Featured A carryover thread from 'The Children whom God hath given me .'

This is a post I really don't have to answer. It is only opinion which you give, and all can see that. Your condemnation and condescension is well noted.
And BTW, you are not infallible. There are a good many people on this board that consider you to hold Biblical error. So state your opinion and leave it at that. Leave the ungodly comments and the attack mode out of your posts.

 

I have not seen anyone other than you or Van object to anything Rippon posted...:wavey::wavey:

 

This link showed nothing. It did not give an example or two ;like I asked you to produce.....so until you post evidence the charge of a lying false witness stands.....here was your foul claim;

Show by direct quote where I deny this at all...much less quite often:laugh::laugh::laugh:

 

It is nothing to laugh at Icon. You are in error. You disregard the doctrine of sola fide many times. I tell you this and rarely do you acknowledge it, but simply give a passive acknowledgment by your silence. So I accept that you know that you are in the wrong by your silence when I tell you that you "throw sola fide out the window."

Check out the conversation here:
http://www.baptistboard.com/showpost.php?p=2238875&postcount=6

http://www.baptistboard.com/showpost.php?p=2238880&postcount=7

http://www.baptistboard.com/showpost.php?p=2238911&postcount=9


Let's go through this again.
First, Icon says that a man since the Fall is dead, depraved, has no ability on his own to turn to Christ; it is impossible for him to put his faith in Christ for the only decision he can make is the wrong decision. He is unable to choose good for he is depraved. This is correct? Right?

Yet Spurgeon says:
They cannot endure heresy, and yet sad is the fact, that believing what they do, and knowing so much, they have not believed the Son of God. They believe the doctrine of election, but they have not the faith of God's elect: they swear by final perseverance, but persevere in unbelief. They confess all the five points of Calvinism, but they have not come to the one most needful point of looking unto Jesus, that they may be saved. They accept in creed the truths that are assuredly believed among us, but they have not received that faithful saying, worthy of all acceptation, that Christ Jesus came into the world to save sinners; at any rate, they have not received it personally and practically for their souls' salvation.
--And that is quite the opposite of your belief.
As I posted in that post:

"Notice he loved souls enough to even warn those in the church who hold correct doctrine to make sure Christ was the true object of faith...even if they professed to hold the 5 pts."

And then:

As I pointed out to you then:
The unsaved can hear, understand and believe the gospel, as Spurgeon constantly urges them to do.
--He is not so totally depraved that he cannot believe, cannot understand, cannot chose right, etc. Spurgeon appeals to the intellect of the unconverted.

Notice, in post #7, when I point out to you:
"The unsaved can hear, understand and believe the gospel, as Spurgeon constantly urges them to do."
Your reply is:
yes.....and everyone of those given will be enabled to do just that good link...DHK
--So, you are simply reading into what Spurgeon preached. He said nothing of the sort. He said for them to read, to understand. He didn't say that anyone (including God or the Holy Spirit) would cause them to understand. In fact he rebuked them saying there was no excuse for we were not in the middle of Africa where Bibles are scarce. There was no excuse.

 

DHK says : "Every man has faith."

There is a clear antithesis here between the Word of God and the word of a man.

 

DHK

Nonsense....we believe the 5 solas of the reformation unlike you.:thumbsup:

You have a wrong view of faith so you do not understand any of the cals who have a biblical understanding....Your understanding is natural and fleshly...not of the Spirit as I will show shortly when I get to that post.

Icon is at the keyboard now to answer your lie directly.:laugh:

I have posted 10000 times...show one where I say that faith is not a part of salvation. You cannot because you are lying...there is no other way to say it.

You say I say it....I am right here saying I never posted anything like that and I would know because I know what I believe....you do not.

No one is interested in your made up fantasy strawmen unless they find entertainment value in your unsanctified imagination.:thumbsup:

God is the author and finisher of our faith.....I have posted that several times!
Let me explain it to you...that means he who begun a good work in us will perform it until the day of Christ.

