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Abortion

Discussion in '2000-02 Archive' started by John Wells, Sep 2, 2001.

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  1. John Wells

    John Wells New Member

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    God Vs. Abortion

    "For you created my inmost being; you knit me together in my mother's womb. I praise you because I am fearfully and wonderfully made; your works are wonderful, I know that full well. My frame was not hidden from you when I was made in the secret place (womb). When I was woven together in the depths of the earth (womb), your eyes saw my unformed body. All the days ordained for me were written in your book before one of them came to be." Psalms 139:13-16

    Babies are being murdered at the rate of 1.6 million per year in the United States. The above passage of scripture clearly indicates that God takes pleasure in the life of an unborn child, and that it is a child to God.

    "Before I formed you in the womb I knew you, before you were born I set you apart; I appointed you as a prophet to the nations." Jeremiah 1:5. God, just as with Jeremiah, also has a plan for each unborn child.

    Since the Roe vs. Wade decision that legalized abortion, the number of babies murdered is equal to the population of all the states west of the Mississippi excluding California. I wonder if God might have had a plan for one of those babies to come up with a cure for cancer, or become the best president this country ever had, or to be the world's next great evangelist. Public sympathy pours out to a dead baby in the arms of a fireman, one of many victims of a terrorist attack in Oklahoma City. When will society wake up to the terror that goes on in abortion clinics every single day across the country? What can we, as Christians do to stop this slaughter?

    1. Do not say "I don't have an opinion on abortion." If you are a true Christian, believing the Bible to be the infallible Word of God, you must take a stand for the sanctity of human life. You must have an opinion.
    2. Write your senator and congressman. Let them know where you stand on abortion. Let them know you will be watching how they vote. Urge them to introduce legislation to ban abortion altogether. Let them know you will not vote for them next election otherwise.
    3. Inquire of your local physician's practice and views on abortion. Find one that does not practice or condone it.
    4. Get involved with peaceful demonstrations and marches supporting Pro Life.
    5. Share your views with anyone willing to listen (not at work!).
    6. Do not do business with anyone advocating a mother's right to choose, and let them know why you are taking your business elsewhere (economic votes speak louder than you think).

    The ironic thing about "Pro Choice" is the one with the most to lose (the baby) doesn't get a choice!

    Persons have worth even before they are born. God knew you, as he knew Jeremiah, long before you were born or even conceived. He knew you, thought about you, and planned for you. When you feel discouraged or inadequate, remember that God has always thought of you as valuable and has had a purpose in mind for you.

    God is at work in a person's life even while in the womb. God's character goes into the creation of every person. God thinks of you constantly (Psalm 139:1-4). We should have as much respect for ourselves as our Maker has for us.

    Ahaz was twenty years old when he became king, and he reigned in Jerusalem sixteen years. Unlike David his father, he did not do what was right in the eyes of the LORD . . . He burned sacrifices in the Valley of Ben Hinnom and sacrificed his sons in the fire, following the detestable ways of the nations the LORD had driven out before the Israelites. (2 Chr 28:1,3 NIV)

    Abortion is a sin against God. Imagine the monstrous evil of a religion that offers young children as sacrifices. God allowed Judah to suffer heavy casualties in response to Ahaz's evil practices. Even today the practice hasn't abated. The sacrifice of children to the harsh gods of convenience, economy, and whim continues in sterile medical facilities in numbers that would astound even the wicked Ahaz. If we are to allow children to come to Christ (Matthew 19:14), we must first allow them to come into the world! :( :( :(
     
    #1 John Wells, Sep 2, 2001
  2. Joseph_Botwinick

    Joseph_Botwinick <img src=/532.jpg>Banned

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    #2 Joseph_Botwinick, Sep 2, 2001
  3. Don

    Don Well-Known Member
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    Y'all are preaching to the choir.

    If there's anyone on this board who believes abortion is "okay," well, I've yet to come across them.
     
    #3 Don, Sep 2, 2001
  4. Brother Adam

    Brother Adam New Member

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    I have to agree with Don, though I doubt calling people "baby killers" will change their heart. More likely to get someone who will put there armor on and argue you to the death than open thier eyes to the truth.

