Is faith a work?

John 6:40 "For this is the will of My Father, that everyone who BEHOLDS the Son and believes in Him will have eternal life, and I Myself will raise him up on the last day." Moses lifted up the bronze serpent on a pole and were told to SIMPLY LOOK to it and would be healed. Faith won't save you...its the object of our faith that saves us. I hear faith saves us......nope.... Jesus the object of our faith saves us. Faith is the vehicle!

 

Hi JSM17.

Let me pre-empt where you are probably going by asking you this: is the Bible always to be believed -- everywhere?

If you use one passage is used to negate the teaching of another passage, you will be positing that Scripture is not to be trusted.

 

If you will notice Jesus was doing a play on their words. They, as Jews, had come to believe that through various works one can 'earn' their way into heaven. They asked Jesus what work they could do, and Jesus basically stated the only thing you can 'do'/'work' is to believe. NOT that believing is an actual work but that believing or faith is the only way to enter heaven.

We have scripture that bears witness to this and establishes that faith in fact is not a work. Two of them are Rom 4:4-6 and Eph 2:8-9

 

Faith involves a voluntary act of the will. In this sense it is indeed a work, but not a meritorious work, but rather a condition of salvation. It is always thought of in the sense of 'not without which' NOT 'that for the sake of,' just as all conditions commanded and demanded by God for man to fulfill.

 

Here is what JSM17's script has. I have plenty of history with it.

S/he is going to misuse John 6:28-9 to try to get us to concede that faith is a work in the Ephesians 2:8-10 sense. Then, if successful, s/he will try to get us to toss out the teaching of Ephesians 2:8-10 where it expressly says "not of works" (KJV). S/he will still expect us to trust the Bible. After we have tossed out the teaching of Ephesians 2:8-10, s/he will attempt to convince us that unless specific additional works are completed beyond faith, no one is saved.

First, however, s/he must convince us to reject what Ephesians 2:8-10 teaches, and s/he hopes to use a part of another passage to get it done. It would be a misuse, as that passage also refutes JSM17's intended point.

John 6:28-9

“The people asked Jesus, `What are the works God wants us to do?’ Jesus answered `The work God wants you to do is this: to believe |on him whom he hath sent” (ICB|ASV underline mine)​

The people sought plural “works” and Jesus corrected that. This is a refutation to any idea that there are works beyond faith that must be completed for salvation.

There is no conflict with Ephesians 2:8-10

“for by grace you have been saved through faith. And this is not your own doing; it is the gift of God, not a result of works, so that no one may |boast himselfe. For |in Christ Jesus, God made us new people| unto good works, which God hath before ordained that we should walk in them” (ESV| GenB| ICB| KJV).​

Even if we grant that faith is a work, the passage says "saved through faith" and "not a result of" plural "works" -- a plurality of "works" cannot be the cause of salvation.

The order is clear: we are saved by faith which here is contrasted with works. After salvation, we become "new people" in order to do "good works" which God has "ordained" for us.

It really is this simple. Acts 10:43 says of Jesus Christ "every one that believeth on him |receives| remission of sins” (ASV|ESV|ASV).

 

Quote:
Originally Posted by JSM17
John 6:28-30

28 Then they said to Him, "What shall we do, that we may work the works of God?"

29 Jesus answered and said to them, "This is the work of God, that you believe in Him whom He sent."

30 Therefore they said to Him,"What sign will You perform then, that we may see it and believe You? What work will You do?
NKJV

Is faith a work?

HP: I have to wonder if those ‘spiritually immature’ individuals at least believed the words of Jesus at face value? Would to God some spiritually mature would as well. :thumbs:

 

HP: Excellent questions. It boils down to one of two things. Either it is all of God or man is involved. If it is all of God you have not only clear predestination driven by necessity, but the predestination of the damned as well and that by necessity. God is necessitated as the author of all evil as well as all good if necessity rules.

If man is involved in any way that would offset necessity, man must be the first cause of his moral intents, and the first cause of saving faith. One simply has to decide whether it is deterministic fatalism that drives faith or if in fact mans will must be involved in a voluntary committal of the will in agreement with a measure of faith granted to all men in order for faith to come to saving fruition in our lives.

There is no doubt where I stand. If necessity rules, morality including all notions of it such as love, hate, blameworthiness or praiseworthiness are all chimeras and punishment or rewards are nothing more than the working of an arbitrary God appeasing His own necessitated ends. It would be absurd to level any blame for being created to an end, as wicked as it might seem, if no other end was possible other than the end God necessitated for you. How can a system of complete necessity be anything other than a wicked blight upon the character of a Holy and Just God?

 

Could you all pass a lie detector test about "believing on Jesus?"

 

HP: Lie detector tests are not always accurate. We can believe Scripture though, and we know without a doubt that some believe, and tremble. Jas 2:19 Thou believest that there is one God; thou doest well: the devils also believe, and tremble.