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Discussion in 'Calvinism & Arminianism Debate' started by atpollard, Sep 18, 2020.

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  1. Derf B

    Derf B Active Member

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    There is a slam dunk victory, but neither side will allow it. That’s why the fight goes on.


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  2. AustinC

    AustinC Well-Known Member

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    I didn't interpret it, and you claim you never interpret, so...how could you know what it's talking about?
    Unless, of course, you do interpret verses. If you do interpret verses, then you did not speak truthfully in your earlier post.
     
  3. atpollard

    atpollard Well-Known Member

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    As someone who converted to Christianity from atheism, NOTHING mattered more to me than “the Truth”. The Roam Catholic Church that convinced me that Jesus existed failed the test of truth when there Catechism was held up to Scripture and history. I was more than happy to believe Wesleyan Arminianism taught by the Church of God of Anderson Indiana except their beliefs could not be reconciled with certain scripture verses and my own empirical experiences. So having studied both sides as a matter of life and death importance, I am very skeptical of your claim of the apparent contradictions being easily resolved with a little honest discussion.

    I suspect you really mean that things would be so much easier if everyone just accepted YOU as pope and then your opinion would be the “correct” one.

    However, I am willing to give it a try.
     
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  4. Derf B

    Derf B Active Member

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    We are saved
    1. When Jesus died in our place
    2. When we believe
    3. When we are raised from the dead
    4. When we enter into His kingdom

    #1 all humanity is saved by the death of Jesus, you can tell, because all will be raised from the dead. This is salvation from the first death. But it isn’t realized until the resurrection happens. Which is #3.
    John 5:28-29 (KJV) 28 Marvel not at this: for the hour is coming, in the which all that are in the graves shall hear his voice, 29 And shall come forth; they that have done good, unto the resurrection of life; and they that have done evil, unto the resurrection of damnation.
    #2 believers are saved when they believe, not from the first death, but from the second death, but it isn’t realized until after the resurrection, which is #4.
    Revelation 20:6 (KJV) Blessed and holy [is] he that hath part in the first resurrection: on such the second death hath no power, but they shall be priests of God and of Christ, and shall reign with him a thousand years.

    Romans 4:17 (KJV) God, who quickeneth the dead, and calleth those things which be not as though they were.


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  5. Derf B

    Derf B Active Member

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    Hmmm. I’ve never had anyone offer to accept me as pope before. I’m afraid I need to refuse, because if I were, you shouldn’t listen to me.
    Matt 23:9


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  6. Reformed1689

    Reformed1689 Well-Known Member

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    Spoken out of true ignorance of Reformed doctrine.
     
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  7. Squire Robertsson

    Squire Robertsson Administrator
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    Six Hour Warning
    This thread will be closed sometime after 4:45 AM Pacific.
     
  8. percho

    percho Well-Known Member
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    Everybody who has ever lived need to be redeemed from being under law, thou shall not eat of it.

    The Son died for the sin of the world. 1 John 2:2 And he is the propitiation for our sins: and not for ours only, but also for the sins of the whole world. John 1:29 The next day John seeth Jesus coming unto him, and saith, Behold the Lamb of God, which taketh away the sin of the world.
    The Father raised him from the dead and gave him glory. 1 Peter 1:21 Who by him do believe in God, that raised him up from the dead, and gave him glory; that your faith and hope might be in God.
    That allowed for the Holy Spirit to be available to be given to those in the flesh. John 7:39 (But this spake he of the Spirit, which they that believe on him should receive: for the Holy Ghost was not yet given; because that Jesus was not yet glorified.)
    It will be that Spirit that will ultimately bring about the end of your salvation. Romans 8:11 But if the Spirit of him that raised up Jesus from the dead dwell in you, he that raised up Christ from the dead shall also quicken your mortal bodies by his Spirit that dwelleth in you.

    Now what is the plan of how that is applied?

    Acts 2:38 For the promise (of the Spirit V 38) is unto you, and to your children, and to all that are afar off, even as many as the Lord our God shall call. The us of Acts 15:8 “So God, who knows the heart, acknowledged them by giving them the Holy Spirit, just as He did to us,

    What about the them of that verse?
    Acts 15:14 Simeon hath declared how God at the first did visit the Gentiles, to take out of them a people for his name.
    Now in my humble opinion the them and us are the same as spoken of is James 1:18,1 Of his own will begat he us with the word of truth, that we should be a kind of firstfruits of his creatures. James, a servant of God and of the Lord Jesus Christ, to the twelve tribes which are scattered abroad, greeting.

    There change relative to Romans 8:11 Takes place at 1 Cor 15:50, Now this I say, brethren, that flesh and blood cannot inherit the kingdom of God; neither doth corruption inherit incorruption.1 Thes 4:14 For if we believe that Jesus died and rose again,< even so them also which sleep in Jesus will God bring with him. (into the kingdom of God)

    What about the rest of the house of the Judah and the house of Israel and the residue of mankind?
    After the taking out a people for his name?

    Why did Jesus stand up and say what he did in John 7:37,38 relative to the Holy Spirit which was not because he was not yet glorified? on the last day that great of the feast. What about the seven days that preceded that great day?

    Acts 15:16 After this (After taking out a people for my name, the kind of first fruit of his creatures) I will return, and will build again the tabernacle of David, which is fallen down; and I will build again the ruins thereof, and I will set it up: What feast was Jesus speaking on?

    Why

    Acts 15:17 That the residue of men might seek after the Lord, and all the Gentiles, upon whom my name is called, saith the Lord, who doeth all these things.

    V 18 Known unto God are all his works from the beginning of the world.
     
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  9. Barry Johnson

    Barry Johnson Well-Known Member

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    [
    .
    of course " you don't understand "
    From a non monolithic worldview I hear this a lot .
     
  10. Salty

    Salty 20,000 Posts Club
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    This thread is closed
    Feel free to start a new thread on this subject
     
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