At regeneration God grants repentance and faith....a saving belief as He enables us to believe by the Spirit doing that supernatural heart transplant for every real Christian.....EZK 36:25-27 is for Christians, the new Covenant is for Christians, but facts which you deny.

You print out one hearsay article by a deluded anti cal fanatic and you look to disparage God's servant. This is disgraceful.

You give lip service to a watered down form of these truths. You do not delight in these truths...in fact you despise them.

No praise, only responsibility. If the gift of salvation is offered to man, it is his responsibility to accept it and not reject it, as the Jews did (John 1:11).

What are you even talking about here???? Who is the "he"?

I believe I responded to this already;

13 But he answered and said, Every plant, which my heavenly Father hath not planted, shall be rooted up.
14 Let them alone: they be blind leaders of the blind. And if the blind lead the blind, both shall fall into the ditch.

It is not the same...this shows your defective ideas.

This is the false theology of carnal thought. This is close to a great blasphemy.
Salvation is of God. He is not just a spectator learning who will get saved.
He determines who gets saved.

He already knows the end from the beginning.

Wrong...no one by themselves believes.

Wrong God has already determined who will be predestined.

This is backwards and fleshly.

Guess what...if they are not saved they are already lost:thumbsup:

You do not understand bible 101.....


I will answer more later on...just spent 6 hours speaking with a Turkish muslim...he just left with a bible in hand......meanwhile I see you do not understand the Spurgeon quote I gave you as you attempted to misuse it again...lol...live people face to face take priority over the bb....I will get some sleep and answer more later.

 

I commend you. I would do and have done the same thing (to other Muslims).
The way I see it, the Muslim has a chance to read and to be saved.
The way that I understand the Calvinist to see it is:

Relying on your interpretation of 1Cor.2:14, since he is a natural man that cannot understand spiritual things there is no possible way that he can understand any part of that Bible, and therefore he cannot be saved. We have an entire thread devoted to that topic. It seemed that every Calvinist that posted was in agreement that the unsaved could not understand the Scriptures because he was spiritually blind.
I don't believe that is the meaning of that verse.
I have seen others come to Christ by reading a Bible, a tract, etc. without the intervention of another person's explanation.

 

Of course he cannot understand the things of God in his natural state.
He needs the Spirit to grant him repentance and faith and a new heart.

That is between him and God. I presented the saving work of Jesus as the God man who took upon himself the former of a servant as per phil2/heb2.....

After a few hours of establishing the bible as the word of God...and all men having died in Adam....I was then able to present the Lord Jesus as having died for sinners, and how The Father had given a multitude of sinners to Jesus who He is seeking and saving.

I explained that everyone given to the Son would be saved ....none will be lost.

 

That's great.
I don't want to be confrontational here. I just want to understand from a Calvinist viewpoint.
You have presented the gospel to him.

But as you just said in this post:
"Of course he cannot understand the things of God in his natural state."

So what good will the Bible do if he can't understand it "in his natural state"?

It is my opinion that he can understand it, and that "faith comes by hearing (reading), and hearing by the Word of God.
Whether the means is hearing or reading he is still receiving the Word, and that is the vehicle of faith, the faith that he needs to trust Christ--the message that you gave him.

 

Any person understands the words spoken...but in a natural condition they all with one consent begin to make excuses why they do not need to believe the message.

When we present truth to the dry bones we are speaking with....we are to proclaim truth,trusting the Spirit to quicken the Scriptures to the previously dead sinner and allow the truth to be welcomed by that sinner.When the Spirit draws him effectually he welcomes the word that he used to reject. Saving repentance and faith is given at regeneration as that sinner goes from death to life by the supernatural work of God.

Once God saves the sinner...he believes, he exercises that God given faith he owns it as his own

 

Right. But they do understand, and therefore have no excuse not to believe.
There were ten lepers. All were healed. Only one came back and was thankful. He was the one that believed.

