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I guess Cheney does not trust voters

Discussion in 'Political Debate & Discussion' started by Salty, Dec 26, 2022.

  1. Baptist Believer

    Baptist Believer Well-Known Member
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    Let's be specific. "The man" is Anthony "Tony" Ornato.

    Incorrect. He said he did not recall a conversation like that, which is a far cry from saying it didn't happen (see transcript, beginning on page 130, line 21). He was specifically asked by Cheney whether his "testimony is you don't recall that conversation happening, or that it did not occur?" (page 135, lines 12-13). Ornato claimed he had no recall of that conversation, despite multiple other witnesses testifying under oath (including a military aide) that such a conversation occurred.

    He did testify. However, his testimony was quite inconsistent with other testimony and evidence. He appeared to have a bad case of amnesia regarding critical events, and claimed to be quite uninformed about things going on around him that were directly relevant to his job.

    So she refused to use public hearings to put forward a witness who does not claim to remember either way about an event, when she has other witnesses who claim to remember... That's a strange way to claim she is biased.

    However, she has made his testimony public, but it is clear you haven't actually read any of it, nor want to inform yourself of the January 6th Committee Report because it would undermine what you want to believe.

    Lots of it have come out. However, you simply reject it out of hand by claiming it is all from "Trump haters" -- apparently not realizing that almost every witness to the January 6th Committee was a Republican, and many are still loyal to him.

    Bottom line. You are not qualified to talk about the January 6th Committee Report without reading it.
     
  2. 37818

    37818 Well-Known Member

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    No evidence exists that Trump violated the 14th amendment.
     
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  3. Baptist Believer

    Baptist Believer Well-Known Member
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    Of course not. However, I suspect you have misread the text of the 14th Amendment. It would take a 2/3 vote of Congress to ALLOW Trump to run for office if he was determined to have engaged in rebellion or insurrection.
     
  4. Baptist Believer

    Baptist Believer Well-Known Member
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    Sure it does, but you are allowed not to agree.
     
  5. 37818

    37818 Well-Known Member

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    What is the evidence?
     
  6. 37818

    37818 Well-Known Member

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    In other words, the evidence has to be made up.
     
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  7. 37818

    37818 Well-Known Member

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    Fourteenth Amendment



    Section 1


    All persons born or naturalized in the United States, and subject to the jurisdiction thereof, are citizens of the United States and of the State wherein they reside. No State shall make or enforce any law which shall abridge the privileges or immunities of citizens of the United States; nor shall any State deprive any person of life, liberty, or property, without due process of law; nor deny to any person within its jurisdiction the equal protection of the laws.



    Section 2


    Representatives shall be apportioned among the several States according to their respective numbers, counting the whole number of persons in each State, excluding Indians not taxed. But when the right to vote at any election for the choice of electors for President and Vice-President of the United States, Representatives in Congress, the Executive and Judicial officers of a State, or the members of the Legislature thereof, is denied to any of the male inhabitants of such State, being twenty-one years of age, and citizens of the United States, or in any way abridged, except for participation in rebellion, or other crime, the basis of representation therein shall be reduced in the proportion which the number of such male citizens shall bear to the whole number of male citizens twenty-one years of age in such State.



    Section 3


    No person shall be a Senator or Representative in Congress, or elector of President and Vice-President, or hold any office, civil or military, under the United States, or under any State, who, having previously taken an oath, as a member of Congress, or as an officer of the United States, or as a member of any State legislature, or as an executive or judicial officer of any State, to support the Constitution of the United States, shall have engaged in insurrection or rebellion against the same, or given aid or comfort to the enemies thereof. But Congress may by a vote of two-thirds of each House, remove such disability.



    Section 4


    The validity of the public debt of the United States, authorized by law, including debts incurred for payment of pensions and bounties for services in suppressing insurrection or rebellion, shall not be questioned. But neither the United States nor any State shall assume or pay any debt or obligation incurred in aid of insurrection or rebellion against the United States, or any claim for the loss or emancipation of any slave; but all such debts, obligations and claims shall be held illegal and void.



    Section 5


    The Congress shall have the power to enforce, by appropriate legislation, the provisions of this article.
     
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  8. Baptist Believer

    Baptist Believer Well-Known Member
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  9. RighteousnessTemperance&

    RighteousnessTemperance& Well-Known Member

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    A major problem is that the wolves keep crying wolf and some people are still brainwashed enough to buy into it, while others can see through their hypocrisy.

