it really a sin to speak evil of other Christians?


    My answer is yes, of course it is. When we speak evil about other Christians we are speaking evil about Christ.

    This does not mean we do not speak against doctrine we find false. But there is a difference between debating, arguing, or examining doctrine and insulting or debasing the Christian who holds those positions.


    Is it a sin to speak evil about professing Christians who bear evil fruit?


    Again, I believe the answer is yes. These are to be disciplined by the church but in love. The goal is not punitive but restorative. They may be saved. They may not be saved. But the role of the believer is not to speak evil about them.
     
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  3. Reynolds

    Reynolds Well-Known Member
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    "Evil" is too vague a term for this discussion. Speaking truth (in most cases) would not be speaking evil.
     
  4. JonC

    JonC Moderator
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    Speaking the truth is sometimes the most evil of all.

    What I mean by "evil" is with an evil intent. On the BB there have been people who bring up other people who have not been here for years in order to speak about them with an evil intent. The purpose is not to correct them (they are not here) and what is spoken may very well be true. But ask yourself "why?".

    Why would someone keep bringing up a person and making large about how they disagree about that person when that person is not even here to defend their words? Can there be a reason except wickedness?
     
  5. Reynolds

    Reynolds Well-Known Member
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    My thoughts:
    This forum, like all other social sites on the web, people take way too serious. They bring up these long gone people because they have deep, unhealed wounds with them. Internet discussion boards become more about being right and winning the battle than about discussing issues.

    Another thing is that on here we willingly socialize and dialogue with people we disagree with. In face to face interaction, we just assume steer clear of those with opposite opinions.
    In my normal day to day life, I don't talk to Democrats or never Trumpers. I dont like them. Our paths don't cross.
     
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  6. RighteousnessTemperance&

    RighteousnessTemperance& Well-Known Member

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    A lot of truth in that, brother.
    I come across them often enough, but have found it nigh impossible to have a meaningful political conversation with any. The ones I encounter seem so heavily swayed by the rhetoric of the left that they cannot permit input from any other source. I will say that some who are believers have been genuinely surprised at some of the things their favored organizations favor. Perhaps some will wake up from being woke.
     
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  7. Rob_BW

    Rob_BW Well-Known Member
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    Because other newer members post youtube videos of these past members espousing their views?
     
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  8. JonC

    JonC Moderator
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    But does that excuse going beyond the views to speaking against the people?
     
  9. Rob_BW

    Rob_BW Well-Known Member
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    I wasn't necessarily attempting to answer that question with my post. But a lapsed membership shouldn't put them in an off limits status, especially if they're still actively posting content in other venues. Be it Leighton Flowers or Steve Anderson.

    Ad hominem is a separate issue.
     
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  10. JonC

    JonC Moderator
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    I do not believe we should talk about people the way some tend to talk about people. Membership does not play a role at all (Andy Stanley and Andy Stanley's views are two examples....assuming he is not a member). Ad hominem is not a separate issue. It is the issue.
     
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  11. HankD

    HankD Well-Known Member
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    Yes and I have been guilty.

    If it comes to that necessity Jon there is a demeanor that should accompany our talk:

    2 Timothy 2
    24 And the servant of the Lord must not strive; but be gentle unto all men, apt to teach, patient,
    25 In meekness instructing those that oppose themselves; if God peradventure will give them repentance to the acknowledging of the truth;
    26 And that they may recover themselves out of the snare of the devil, who are taken captive by him at his will.

    There is the old saying "one can contend for the faith without being contentious".
     
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  12. Rob_BW

    Rob_BW Well-Known Member
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    You asked:
    Maybe I missed your meaning on the words "make large," but my point is that yes, there can be a reason other than wickedness.

    Look at Origen, Augustine, Pelagius, Aquinas, Luther, Calvin, Spurgeon...none are available to defend themselves, but they've published their views and we have no problem with interacting, agreeing or disagreeing with them. The living shouldn't be any different, if they're still in the public sphere.
     
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  13. JonC

    JonC Moderator
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    I have not seen many folks speaking about people like Augustine. For the most part they speak about doctrine. I have seen people talk about Calvin, but no one takes them seriously.

    I think we are free to argue doctrine. I simply do not see it fitting to talk about people.
     
  14. Iconoclast

    Iconoclast Well-Known Member
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    Exactly correct Rob,
    The new member posted a youtube video. Some have answered Him. Others were here when that member offered his views that have really not changed since then.
    here is the words offered by Skandelon at that time; these are his own words;

     
  15. JonC

    JonC Moderator
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    You are making a pretty unsubstantiated assumption by linking wicked motives to the post about Skandelion. It was meant as a general comment. I wonder why you made the connection with that paticular post.
     
  16. Iconoclast

    Iconoclast Well-Known Member
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    Not at all. I am saying there were no wicked motives at all.
    The new member had just offered a youtube video. I think Rob was speaking of that.[post 7,9}

    RobW said
    and
    It provided a good example. Those debates got heated, sometimes unkind remarks went both ways, and yet everyone worked through the rough spots.
     
    #16 Iconoclast, Jun 22, 2019
    Last edited: Jun 22, 2019
  17. JonC

    JonC Moderator
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    I don't think I can judge the motives of other people, even if I were to follow the thread you reference.

    I am saying sometimes people talk about other people. And I am asking if this is more akin to gossip rather than edification.

    If you or someone else is discussing Skandelion then that is a question for you or that person - not me.
     
  18. Iconoclast

    Iconoclast Well-Known Member
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    Well JOnC, what wickedness were you speaking of exactly? was it just a generic question or did you have something in mind?
     
  19. JonC

    JonC Moderator
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    Read the OP.

    I see this as a trend (speaking about people rather than sticking to doctrine).

    I have noticed this with some people and Skandelion, Van, FollowtheWay and others. As stated, I noticed a trend (one you may not have recognized).

    But the subject is in general. Is it OK to gossip about a Christian for advocating Arminianism if you are a Calvinist (and vice versa) ?
     
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  20. Rob_BW

    Rob_BW Well-Known Member
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    In full disclosure, I invited OldArmy over from another, secular board, so perhaps that's why the recent Skandelon thread was on my mind.
     
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