    Until Next Post, Adam
     
    #4 Brother Adam, Sep 2, 2001
  5. John Wells

    John Wells New Member

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    CJoshuaV (Joshua) belongs to Progressive Clergy of Georgia (PCG). One of his posts will even link you to this website. Quoted from their statement of purpose:

    "PCG supports education in public schools, the use of public funds to provide access to contraception, and the protection of a woman’s right to a safe and legal abortion."

    Wake up folks! We have pastors of many denominations that support a woman's right to choose. To say there is no problem is to become part of the problem.
     
    #5 John Wells, Sep 2, 2001
  6. SaggyWoman

    SaggyWoman Active Member

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    Sadly to say, there are some pastors and many more deacons who support some form of abortion ... some deacons who have actually taken their children out to get abortions....
     
    #6 SaggyWoman, Sep 2, 2001
  7. Pennsylvania Jim

    Pennsylvania Jim New Member

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    <BLOCKQUOTE>quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by Don:
    Y'all are preaching to the choir.

    If there's anyone on this board who believes abortion is "okay," well, I've yet to come across them.    <HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

    Perhaps he's not preaching to the choir. Notice that he has called for specific resolute action, not just an opinion or position. Seems to me that on this particular issue the catholics put us baptists to shame.
     
    #7 Pennsylvania Jim, Sep 2, 2001
  8. Pennsylvania Jim

    Pennsylvania Jim New Member

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    <BLOCKQUOTE>quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by SaggyWoman:
    Sadly to say, there are some pastors and many more deacons who support some form of abortion ... some deacons who have actually taken their children out to get abortions....<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

    Just goes to show that anyone can call themself a pastor or a deacon.
     
    #8 Pennsylvania Jim, Sep 2, 2001
  9. myreflection26

    myreflection26 New Member

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    Just because one supports the woman's choice does not mean they are not a christian. I for one am so far from pro-choice that I feel there is no reason for abortion but to look at someone else and say your not christian if you take an opposite stand, no I refuse to do that.

    I am an active volunteer to our local christian pregnancy center and I counsel young girls who are scared and pregnant.

    Sue
     
    #9 myreflection26, Sep 2, 2001
  10. SaggyWoman

    SaggyWoman Active Member

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    Good for you, MyReflection ...

    Funny thing is. . .we all have a choice. We have a choice to get ourselves in the situations we do .. we have a choice to stop. We have a choice in all we do . ..We also have a choice in how to deal with the consequences of our actions... .
     
    #10 SaggyWoman, Sep 3, 2001
  11. myreflection26

    myreflection26 New Member

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    Right, we all do have a choice and the best thing to do is present to the young scared teen that the choice she is about to make is one of seriousness. We offer the facts of human life at conception and what abortion really does to her and her child then we pray for God to help her make the right choice out of a list of bad ones already made

    Sue
     
    #11 myreflection26, Sep 3, 2001
  12. Joseph_Botwinick

    Joseph_Botwinick <img src=/532.jpg>Banned

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    <BLOCKQUOTE>quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by flyfree432:
    I have to agree with Don, though I doubt calling people "baby killers" will change their heart. More likely to get someone who will put there armor on and argue you to the death than open thier eyes to the truth.

    Until Next Post, Adam    <HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

    Sometimes the truth is offensive to others because the Holy Spirit is convicting of sin. If you support abortion for any reason, IMO, you are a Baby Killer.

    Joseph
     
    #12 Joseph_Botwinick, Sep 3, 2001
  13. Karen

    Karen Active Member

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    <BLOCKQUOTE>quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by Joseph Botwinick:


    Sometimes the truth is offensive to others because the Holy Spirit is convicting of sin. If you support abortion for any reason, IMO, you are a Baby Killer.

    Joseph    <HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

    Joseph,
    I think that my comments in the Politics forum under Purists and Pragmatists are applicable here.
    One of the reasons we have not made abortion illegal in this country is that pro-life people have not been willing to take incremental steps.
    ...
    There are some very rare times that an expectant mother's life is in imminent physical danger. And not all dangers can be predicted before someone becomes pregnant. On a practical basis, two lives are in danger, and the doctor is attempting to save as many people as possible. There can be very hard decisions to make. I do not blame a husband for wanting his wife to live.
    God doesn't always seem to intervene directly in these situations while we wait passively without making any decisions.

    On the other hand, this kind of hard situation is rare. Most abortions in this country are ultimately elective and a great tragedy.

