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Featured Cultural Interaction pt2

Discussion in 'General Baptist Discussions' started by Iconoclast, Mar 22, 2021.

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  1. Iconoclast

    Iconoclast Well-Known Member
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    On page 134 he writes we have traded the God of The Bible for the god of the state who is man enlarged where the will of the people personified by an elite bureaucracy, now redefine law in the name of the people, the new god.
    This has been in no small part due to a faulty theology amongst christians and a consequent abdication of responsibility by the church in the socio political sphere.
    Due to the philosophical dualism that has so greatly influence the church modern christians have tended to separate God's law and covenant from real history and implicitly assumed that the state is not actually accountable to Gods standards.
     
  2. Iconoclast

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    False human philosophy tried to replace God and His word;
    Age of Reason

    Age of Reason – Reason, Rationality and Enlightenment
    The Age of Reason brought about a great change in the tale of man’s sojourn on earth.

    Reason, rationality and enlightenment became the new ‘gods.’


    For the previous seventeen hundred years the perfection of man was only to be obtained through grace after death. The Protestant revolt to the Catholic Church and subsequent ‘holy wars’ had done nothing to change the accepted underlying beliefs of society: revelation was the source of ultimate truth and could only be received as a communication from God. This was the basis of Christianity.

    Now, in this new age, man felt obligated to follow his own intellect, not ‘revealed’ truth.


    Earth and emphasis on nature became the new dogma; miracles, prophecy, and religious rites were mere superstitions.

    Reason, philosophically, is defined as the ability to form and operate upon concepts in abstraction, narrowing information to its bare content, without emotion. Rationality carries the dual implication of ordered inference and comprehension along with understanding and explanation.

    Enlightenment is more or less the application of reason and rationality to previously held beliefs resulting in broader, clearer thinking.

    Age of Reason – The Christian View
    The Age of Reason was fraught with attacks on basic Christian beliefs, rejection of God and denial of miracles.


    In an attempt to divorce himself from the mysticism of the Middle Ages, man during the Age of Reason, applauded intellect and disdained spirit. God was believed to be unknowable, if He existed at all, and certainly there was no need for divine communication or revelation.


    Nature was revelation enough, showing all that needed to be known of God. Man was now free to postulate his own theories of existence and ideas about earth and its relation to the sun.
     
  3. Iconoclast

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    pt2
    The irony of the period is that though man sought and believed himself to be enlightened, he missed the basic truths that would have been clear to him had he not hardened his heart in denunciation of God.

    Yes, indeed, God is revealed in nature: “The heavens declare the glory of God; the skies proclaim the work of his hands. Day after day they pour forth speech; night after night they display knowledge” (Psalm 19:1-2). The glory of God is clearly revealed in the works of God’s hands. He alone is the giver of wisdom and knowledge. In deviating from the Bible, God’s Word, as absolute truth, man has formulated all kinds of theories to explain his world.

    But as 1 Corinthians 3:19 says, “For the wisdom of this world is foolishness in God's sight...”

    God can only be found through a heart of faith. God has created man with the ability to think, discover, and reason. But all searching must first begin with God, recognizing Him as the author of all things and the One with absolute power and authority. “The fear of the LORD is the beginning of wisdom; all who follow his precepts have good understanding. To him belongs eternal praise” (Psalm 111:10).
     
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    Age of Reason - By Historical Period - The Basics of Philosophy

    The Age of Reason period of the Modern era of philosophy is generally regarded as the start of modern philosophy, and roughly equates to the 17th Century.

    It includes the following major philosophers:

    Hobbes, Thomas (1588 - 1679) English
    Descartes, René (1596 - 1650) French
    Pascal, Blaise (1623 - 1662) French
    Spinoza, Baruch (Benedict) (1623 - 1677) Dutch-Jewish
    Locke, John (1632 - 1704) English
    Malebranche, Nicolas (1638 - 1715) French
    Leibniz, Gottfried Wilhelm (1646 - 1716) German
    The Age of Reason saw a continuation of the move away from theology and faith-based arguments, and marks the shaking off of medieval approaches to philosophy such as Scholasticism, in preference for more unified philosophical systems like Rationalism and British Empiricism. The advances in science, the growth of religious tolerance and the rise of philosophical liberalism also led to a revival in Political Philosophy in general.