    This highly select, partisan committee was designed to be biased toward a Dem Progressive Left narrative.

    It’s just like the Mueller “investigation” and report and the impeachments with their “investigations,” all of which knowingly falsely accused Trump, because a Trump presidency impedes the Dem agenda of further destroying America.
     
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  10. canadyjd

    canadyjd Well-Known Member

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    So, nearly the entire Dem party is disqualified from holding office because they violated their oath of office when they supporters the BLM riots for two years, including multiple attacks in DC, right?

    Yeah, selective moral outrage is the standard for the left.

    peace to you
     
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    • Winner Winner x 1
  11. canadyjd

    canadyjd Well-Known Member

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    I am qualified to recognize bias, lying and misinformation propaganda from the left. Was Adam Shiftts name on the document? Cheney? They are obvious liars.

    The OP is about the lying, misinformation queen Liz Cheney. She was held accountable for her lies by the people who know her best and the voters fired her. Her political career is OVER!

    Just a few short years ago she was on a path to be the repub leader in the house and even Speaker of the House.

    Then she was infected with TDS. She exposed her own deception and lies in a pathetic attempt to undermine a POTUS that wasn’t part of the elite class in DC. She revealed her disgust for any American that wasn’t smart enough to reject Trump and accept the elite narratives.

    I’m glad she’s gone. The j6 hearings were a joke. She lied and pushed disinformation. She is corrupt. She is a hater. She is an arrogant elite. I’m glad she’s gone.

    peace to you
     
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  12. Salty

    Salty 20,000 Posts Club
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    I understand that the Speaker would not allow the R minority leader to choose the R's who would sit on the committee. Hmmmmm
     
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  13. 37818

    37818 Well-Known Member

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  14. canadyjd

    canadyjd Well-Known Member

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    Pelosi chose two Trump hating repubs to sit on the committee just so she could claim it was “bipartisan” which was more disinformation.

    peace to you
     
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  15. Salty

    Salty 20,000 Posts Club
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    • Informative Informative x 1
  16. RighteousnessTemperance&

    RighteousnessTemperance& Well-Known Member

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    Exactly. That is a key point and par for the course.

    The intent of the Dem Progressive Left was and is to use all of their power and influence to attack Trump, falsely accuse him, discredit him with their lies and deception.
     
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  17. JonC

    JonC Moderator
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    Unfortunately that is not true (it falls on a simple majority vote by Congress, not the legal system, to decide if Trump's comments and/or actions constituted a rebellion against the US Constitution).

    In other words, Trump's actions themselves don't have to meet the legal definition of insurrection.

    The possible saving point is whether the 14th Ammendment can be applied to the US Presidency.

    IMHO, it is just a DNC political move. Trump does not have a chance of being elected. He has isolated himself from constitutionalists, from mainstream Republicans, from the pro-lifers (with his latest comments), and from independents.

    But Trump can still be a club used by the DNC to slander the GOP, to scare moderates, to galvanize support, and to widen a divide within the GOP.
     
  18. Salty

    Salty 20,000 Posts Club
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    But if the R's do nominate someone (other than Trump) would he mount an independent campaign?

    Remember - 1992 Bush vs Clinton vs Perot -
    If Perot had not run - it is very possible that Bush could have won -
    1992 United States presidential election - Wikipedia
     
  19. JonC

    JonC Moderator
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    I think his ego may demand it.

    I liked Trump as President (and loved his platform). But he never was able to take responsibility for any of his mistakes (he always passed the blame to others).

    So I suspect that he will not be able to bring himself to support another nominee. But given the 2022 midterm election were he to support the GOP then it may even hurt. So it's going to be interesting for the GOP.

    The DNC will probably do everything to keep Trump in the spotlight because he is the best tool they have at their disposal.

    The GOP needs the pro-Trump Republican vote, but they also need the never-Trump Republican votes. They need some type of graceful exit for Trump - one that will move Trumpers to support the GOP but also not appear to have Trump working behind the scenes as the GOP needs to keep the anti-abortionist "extremists" (the ones Trump blames for the mid-term defeats), the moderates, and gain independent voters.
     
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  20. 37818

    37818 Well-Known Member

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    So it is the DNC against truth. I honestly do not have any information to know Trump caused the Jan 6th occurance.
     
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