    Karen

    [ September 03, 2001: Message edited by: Karen ]
     
    #13 Karen, Sep 3, 2001
  14. Joseph_Botwinick

    Joseph_Botwinick <img src=/532.jpg>Banned

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    The reason abortion is still legal to a large extent is because most people are more concerned about their wallets than they are morality....remember "It's the economy stu-pid"...that was the warcry of the Dems against Quayle and it has just gone on that way.

    [ September 03, 2001: Message edited by: Joseph Botwinick ]
     
    #14 Joseph_Botwinick, Sep 3, 2001
  15. Pennsylvania Jim

    Pennsylvania Jim New Member

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    <BLOCKQUOTE>quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by myreflection26:
    Just because one supports the woman's choice does not mean they are not a christian. <HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

    Perhaps. Maybe. Why do you call it "the woman's choice"? Would you refer to the holocaust as "Hitler's choice"?
     
    #15 Pennsylvania Jim, Sep 3, 2001
  16. Brother Adam

    Brother Adam New Member

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    Joseph Botwinick said:
    "Sometimes the truth is offensive to others because the Holy Spirit is convicting of sin. If you support abortion for any reason, IMO, you are a Baby Killer."

    Well all I can say is that I have never heard of that working, but if it works for you go for it. . .

    I don't support abortion, although I do support the choice that people have in their lives to make mistakes. I would do *almost* anything I could to stop someone having an abortion but when it comes down to it I can't stop them if that is their choice.

    This is much like the conviction that I hold that I may not agree with anything you have to say yet I will fight for your right to say it.

    Until Next Post, Adam
     
    #16 Brother Adam, Sep 4, 2001
  17. Pastor Larry

    Pastor Larry <b>Moderator</b>
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    I think conservatives have the liberals hijack the word "choice." We should all be in favor of freedom of choice of a woman over her own body. If that choice involves another person's body, she cannot make a choice over that body, no matter how tightly related it may be to her own body. I believe in a woman's right to choose even in reproductive rights. She can choose to have sex or not. She can choose anyone of a number of various means of birth control. She can choose who she wants to have sex with. However, she cannot make a choice regarding the life and death of another person. When you make the choice to have sex, you choose the consequences that may come along with it. And you have to live with them.
     
    #17 Pastor Larry, Sep 4, 2001
  18. Jonathan

    Jonathan Member
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    <BLOCKQUOTE>quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by Joseph Botwinick:


    Sometimes the truth is offensive to others because the Holy Spirit is convicting of sin. If you support abortion for any reason, IMO, you are a Baby Killer.

    Joseph    <HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

    Jonathan: And it would be accurate to call those who are lost "pagans" since they follow after the pleasures of the flesh.

    We must remember that the first step in persuading is being able to proclaim the message of truth. Insulting the audience with heated political rhetoric rarely conditions ears to hear.
     
    #18 Jonathan, Sep 4, 2001
  19. John Wells

    John Wells New Member

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    For what it's worth, the news last night said the Russian immigrant in California who killed seven family members is being charged with the murder of his wife AND her unborn child.

    I applaud that. But why then is it OK in millions of other cases for a mother and doctor to conspire and violently terminate the life of an unborn child and we call it . . . an abortion . . . a choice? There is something seriously and sadly wrong with this picture! :mad:

    [ September 05, 2001: Message edited by: John Wells ]
     
    #19 John Wells, Sep 5, 2001
  20. Pennsylvania Jim

    Pennsylvania Jim New Member

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    <BLOCKQUOTE>quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by flyfree432:


    I do support the choice that people have in their lives to make mistakes. I would do *almost* anything I could to stop someone having an abortion but when it comes down to it I can't stop them if that is their choice.

    <HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

    I don't. I don't support the choice of someone to mow down 16 people in a McDonalds with a rifle. I don't support the choice of the butchers in Somalia to kill Christians. I don't support the choice of the animals who abuse children. I don't support the choice of a "mother" and her "doctor" to murder an unborn child. I don't support the choice of a thug who blows away the cashier at a convenience store to walk away with $16.82.

    Can you elaborate on why you do? And, do you support all of these choices or only specifically the one you mentioned, the murder of the unborn baby?

    [ September 05, 2001: Message edited by: Pennsylvania Jim ]

    [ September 05, 2001: Message edited by: Pennsylvania Jim ]
     
    #20 Pennsylvania Jim, Sep 5, 2001
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