    Along with the Age of Enlightenment of the 18th Century, which the Age of Reason gave rise to, it is also known as the Early Modern period.

    The church accepted these explanations. By doing so they truncated the gospel.
     
  5. Iconoclast

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    The case is made in this book Mission of God, by Joe Boot is that Individual Christians have to give diligence to be saturated in scripture and be totally word-centered.
    He clearly states that we cannot"Christianize" a fallen world.
    \Regeneration is essential to be able to see the Kingdom of God as Jesus taught in JN.3
    Nevertheless, he is making a case that the nations are not out of range from God's control.
    All men everywhere are subject to God's law /word.
    Our responsibility is to proclaim to a fallen dying world their need to repent and bow their knee to God. Mt 28 :18-20 is the marching order.
     
  6. Iconoclast

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    A.A.Hodge pg256...evangelical theology said;
    The process by which the Kingdom grows through its successful successive stages toward its alternate completion can of course be very inadequately understood by us. Still, we shall attempt to explain, as best we are able, how the Kingdom of God grows practically and concretely through time .
    As we have seen, the Kingdom of Christ is comprehensive. He rules over all things in every way. This is already true. Yet, the Kingdom also grows. We must hear recall that distinction that we made between the universal rule of Christ, and a blessing not come to those who submit to him. Christ already rules of all men and nations, but not all men and nations acknowledge and. There are still rebels. The Kingdom grows when rebels submit to the king's rule. Let us look at several examples of how this operates concretely..
    Christ already rules over the hearts and minds. This is implied by the fact that Christ rules all things. If He rules everything , He must also rule of hearts and minds. What does it mean for Christ to be king of all hearts? It is in an object of sense, it means that Christ blesses obedient and faithful thoughts and cast down vain imaginations. By his word, the incarnate word test the thoughts and motives of all hearts as in Hebrews 4 verses 12 and 13 this is true of everyone, whether or not he or she recognizes it. Even those whose mind is set on the flesh are under Christ's authority; unless they repent they will receive the punishment due their sins as in Romans 8:6
     
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    The "from Hodge was used in the book the reduction of Christianity, By Gary Demar and Peter Leithart.pgs225-227;

    Christ rule advances when rebels submit their minds and hearts to Hm. Actually, sinners cannot do this of themselves. Only when the Spirit can give a man a spiritual mind as in Romans chapter 8:1- 5 .
    When the Spirit unites us to Christ, we received new life, the life of the resurrected Christ.
    We are given a new heart as ezk 36: 26 this enables us to acknowledge willingly and openly that Christ is Lord 1st Corinthians 12: 3 we do this, we are removed from the curses of Christ rule and enter into the blessings that is peace joy and contentment.
     
    #67 Iconoclast, May 3, 2021
    Last edited: May 3, 2021
  8. Iconoclast

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    They continue saying Paul exhorts us to submit on minds and hearts to Christ rule Romans 12 verses 1 and 2 second Corinthians chapter 10 verses 4 and 5. This occurs definitely when we are converted, but there is also a progressive aspect. Each of us individually must become more and more obedient to his rule as we submit ourselves to his commands and, in the power of the spirit, put off Flash to death Romans 8:13 col's 3:5 when Christ returns and we are fully transformed into his image on minds will be finally purified and made submissive to Him. This personal submission to Christ rule is basic to that extent hes quoting of Atheologian named Dave Hunt, is correct the rule of Christ as inner and spiritual, there it reacting to Dave Hunt making a response on this topic in reference to the Kingdom.
    We are also called to preach the good news of the Kingdom to those around us. The Holy Spirit uses our witness and service to bring others under the rule of Christ. Thus, the Kingdom increases both intensively and extensively. That is, the subjects of the king become more and more submissive and responsive to Him, and more and more people submit to the king and his commands.
     
