1. Welcome to Baptist Board, a friendly forum to discuss the Baptist Faith in a friendly surrounding.

    Your voice is missing! You will need to register to get access to all the features that our community has to offer.

    We hope to see you as a part of our community soon and God Bless!

Respect of Persons

Discussion in '2000-02 Archive' started by JMF, Nov 29, 2002.

  1. Frogman

    Frogman <img src="http://www.churches.net/churches/fubc/Fr

    Joined:
    Jan 15, 2001
    Messages:
    5,492
    Likes Received:
    0
    We should bear in mind this choice is not evidence of 'respect of persons.'

    Rather this choice is based on the will of God and whatsoever pleaseth Him He doeth.

    When we refuse to acknowledge the truth of scripture concerning election we make God into a corruptible being subject to the same emotions we are. If this were true would he be subject to bribery? Would he be made a debtor to man?

    This scripture is plead more often than most to attempt to prove God gave man a free will and ability to choose. First of all, man is not able to see (in the natural condition) the merits of the choice of believing God.

    Next, man loves darkness, his deeds are evil and will be exposed if brought into the light. This requires a supernatural force to be exerted upon any who would come. (That force is found not on popular "reality" t.v. shows, but only through the will and purpose of God in sending forth the Holy Spirit to teach the truth to the sinner and regenerate his spirit whereby then and only then is he able to cry out for mercy for his sin.

    Judgement is upon sin, it is not personal. Christ, though I have heard preachers preach differently, was not judged as a sinner, sin was judged and the elect was found in that judgement at calvary. This is biblical truth. How can the Son of God, 'declared the Son of God in power through the spirit of holiness' be viewed as having been judged as a sinner.

    John the Baptist said: "Behold the Lamb of God, which taketh away the sin of the world." He did not say Christ was come to be judged as a sinner.

    True the scripture said he became sin for us. But we also see 'for sin, he condemned sin in the flesh.' No man can do this, it required God.

    The idea that 'no respecter of persons' is deeper than to open the eyes of Peter to the eternal plan, supported in the Law and Prophets of God taking for Himself peoples from all nations and tribes is just that, an idea. It is devised, delivered and utilized to build, support and edify the ego of ministers who have grown weary of preaching the Gospel to a rebellious and gainsaying people.

    (example: Ministers are often more concerned about physical financial support than they are of the spiritual support from God and the prayers of God's people. In order to justify your sending a 'love offering' much labor is directed at providing evidence of the working of God through their ministries. Thus they fall into the snare of praying, preaching, talking and tracting people into the Kingdom of God. In doing so, they leave off the weighter matters of tearing down, rooting out and then building up. These latter methods are 'hard' and unpopular, they do not generate as much funds.)

    I would rather declare the truth of the Gospel, have the Spirit work or not work and know that I am clean from the blood of any man.

    As far as stories of buddies taking another man's wife and justifying it by predestination, all that is proven is the carnal nature of man. God is no where responsible for man choosing to add to his nature sins of personal commission. Even Adam and Eve attempted to work God in this way, and they failed. (Adam said, 'the woman thou hast given me' Eve said, the serpent beguiled me.

    We listen too much to secular philosophy and devise methods of projecting causes for the nature we possess. It is no wonder when we do sin we would attempt to project that sin upon an eternal decree of God. This does not excuse us, however, we, and not God are found guilty. All this does is provide the garment of fig leaves which Adam provided, a garment which will rip, tear and rot. When given a choice apart from the "goading" of the Spirit we choose this garment rather than the eternal, seamless, uncorruptible garment of righteousness provided through Christ.

    God Bless.
    Bro. Dallas
     
  2. Primitive Baptist

    Primitive Baptist New Member

    Joined:
    May 20, 2002
    Messages:
    821
    Likes Received:
    0
    If one examines the context of Acts 2 and Romans 10, nothing in these passages contradicts unconditional election. In Acts 2, Peter is teaching that God does not respect nationalities. In Romans 10, Paul is teaching that the attitude of God towards sin is the same for all men, both Jew and Gentile, because sin is sin. Therefore, you have no argument.

    "And God looked upon the children of Israel, and God had respect unto them." (Exodus 2:25)
     
  3. pinoybaptist

    pinoybaptist Active Member
    Site Supporter

    Joined:
    Mar 17, 2002
    Messages:
    8,136
    Likes Received:
    3
    Faith:
    Baptist
    Yeah, and I had a friend who became a Martian because he figures by becoming a Martian God will no longer see him as a human being subject to His wrath and therefore he can indulge himself in all those sinful Martian lifestyles.
     
  4. Primitive Baptist

    Primitive Baptist New Member

    Joined:
    May 20, 2002
    Messages:
    821
    Likes Received:
    0
    Amen, pinoybaptist. If I didn't know any better, I'd say this scenario and the others I've seen on here are just made up garbage to give credit the Arminian view of God.

    "But how lamentable is the infatuation of, blind mortals, when 'The vain race of flesh and blood
    contend with their Creator, God; When mortal man presumes to be more holy, wise or just than He.'"

