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A penny for your thoughts

Discussion in '2000-02 Archive' started by JIMNSC, Nov 8, 2002.

  1. JIMNSC

    JIMNSC New Member

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    on what this verse means to you....

    1 Corinthians 15:20  ¶But now is Christ risen from the dead, and become the firstfruits of them that slept.

    Thanks - Jim
     
  2. LadyEagle

    LadyEagle <b>Moderator</b> <img src =/israel.gif>

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    OT Saints. ;)
     
  3. Daniel Dunivan

    Daniel Dunivan New Member

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    This verse is in the context of Paul's teaching about the necessity of the resurrection. His point is that it is through Christ's resurrection that we have hope in our resurrection. He is first as a showing of what will come. If Christ hadn't been raised then we would have no hope in our resurrection. In a nuanced way, German theologian Wolfhart Pannenberg spoke about Jesus' resurrection as a proleptic (a real preview of sorts) representation of what will be seen at the end of history--this is similar to what Paul is saying. Good topic! [​IMG]
     
  4. wjrighter

    wjrighter New Member

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    to jimnsc,i think when i read in context -above & below verses it's pretty self explanitory; vs.19 for example? are we most pitiable? thank God for vs.23 good reading huh?
    bill
     
  5. donnA

    donnA New Member

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    Becasue Jesus was resurected we know that we will be too, because He was the first.
     
  6. tyndale1946

    tyndale1946 Well-Known Member

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    That is an interesting answer... When Christ comes again for his children will he bring the OT saints with him... Since they were the first fruits?... Or is this talking about wheat and tares his children being the prime harvest of Jesus Christ the first fruit?... Brother Glen [​IMG]
     
  7. blackbird

    blackbird Administrator
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    In the days of old Israel--the farmers there would plant their wheat fields--different types of wheat grain they would plant--after they were planted--each individual farmer would watch his field as it began to grow and mature.

    The blade of wheat would rise up out of the dirt and begin its maturity. The stalk would begin to rise and take maturity--in the later stage of maturity--the stalk would begin to form its individual "head" or shock of grain.

    Keep in mind that the farmer is watching his field like a hawk on a power line watches for his dinner down below!! Anyhow, the farmer is watching the whole field--watching, watching, watching--particularly, he watches the Barley he has planted because he knows that the barley is the first to bear a mature "head" of grain!! Now, he's watchin'--he's got his eyes out over the barley waiting to spot the very first mature head---think like an Israelite farmer here--he looks over the barley---spots the very first head that comes to maturity---he reaches out through the field and plucks up the stalk of very first mature head---makes his way on over to the tabernacle/temple---presents it to the priest there with a chant--"Firstfruits! Firstfruits! Firstfruits!"---the "Firstfruit" guarantees that the rest of the field is not far behind!! What was always done in reality was also done in anticipation of some spiritual truth for those Israelites!! Here is the spiritual truth!!

    Simply put--the resurrection of the Lord Jesus Christ--guarantees mine is to come!!!

    Your friend,
    Blackbird
     
  8. LadyEagle

    LadyEagle <b>Moderator</b> <img src =/israel.gif>

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    Good post, Blackbird! [​IMG]

    Like many passages in Scripture I Cor. 15 has layers of meanings.

    1 Corinthians 15:20 ¶But now is Christ risen from the dead, and become the firstfruits of them that slept.

    My simple reply "OT saints" shall now be expanded. [​IMG]

    Jesus Christ came & fulfilled OT law. The OT saints were saved by looking TOWARDS the cross (future fulfillment of the Promise) while those of us after the cross look BACK on the Cross as the Promise Fulfilled, Completed Work of Redemption:

    OT SAINTS-------CROSS-------NT saints (us)

    Thus, those OT saints were asleep when Jesus Christ was Resurrected.

    Paul used the word firstfruits to describe the resurrection of Jesus Christ.

    Jesus has been raised from the dead as a "firstfruit" of the great resurrection of all saints, but now resurrection of OT saints is assured with the Promise fulfilled. [​IMG]

    Here's an explanation of firstfruits with regards to the OT feast I found on the Internet:

    So, as one can see, Jesus Christ fulfilled the Feast of Firstfruits for the OT saints....(and NT saints, as well.) [​IMG]

    But at the moment in time Paul was writing, most of those who were asleep were OT saints. [​IMG]

    It is all very fascinating to me, but I think you got more than a penny's worth for my thoughts; it's more like 2 cents! [​IMG] :eek:

    [ November 09, 2002, 08:20 AM: Message edited by: SheEagle911 ]
     
  9. blackbird

    blackbird Administrator
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    SheEagle911!!!

    AAAAAAAAAAAMMMMMMMMMEEEEEEEENNNNNNNNNNNN!!! And that's from this here "Front Row" Southern Baptist preacher man!!!

    Both of our thoughts together--along with the others who post--by golly--we can open up a joint bank account---and let the pennies roll in!!!

    Hey, SheEagle???!!

    Blackbird wants to know--a five dollar bill for thoughts on the Feast of Tabernacles!! I'll start another post--right now!!

    Your friend,
    Blackbird
     
  10. JIMNSC

    JIMNSC New Member

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    SheEagle911 - I had a hunch what you were thinking with your first post about the OT Saints. ;)

    Jim
     
  11. Daniel Dunivan

    Daniel Dunivan New Member

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    SheEagle,

    Your imposition of the Old Testament saints is interesting but not in context of 1 Corinthians. Paul is using the OT metaphor for general resurrection. Why would he refer to OT saint in this way while speaking to a thuroughly Greek church (as the first 14 chapters of the book testify)?

    Grace and Peace,

    Danny [​IMG]
     
  12. tyndale1946

    tyndale1946 Well-Known Member

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    When you brought up the subject a penny for your thoughts... I thought of those that labored in the Lords vineyard all received the same amount no matter what hour they started in... A penny!

    Will not ALL of us receive the same Christ being the firstfruits?... Brother Glen [​IMG]
     
  13. JIMNSC

    JIMNSC New Member

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    Same Christ Brother Glen -- whether you accepted Him as your Savior at 15 years of age or 80! [​IMG]

    Speaking of laboring in the vineyard, this is a little off the subject (forgive me) but when I first started really studying scripture instead of just reading it, I did not like parables. I couldn't understand why Jesus would do that to His listeners, and you know His disciples would pull Him off to the side and ask Him to explain them. Later I heard an evangelist say, "A parable is a story within which you need to search for yourself."

    That gave me a new appreciation for parables. [​IMG]
     
  14. LadyEagle

    LadyEagle <b>Moderator</b> <img src =/israel.gif>

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    JIMNSC, ;) :D

    Go for it Blackbird! [​IMG] It might behoove all of us to study the Feasts of the OT in depth. There's so much to LEARN! And could they possibly contain some End Time Prophecy? ;)

    Hi, Danny. You asked,"Why would he refer to OT saint in this way while speaking to a thuroughly Greek church (as the first 14 chapters of the book testify)?"

    The Church at Corinth, Greece was comprised of Jews & Gentiles (Greeks). Jews would have been very familiar with OT laws and feasts, including Firstfruits. [​IMG]

    Your comment did make me wonder about something else, though, whether or not a similar first fruits concept was part of the pagan worship which was part of that Corinthian culture. Will have to check that out. [​IMG]

    You are correct in that Paul was confirming the Resurrection. But the less obvious answer is found in Paul's use of "firstfruits" as I pointed out above. [​IMG]
     
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