    #68 Iconoclast, May 3, 2021
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    From the individual submitting to Christ, we must also submit our families to His rule; we must acknowledge that Christ rules our homes and we must obey Him in our family relationships.
    All families are already under Christ's rule.
    Families that rebel against Him will be judged unto the third and fourth generations.
    When a family comes under Christ's gracious rule, they receiving His blessing, and commit themselves to live by His standards for family life.
    Wives must submit themselves to their husbands, children must be obedient to their parents[Eph5:22-6:4]

    Christ is still our King when we enter the workplace. He owns all things and has given us whatever we have. We are His stewards. We must use His resources as He directs. Thus, for example,
    we must avoid debt.[rom.13:8]
    As employees and employers, we must acknowledge His rule and submit to His commands.
    Employers are to treat their employees fairly Eph6:9, and employees are to render good service as to Christ.Eph6:5-8 2thess3:6-12.
    Christ blesses any business or organization that functions this way.

    Christ is King over all civil officials and civil governments, the King of kings and Lord of lords. { I tim6:15, Rev11:15 19:6]
    Civil officials must acknowledge the lordship of Christ, and obey his rules for civil governments.Psalm2:10-12 rom13:1
    The blessings of the Kingdom-peace, stability, and justice- will come to all nations that acknowledge the King and enforce His laws.
     
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    The quote from J.C. Ryle is a partial description of why the things proposed in this book look like a distant dream rather than a current reality.
     
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    pg138;
    The more humanistic and antinomian that Christians become in their attitude towards time and History, the more frustrated and hopeless they will feel about life and its prospects. theologies that promise an ability to manipulate have become captive to occultist, pseudo-Christian theologies that promise an ability to manipulate God and one's circumstances by the "force of faith", positive thinking or confession, visualization, and various actualizing techniques.
    Others have developed elaborate theologies of retreat and escape from the world, in which every newsworthy event is another omen of approaching apocalypse and our timely escape from history before its fall into ruin.
    pg139
    God gives meaning and unity to every event in history.
    Nothing is meaningless or without purpose.

    We are in a perpetual co-operation with God in history for the glorious purposes of His Kingdom
     
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    He is constantly pointing back to some of the positive attitudes held by saints who have gone before us and trying to glean the most positive aspects of the worldview they held with a view to encourage and advance a stronger view of God's purpose.
    Now as I read this, it seems like a tall order because in that many churches I have visited and attended are not quite up to the task.
    By that I mean on an individual level many are lagging behind.
    \God is able to work despite that, however, it seems to me that sloppy, lazy, professed believers are not ready for primetime.

    We need to have more of a battleship mentality, than a cruise ship identity.
     
  14. Iconoclast

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    https://www.youtube.com/results?search_query=john+macarthur+we+lose+down+here

    At the 9 minute mark, JM. tells us that....we lose down here!
    We lose the battle but in the long run we in the war.

    I learned that view at first but discovered that was not always the dominant view. I was content with learning that the bible has us covered from start to finish,
    He dismisses the view I hold now but does not really discuss or look at it.
    I like JM. I like that he understands repentance and faith. I like that he takes a public stand with the hostile media.He seeks to exalt Jesus.
    He has set a good example.
    I have worked my way into a different view of end times.
    Does that make John MacArthur my enemy?
    Why should it?
    I am not here to Judge another' servant.
    I will support him on most other things, but in one area I see another way to understand the passages. I can also be critical of what I think he has wrong.

    I believe God has ordained the Church to be victorious, worldwide.



    4 There is a river, the streams whereof shall make glad the city of God, the holy place of the tabernacles of the most High.

    5 God is in the midst of her; she shall not be moved: God shall help her, and that right early.

    6 The heathen raged, the kingdoms were moved: he uttered his voice, the earth melted.

    7 The Lord of hosts is with us; the God of Jacob is our refuge. Selah.

    8 Come, behold the works of the Lord, what desolations he hath made in the earth.

    9 He maketh wars to cease unto the end of the earth; he breaketh the bow, and cutteth the spear in sunder; he burneth the chariot in the fire.

