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Conservative (?) American Baptists Bid Godspeed To Sodomy Condoning Churches

Discussion in 'General Baptist Discussions' started by Mark Osgatharp, Oct 12, 2005.

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  1. Mark Osgatharp

    Mark Osgatharp New Member

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    Associated Baptist Press reported on Semptember 13th that the Pacific Southwest Region of the American Baptist Churches, U.S.A. has taken steps to leave the national group due to it's continued acceptance of churches which openly condone the sin of sodomy.

    The article quotes Dale Salico, the Pacific Southwest region's executive minister, as saying they have,

    "determined that the time has come to create distance between the ABCPSW and the ABCUSA so that both may move ahead in the mission God has given them without continued conflict."

    Didn't the apostle John say something about, "he that biddeth him godspeed is partaker of his evil deeds"?

    Mark Osgatharp
     
    #1 Mark Osgatharp, Oct 12, 2005
  2. bapmom

    bapmom New Member

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    Lets just let 'em separate and be glad its over.....for now.
     
    #2 bapmom, Oct 12, 2005
  3. Plain Old Bill

    Plain Old Bill New Member

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    I'm with you Bapmom. Plus I think the language in the separation letter was just a nice way of saying we're out of here and we hope you get right with God.
     
    #3 Plain Old Bill, Oct 12, 2005
  4. StraightAndNarrow

    StraightAndNarrow Active Member

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    Basically what the CBF said to the politically empowered SBC?
     
    #4 StraightAndNarrow, Oct 12, 2005
  5. tinytim

    tinytim <img src =/tim2.jpg>

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    #5 tinytim, Oct 13, 2005
  6. Mark Osgatharp

    Mark Osgatharp New Member

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    Tinytim,

    The reason the Pacific Southwest Region is separating from the ABC is because the national body made an arrangement to allow sodomite condoning churches to remain within the denomination. You can say the ABC does not condone them, but their actions speak louder than their words.

    John said, "he that biddeth him godspeed is partaker of his evil deeds." That means the ABC is a partaker of sodomy because they moved to allow sodomite condoning churches to remain in their fellowship. It also means that the man quoted above is a partaker of the evil deeds of the ABC by bidding them godspeed even as he goes out the back door.

    On top of that, the sodomy issue is just one small matter in a denomination swamped by heresy. The ABC has for years tolerated churches and funded schools that promote every sort of vile anit-christ heresy you can possibly imagine.

    Anyone who cares more about serving God than maintaining tradition would have left that mess years ago.

    A few years ago I came accross the web-site of an ABC church in West Virginia that had one of the best statements of faith I have ever read. I stood amazed that a church which apparently had a good grasp on the teachings of the Bible would remain in a body so far removed from Christ.

    To such I plead with the words of the apostle Paul,

    "Come out from among them and be ye separate, saith the Lord, and touch not the unlcean thing."

    And if you decide to acutally do that, don't bid godspeed to the ungoldy mess you are leaving behind.

    Mark Osgatharp
     
    #6 Mark Osgatharp, Oct 13, 2005
  7. StraightAndNarrow

    StraightAndNarrow Active Member

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    I don't think you know anything about ABCUSA. You're making outlandish statements about a denomination that is 99% true to the faith. Maybe you need to remove the log that is in your own eye before going off on a tangent like this.
     
    #7 StraightAndNarrow, Oct 14, 2005
  8. tinytim

    tinytim <img src =/tim2.jpg>

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    Name them.
    Of course I understand that we are going to disagree because I see that you are identified with Landmark Baptist, which in my view have their own problems.
     
    #8 tinytim, Oct 14, 2005
  9. Mark Osgatharp

    Mark Osgatharp New Member

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    Tinytim,

    Do you know the significance of the word "modernism"? The GARBC and the CBA are not Landmarkers by any stretch of the imagination - and yet even they exited the ABC years ago because of it's tolerance of theological apostacy.

    Mark Osgatharp
     
    #9 Mark Osgatharp, Oct 14, 2005
  10. StraightAndNarrow

    StraightAndNarrow Active Member

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    And years before that, the SBC separated from the Northern Baptists because their northern counterparts wouldn't accept the morally reprehensible act of enslaving fellow human beings. In fact the SBC didn't retract that position until the 1990's.
     
