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Featured The 1952 Revised Standard Bible

Discussion in 'Bible Versions & Translations' started by rlvaughn, Jan 8, 2021.

  1. John of Japan

    John of Japan Well-Known Member
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    No, contrary to the belief of the liberal scholars who translated the RSV, or edited lexicons such as BDB. The Hebrew word almah (עלמה) occurs seven times in the OT, several times demonstrably meaning virgin, but never demonstrably meaning only a "young woman" regardless of her virginity. Furthermore, since Matthew 1:23 translated it through the inspiration of the Holy Spirit as parthenos, παρθένος, and that always means virgin.
     
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  2. Yeshua1

    Yeshua1 Well-Known Member
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    So the Rsv would get that rendering mainly due to them "not reading the NT" back into the OT?
     
  3. John of Japan

    John of Japan Well-Known Member
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    IMO, they got it from being liberal and not believing in the virgin birth. :Cautious
     
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  4. Yeshua1

    Yeshua1 Well-Known Member
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    That would be the best answer!
     
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  5. Ziggy

    Ziggy Well-Known Member
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    Wikipedia:

    "Almah (עַלְמָה‎ ‘almāh, plural: עֲלָמוֹת‎ ‘ălāmōṯ, from a root implying the vigour of puberty) is a Hebrew word for a young woman of childbearing age; despite its importance to the account of the virgin birth of Jesus in the gospel of Matthew, scholars agree that it has nothing to do with virginity. It occurs nine times in the Hebrew Bible".

    "The Septuagint translates most occurrences of almah into a generic word neanis νεᾶνις meaning 'young woman',[12][13] or to neotes νεότης meaning 'youth',[14] both words being derived from neos 'new' and unrelated to virginity.[15] Two occurrences, in the Genesis verse concerning Rebecca[16] and in Isaiah 7:14, are translated into parthenos (παρθένος)".
     
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  6. John of Japan

    John of Japan Well-Known Member
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    Ziggy, my friend, I do not allow my students to cite Wikipedia in their research papers. Therefore, I'll ignore it and stick to my own opinion. :D
     
  7. Yeshua1

    Yeshua1 Well-Known Member
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    How did the renowned BDB render it as meaning?
     
  8. John of Japan

    John of Japan Well-Known Member
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    They give "virgin" as the first (and thus most important) meaning.

    1") virgin, young woman
    1a) of marriageable age
    1b) maid or newly married"

    I certainly don't know where they got the "newly married" one.
     
  9. Yeshua1

    Yeshua1 Well-Known Member
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    Based upon them, should be a young virgin !
     
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  10. rlvaughn

    rlvaughn Well-Known Member
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    When I went back to find this reference I noticed I had a typographical error. It should be:
    “High-lights in the Headlines,” McComb Enterprise-Journal, Friday, December 5, 1952, p. 1.
     
  11. John of Japan

    John of Japan Well-Known Member
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    Mea culpa. A friend noted to me that this is not actually what BDB says. I cited this from e-Sword, but someone has doctored the entry for BDB. Here is the BDB entry from Bibleworks:

    עלמה. [; n. f. young woman (ripe sexually; maid or newly married);—Œ[ Gn 24:43 (J), Ex 2:8 (E), Pr 30:19, Is 7:14; pl. tAml'[] Psalm 68:26, Ct 1:3, 6:8; tAml'[]-l[; to (the voice of) young women, either lit., or of soprano or falsetto of boys: 1 Ch 15:20, Psalm 9:1 (rd. !Bel; tAml'[]-l[; [for !Bel; tWm-l[;], ‘ voce virginea a pueris decantandum, ’ Thes), 46:1, 48:15 (rd. tAml'[]-l[; [for tWm-l[;]; tr. prob. to 49:1).

    Forgive me for not getting all of the Hebrew corrected into the entry (thus the gibberish). I'm giving my students a quiz right now, and then I lecture, so I don't have time to do it right.
     
  12. Yeshua1

    Yeshua1 Well-Known Member
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    So does look like we still needed the Holy Spirit to inform us that He meant Virgin back in Isaiah, as He used Matthew
    to record that down to us!
    So the Rsv not that bad
     
  13. rlvaughn

    rlvaughn Well-Known Member
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    In The New Bible (Revised Standard Version): Why Christians Should Not Accept It, Carl McIntire addresses how they bungled the "thous" and "yous". (Scroll down to number III to see it.)