    [Elder Gilbert Beebe, 1880]
     
  5. Charlie T

    Charlie T New Member

    Joined:
    Oct 24, 2002
    Messages:
    112
    Likes Received:
    0
    I think that Arminians often forget about the Depravity of Man. Without understanding this, Particular Atonement is confusing.

    Each and every man has chosen against God and is dead in his sins. He is a slave to sin. That is not at all God's fault. A Just God would be righteous to damn the whole species.

    But our Merciful and Gracious God has chosen to save some based on His eternal sovereign plan. Those that He saves are only saved by His grace and none by their works or goodness or faith, for all that they can do in their own abilities is filthy before God.

    But, when God regenerates some for His own good pleasure and effectually saves them, that is grace. That is no respector of persons. That is a Sovereign God who is ABLE to fulfill all of His plans.

    Charlie
     
  6. JMF

    JMF New Member

    Joined:
    Nov 2, 2002
    Messages:
    60
    Likes Received:
    0
    First of all I'm not an Arminian.
    Mainly stating that I do not agree with the teaching that a person can lose their salvation.

    I agree, God would be just to damn everyone.

    Romans 11:32 For God hath concluded them all in unbelief, that he might have mercy upon all.

    Romans 3:23 For all have sinned, and come short of the glory of God;

    Jeremiah 17:9-10 The heart is deceitful above all things, and desperately wicked: who can know it? I the LORD search the heart, I try the reins, even to give every man according to his ways, and according to the fruit of his doings.

    The problem is that Calvinism teaches that God predetermined the salvation of the elect and inseparable from this teaching is the teaching that God predetermined the damnation of every lost person.

    Sounds good but...

    Ezekiel 18:23 Have I any pleasure at all that the wicked should die? saith the Lord GOD: and not that he should return from his ways, and live?

    Ezekiel 33:11 Say unto them, As I live, saith the Lord GOD, I have no pleasure in the death of the wicked; but that the wicked turn from his way and live: turn ye, turn ye from your evil ways; for why will ye die, O house of Israel?

    If you had 8 kids and gave supper to the ones that were your favorites, would that be fair?would that not be respect of persons?

    You see if God predetermined who would be saved everyone would have been saved (according to Ezekial.)

    Isaiah 45:22 Look unto me, and be ye saved, all the ends of the earth: for I am God, and there is none else.

    1 Corinthians 15:21-22 For since by man came death, by man came also the resurrection of the dead. For as in Adam all die, even so in Christ shall all be made alive.

    1 John 2:1-2 My little children, these things write I unto you, that ye sin not. And if any man sin, we have an advocate with the Father, Jesus Christ the righteous: And He is the propitiation for our sins: and not for ours only, but also for the sins of the whole world.

    You see Christ purchased the redemption of the whole human race (i.e. fair chance for all) The catch is that only a few will choose to accept this redemption. God foreknew who would choose salvation, this is why the elect were chosen in Him from the foundation of the world.

    1 Peter 1:2 Elect according to the foreknowledge of God the Father, through sanctification of the Spirit, unto obedience and sprinkling of the blood of Jesus Christ: Grace unto you, and peace, be multiplied.

    What is the vehicle of election? the foreknowledge of God (not the will of God), because God's will would have everyone to be saved, this is why He commands His elect to:

    Mark 16:15-16 And He(Jesus) said unto them, Go ye into all the world, and preach the gospel to every creature. He that believeth and is baptized shall be saved; but he that believeth not shall be damned.
     
  7. JMF

    JMF New Member

    Joined:
    Nov 2, 2002
    Messages:
    60
    Likes Received:
    0
    It pleases God to see people look to Him for salvation. Shouldn't He have willed all to be saved if it's His good pleasure to see all men come to saving knowledge of Himself?

    1 Timothy 2:3-6 For this is good and acceptable in the sight of God our Saviour; Who will have all men to be saved, and to come unto the knowledge of the truth. For there is one God, and one mediator between God and men, the man Christ Jesus; Who gave himself a ransom for all, to be testified in due time.

    Sovereign God:

    Isaiah 46:10 Declaring the end from the beginning, and from ancient times the things that are not yet done, saying, My counsel shall stand, and I will do all my pleasure:

    Sovereign God:

    Ezekiel 18:23 Have I any pleasure at all that the wicked should die? saith the Lord GOD: and not that he should return from his ways, and live?

    Ezekiel 18:32 For I have no pleasure in the death of him that dieth, saith the Lord GOD: wherefore turn yourselves, and live ye.

    Ezekiel 33:11 Say unto them, As I live, saith the Lord GOD, I have no pleasure in the death of the wicked; but that the wicked turn from his way and live: turn ye, turn ye from your evil ways; for why will ye die, O house of Israel?

    2 Peter 3:9 The Lord is not slack concerning his promise, as some men count slackness; but is longsuffering to us-ward, not willing that any should perish, but that all should come to repentance.

    According to Ezekial this applies to the lost man too.
     
Loading...