According to Rom.10:17 it is the Word that brings faith, and faith that brings salvation (Acts 16:31).
According to basic theology regeneration and salvation take place at the same time (simultaneously).
1Pet.1:23 teaches that one is born again by the Word of God. Thus the Word is essential in the New Birth process. (In that same passage Peter defines the "Word of God" as "the Gospel which saves."
Thus the gospel and faith must precede regeneration and salvation.
The Holy Spirit is able to convict a person of their sin at any time, but usually works through the Word of God. That is his primary ministry (convicting of sin).

The "dead" sinner is "dead" by virtue of being separated from God. Death is separation. He still has the ability to understand. The Word will give him the faith to believe. That is what he needs. The Holy Spirit working through the Word, convicting of sin will bring this sinner to faith in Christ wherein he will be "reconciled" back to God--no longer separated, but now in a living union with Christ.

 

With the ten lepers......Jesus asked .....Where are the nine ? All men are responsible to believe ,worship God, and live sinless. They cannot.

Your seriously say that men CAN.Your own testimony and in a post on this thread say men can do it all. You leave out the supernatural work of God which is the biblical model.
Now that I point this out......you will attempt to give lip service to God's activity....but if you read through these last two threads and your own testimony what you describe is a natural process...describing natural man....who you say CAN understand SPIRITUAL THINGS CORRECTLY WITHOUT BEING IN DWELT BY THE SPIRIT OF GOD.

You never ascribe saving faith to the Spirit of God......you speak of a sinner using human trust or a tentative carnal "faith" which is not the same as the gift of salvation given by God....as scripture describes God GRANTING the gentiles repentance, and Lydia, whose heart the Lord opened........you ignore the biblical language saying no man can come.unless God....and you ignore the positive language of what God does.

The problem as you describe it is you ignore the biblical language used for corpse...nekrous...
In your view man has not died in Adam.....he was slightly wounded and still has full ability.
Because man is a spiritual corpse....he lives and is bound by sin.....consequently he is separated from God.
It is both his natural condition, and his sinful activity that is spoken of. It is not "just" separation.
So to you...man just needs a little information ....he can be smart enough,and perceive spiritual things WITHOUT the HOLY SPIRIT. We believe the SPIRIT is essential to perceive spiritual things.

This fact is beyond dispute as Jesus instructed the Apostles. That they could not understand correctly what they were being instructed until the Comforter would open their understanding.
A careful reading of John 14,15,16.....teaches this again with no dispute possible among Christians.
To ignore truth, to turn front biblical light is to turn to darkness.

 

DHK says;

People don't get saved because God decreed it to be so. Salvation is in Christ alone through faith by grace. The simple fact that God knows about it (his omniscience) doesn't change man's decision. Man is not forced into salvation by God's decrees. That is not the way God works.



YOUR SUGGESTION THAT WHAT GOD HAS DECREED will not come to pass ...but rather that man controls the future is not biblical.once again you mention God as a spectator who can see what man might do.

 

The poster SG.....answered you quite solidly on this point in post 20.

In fact he is pitching a shutout answering solidly post after post.you should learn front his solid posting.

 

[DHK now says;


In order for salvation to be effective it must be efficacious. The gift must be actively received. As it must be received it can also be refused. The simple ability that God has (His omniscience) in knowing which way man will choose, in no way determines the outcome of who the elect are. His "foreknowledge" (knowing ahead of time) or omniscience has nothing to do with it. Being "of the elect" is based on "faith in Christ" or one's decision to trust Him.[/QUOTE]

DESCRIBING ANY ATTRIBUTE OF GOD THIS WAY....the simple ability that God has.....is unbiblical. ...this is very disturbing.You have fallen man on the throne.

You have a wrong view of biblical foreknowledge. ....and do not understand biblical election at all.
You cannot embrace truth with these unbiblical understandings.

 

God has revealed all we need to know of His decree.All the Father gives to the Son will b e saved . To pervert revealed truth and openly deny what is taught is sin.