     
  14. rlvaughn

    rlvaughn Well-Known Member
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    On the RSV, from BibleResearcher.com. The entire article, in which the writer compares the RSV to its predecessor the ASV, can be read HERE. "The Revised Standard Version of the New Testament purported to be a revision of the American Standard Version, although very little of the ASV remains in the RSV. In many passages it bears more resemblance to the version of James Moffatt than to the ASV."

     
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  15. rlvaughn

    rlvaughn Well-Known Member
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    This can be seen in Psalm 2:7 and Hebrews 1:5, one of the examples given by Carl McIntire.
    In Psalm 2:7 RSV, the words are:
    In Hebrews 1:5 RSV, the words are:
    Notice at first the issue of refusing to capitalize “son” in Psalm 2:7, though they did so in Hebrews 1:5. Then notice the more egregious error of using “you” in Psalm 2:7, therefore showing -- based on their own policy of retaining “thou” for deity -- that they neuter Psalm 2:7 from being a predictive OT prophecy of Jesus Christ. In my opinion, like many who forcefully rejected the 1952 RSV, this kind of error, multiplied, is evidence of liberal bias rather than editorial oversight.
     
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  16. rlvaughn

    rlvaughn Well-Known Member
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    From A Critique of the Revised Standard Version by C. P. Lincoln, Merrill F. Unger, S. Lewis Johnson, and other the Faculty of Dallas Theological Seminary.
     
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  17. rlvaughn

    rlvaughn Well-Known Member
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    The Revised Standard Version really met its “comeuppance” from evangelicals, conservatives, and fundamentalists after the entire Bible (Old and New Testaments) was printed in 1952. However, at least some Christians noticed a problem as soon as the New Testament was available. Edward Burden Warren, pastor of the Southern Baptist church in Orrville, Alabama, wrote letters about it to the Montgomery Advertiser and Selma Times-Journal in December 1953.

    “The student of the Bible is shocked to read the statement of the revisers, ‘After two years of debate and experiment it was to abandon these forms (Thou, Thee, and Thine) and to follow modern usage, except in language addressed to God.’

    “In the Revised Standard Version Jesus is addressed as ‘You.’ See Matthew 4:3 for a case, ‘If you are the Son of God, etc.’ The translators intentionally did this. According to their statement Jesus is not divine. The revisers say that they debated two years over this matter and decided to address only God with ‘Thou’.

    “The sum total of the translators’ statement is that they do not believe in the deity of Jesus Christ.”

    Edward B. Warren, Orrville, Alabama, “Revision of the Bible,” in the “Tell It to Old Grandma” column, The Montgomery Advertiser, Sunday, December 15, 1946, p. 4-A.

    upload_2021-1-28_8-51-31.png

    “Revised Standard Version,” in “Letter Box” column,
    The Selma Times-Journal, Sunday, December 15, 1946, p. 4​
     
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  18. rlvaughn

    rlvaughn Well-Known Member
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    Too late to edit now, but obviously that is a typo and should be December 1946.
     
  19. Ziggy

    Ziggy Well-Known Member
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    RSV related critiques from 1946-51 relate only to the NT, since the RSV OT was not published until 1952. Criticisms after 1952 apply to OT as well as NT.

    My primary criticism in the RSV OT relates to the high number of conjectures they place in the text whenever they think the Hebrew or Aramaic to be "too difficult."
     
  20. kathleenmariekg

    kathleenmariekg Active Member

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    This is not a college classroom at a school that provides access to a library. Wikipedia provides access to online information that ALL people on an online forum can access so that ALL can participate in a conversation. To exclude people from the opportunity to join a conversation by refusing to accept the only information that they have access to is ...

    My community college never had access to the materials that university students have access to. And the longer I am out of school, the more access I am losing. When people set the bar above my access level, I am being forced out of more and more conversations. But maybe those are conversations that I don't belong in. I think sometimes those that exclude the masses lose out more than the masses lose by being excluded from the conversations of the minority.
     
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