A.W. Tozer on the JSOC and Outer Darkness

Ah! So you guys are saved by "the gospel of the kingdom." Now you're starting to make sense. You WILL either be ruling with Christ in the MK or sent to sheol, the pit at the 2nd coming --- if you make it through the tribulation.

So are you guys Jewish? Or Messianic Jews? I wish I could tell you you got the wrong gospel there but about the time you would believe me, the rapture would come and you would have been right in your old belief anyway! Fact, you might just get on God's side in the middle of the rapture and get "whacked" by AC for being a true Christian (He's not gonna "whack" the Jews for a while because it takes till the end of the trib for them to accept Christ.). :tear:

Do ya think Brian will be back or did he get disenchanted right away dealing with Christians?

skypair

 

You are confusing judges. There is a judge that sits over a criminal case...and there is a judge that sits over a sporting event. Paul uses this typology in his works (I've finished the race, etc.). A judge sitting over a sporting event only hands out prizes, and disqualifies contestants...he doesn't hand out death sentences. This is where you ME'ers are confusing the issue.

 

Let's see...a judge in a baseball game is called an umpire. He calls balls & strikes. He calls safe & out.

A judge in a basketball game is a referee. He calls "fouls" that lead to negative rewards.

A referee in a football game throws flags that result in loss of yardage.

A referee in a hockey game sends people to the "sin bin" for breaking the rules.

Not receiving the double portion of the millenial reign is not a death sentence, it's the loss of a positive reward replaced with a negative reward. You might consider the unprofitable servant being cast into outer darkness a game misconduct or a double technical foul or an ejection from the game. You might even consider it a suspension. However, these individuals will still get to play again in eternity...thanks not to a prize but to a gift that includes eternal life.

 

Which one of the gospels of God do you want to deal with?
The gospel of grace?
The gospel of the Kingdom?
Paul's gospel?
The "my" gospel?

 

Your rage is not needed. You can give your opinion without casting gossip.
You quoted HoG remarking about wanting more info from Brother Faust and then you go on a rampage accusing all of us of being post trib??? Either you pulled the wrong quote or you are grasping for straws. If you choose to prove us wrong, do it with scipture. Also accusing Brian of not being a Christain is beyond bitter speach.

Proverbs 15:1 A soft answer turneth away wrath: but grievous words stir up anger.

Please reconsider your tone with your next posting. Let's stick with fact and leave the name calling for the children.

 

Wow! I will be watching for the reply on this one. Just when I was going to respond, I read this post. RIGHT ON TARGET!:thumbs:

 

So can Christians be disqualified from the race? And if so what happens to those deemed disqualified?

 

I never implied that he didn't know the gospel of God. My point is that you ME guys are adding to it.

Believe on the Lord Jesus Christ and you will be saved. That's the gospel. Nothing to do with works.

We are reward for our good works at the JSOC. We are not punished. If you don't run the race you will not receive a prize. An example of not running the race would be a person who accepted Christ on their deathbed. They receive eternal life, but with no rewards. They have been disqualified from the race, but not from eternal life. They are not punished for their sins because Christ has already paid the penalty. This is a serious matter to me, because I want to enjoy all that God has to offer in eternity. That means that I have to work for rewards in this life. But I do not have to work to avoid punishment.

 

To Rufus,
You cannot use modern day sporting events to prove your point about the Bema seat. It was peculiar to the day of Paul and it was where rewards were given. It had nothing to do with time outs or fouls.

 

Yes this is the gospel of grace through faith apart from works. But that's not the only gospel there is in Scripture.

So the servent that was cast into outer darkness . . . what would you call that? How about the servants that were beaten, some with a few stripes and some with many stripes . . . what would you call that?

How about the Scripture where it says God will not be mocked you will reap what you sow. And if you sow to the flesh you will reap corruption? What would you call that?

And that means you will be disqualified. What happens to those that are disqualified?

Come on Amy that's not an example of not running the race. That person never even had a chance of running the race. Not running the race has to do with those that even have a chance at running it.

How can you be disqualified from something you have never entered?

 

"For we must all appear before the judgment seat of Christ; that every one may receive the things done in his body, according to that he hath done, whether it be good or bad." - 2 Corinthians 5:10​

"Know ye not that they which run in a race run all, but one receiveth the prize? So run, that ye may obtain." - 1 Corinthians 9:24​

Was the thief on the cross an example of a deathbed confession?

"He that spareth his rod hateth his son: but he that loveth him chasteneth him betimes." - Proverbs 13:24​

 

You can't find one other judgment seat in the bible that meets that description, so why would you think that describes Chrst's judgment seat? Instead of letting the bible tell you what a judgment seat is, you have gone to some commentary that told you it was where the kids lined up for prizes after the sack race.

 

I was just playing along with Webdog's analogy....it seemed to fit.

 

Amen, Amy. "Therefore, there is now no condemnation for those who are in Christ Jesus" We live in the Spirit because God is transforming us into the image of his Son, not because we fear condemnation for doing otherwise. We do not work, but God works in us, and He who began a good work in us will see it to completion.

 

Amy, I can honestly say that you have us confused with someone else. Not a single one of us on this thread has said anything different

In fact, we've done the opposite and shown the fallacy of requiring works for being saved as presented by those who hold to the Lordship Salvation doctrine.

Believe on the Lord Jesus and you will be saved. Plus nothing!

 

Then, how about the ancient Olympics in which competitors were fined for cheating, or for even not training? Married women who attended were put to death, but maidens were permitted to watch. (Although girls did have their own events.)

Those who cheated were fined, and the money was used to set up statues (glorify) Zeus.

There were dire consequences for cheating, bribing, not training, breaking the rules, etc.

There was great honor for winning.

But, all who entered and ran successfully were honored.

Interestingly, the judges used mercy as well. If an athlete were not able to follow the rules, such as arriving on time, and he could present a good reason that was beyond his control (a storm blew up and his ship landed 100 miles away with witnesses), he was excused for his behavior and not disqualified.

 

Given the context, it means he shall not get any rewards because none of his works will survive the fire (loss), but he will only be saved. Note carefully the way this passage starts. There is no other foundation than Jesus Christ. God reveals our works through fire, which burns whatever we build on that foundation. The foundation still stands, however, even if all of what we built upon it is destroyed. In other words, there's no room for sending the person to the lake of fire for 1,000 years, because our foundation still stands.