    #10 StraightAndNarrow, Oct 14, 2005
  11. StraightAndNarrow

    StraightAndNarrow Active Member

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    Then the extremists in the SBC began making Seminary professors and missionaries sign their creed or they would lose their positions. For reasons of political power they engaged in questionable activities like busing in bogus delegates to ensure that their candidates would gain the power in the SBC. The moderates were driven out of the convention for doing things like supporting the traditionally Baptist doctrines of Priesthood of the Believer and Soul Freedom. They even were allowing woman to use their spiritual gifts to serve the Lord!
     
    #11 StraightAndNarrow, Oct 14, 2005
  12. tinytim

    tinytim <img src =/tim2.jpg>

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    Modernism means different things to different people. So please define your label.
     
    #12 tinytim, Oct 14, 2005
  13. Bartimaeus

    Bartimaeus New Member

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    bapmom
    I attended your church back in 1984. Never forgot and thank the Lord for the church.
    Thanks ------Bart

    Modernism: The church accepts and uses concepts, and it's principles reflect and adhere to the principles of the previous generation.
    Is this close to what some believe it is?

    Thanks -----Bart
     
    #13 Bartimaeus, Oct 14, 2005
  14. John of Japan

    John of Japan Well-Known Member
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    "The extreme form of religious liberalism is sometimes called modernism." Robert Lightner, Neo-Evangelicalism (p. 25). Lightner was Assistant Professor of Sys. Theo. at Dallas Theo. Sem. at the time. [​IMG]
     
    #14 John of Japan, Oct 17, 2005
  15. tinytim

    tinytim <img src =/tim2.jpg>

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    As you may know, if you have been following any of the news of the ABC/USA lately. WVBC (WEst Virginia Baptist Convention) is having it's Annual meeting this week. One of the topics we'll be dealing with is the question, "should the WVBC remain with ABC/USA."

    No matter which side of the coin you are on, I am asking for prayers in this matter. Please pray that God will lead us and clearly show us His will. Please pray that man will not get in the way, and what is done will only bring glory to God.

    I appreciate your prayers.
     
    #15 tinytim, Oct 17, 2005
  16. tinytim

    tinytim <img src =/tim2.jpg>

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    I understand that, but around here, and in fundamentalist camps, you are a modernist if you use any version other than KJV, if your wife wears pants, and women are given any rights in church.
     
    #16 tinytim, Oct 17, 2005
  17. jshurley04

    jshurley04 New Member

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    tinytim, I appreciate your level headedness. I agree that we need to know all of an issue and not make wild allegations. Some who have posted on this thread seem to thrive on that type of sensationalism.

    A few years ago, the President of the Baptist Bible Fellowship preached a message at a fellowship meeting in which he reminded us who the fight was with. We had people and churches calling others "liberal" based on what you have just said, wrong Bible, pants, music that sounds too contemporary, use of power point, and so on. Really stupid things to argue over.

    He reminded us that a "liberal" is one that denies the Deity of Christ, the Virgin Birth, the literal resurrection, Salvation by Grace, and so on. This are the things that determine fellowship and liberal or not.
     
    #17 jshurley04, Oct 18, 2005
  18. Mark Osgatharp

    Mark Osgatharp New Member

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    You are a modernist if you deny the historical accuracy, inspiration and authority of the Bible. The ABC has tolerated churches which do this for years. That is why the GARBC and the CBA churches left decades ago.

    Frankly, I don't understand why it took the sodomy issue to provoke the split. That issue is just one bad fruit of the real issue which is the rejection of the Bible's authority.

    Mark Osgatharp
     
    #18 Mark Osgatharp, Oct 18, 2005
  19. tinytim

    tinytim <img src =/tim2.jpg>

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    "You are a modernist if you deny the historical accuracy, inspiration and authority of the Bible."

    By your definition I am not a modernist and all WVBC churches and many other churches (especially the ones that signed the Parchment Valley Agreement last month- 40% of the ABC/USA, along with others) are not modernist.

    check this out http://www.wvbc.org/pages.asp?pageid=27733
    So before you pin a label on 1000's of churches do your research.
     
    #19 tinytim, Oct 19, 2005
  20. tinytim

    tinytim <img src =/tim2.jpg>

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    This is the first time that I ever heard that the use of power point could be considered liberal. I know some very conservative churches, IFBs for that matter that use it in bible study. Mark, how do you feel about power point?
     
    #20 tinytim, Oct 19, 2005
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