    10 Be still, and know that I am God: I will be exalted among the heathen, I will be exalted in the earth.

    11 The Lord of hosts is with us; the God of Jacob is our refuge. Selah.
     
    #74 Iconoclast, May 5, 2021
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    On pg135 Harold Berman points out;
    At the heart of the transformation of English law in the 17th century was the Anglo - calvinist belief that God had made a covenant with the English people that England was an elect Nation, chosen, as the children of Israel had once been chosen, to be a light to all the nations.
    To this belief in a Divine Covenant was added the calvinist doctrine that history is wholly within the Providence of God, and that the history of the English people, the history of the institutions, was the Heritage on which the Constitutional law was founded and which gave guidance for the future development of Calvinism in his English form and also contributed to revolt against Royal absolutism and the establishment of the supremacy of a parliamentary aristocracy.
     
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    On pg137
    The Christian vision for history and politics this involves the manifestation of the kingdom of God by the employment mentation of God's law in the social political and cultural spheres. This is what are Protestant for Beres believe, and we have lived off the momentum of their hard-won victories for several centuries. God's kingdom is Manifest in history as his Mercy, kindness and Justice is made manifest, bring me freedom and liberty from tyranny and the arbitrary power of men - the rule of law and the are equality under the law of God is one of the greatest privileges of Western history, and we surrender it at our own peril.
    Are abandonment of the Living God and His law for the god of pluralism, has given us a new law -order that is having revolutionary consequences today, seeing an increasing lawlessness, tyranny, and depravity of the western culture.
     
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    In the next 25- 30 pages examples of man's carnal philosophies are mentioned and shown as they are, quite defective on many levels.
    I personally do not like to interact with such philosophy as I find it vain.
    I am glad that others have taken the time to dismantle these rebellious ideas that seek to enable sinful men to continue on in their rebellion.

    We are to be ready to address everything in life from a biblical lens.
    He is trying to identify main idols that men try to put in the place of the truth of God as if there can be neutral ground.
     
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    Here Doug Wilson jumps in and sorts out some of these opposing philosophies;
     
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    In his book gospel witness defending and extending the kingdom of God on page 44 and 45 he says this;
    remember if the common route of unbelief is a heart condition not a lack of information, evidence ,or convincing arguments for the gospel; then it is not so much a problem with insufficient irrational warrant for faith in God, but spiritual blindness and sinful unbelief hindering a person, then the heart and deep attachment to cherish lies must be taken into account as we witness. According to Christ, those who truly seek will find. This means, ultimately, that the reason unbelievers excuses rooted in their sin, they are not genuinely seeking the truth which is in Christ Jesus. As Kreeft notes, if we do not love the truth, we will not seek it. If we do not seek it, we will not find it. If we do not find it we will not know it. If we do not know it, we have failed our fundamental task in time, and quite likely also an eternity. So our task is to encourage the unbeliever, in the power of the Holy Spirit, to become a true Seeker, for the word of God promises, you will seek me and find me when you search for me with all your heart. I will be found of you.this is the Lords declaration. Jer29:13-14 ...Mt7:7-8

    From Christianity for modern pagans.pg217.
     
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    On gospel witness page 56 we read the following,
    we now turn to the ultimate concerns into the challenge of actually unmasking and critiquing worldviews competing with Christianity in the marketplace of ideas. The primary test for those engaged in Christian apologetics is the Faithfully expose the origin, incoherence and finally the self-destructive character of non-Christian thought and highlight the antinomies patent in apostate religion and philosophy - directing people to Christ in the process.
    In our time, the dominant worldview underlying Western cultural life is humanistic and synchronistic. As part of our gospel witness, we will expose the ancient origins of this world view, and point to its failure and inadequacy, but pointing toward Christ in his kingdom as the only satisfying answer to this apostate faith that has persisted from antiquity in various guises.
     
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