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Alter calls

Discussion in 'General Baptist Discussions' started by Jedi Knight, May 9, 2009.

  1. Alive in Christ

    Alive in Christ New Member

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    JM...

    THANK YOU for posting the link to the Albert Mohler program. I didnt know he had a daily radio broadcast.

    I just put it in my "favorites folder". I'll be a regular listener.


    :godisgood:
     
  2. Allan

    Allan Active Member

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    If I may, to those who are against alter calls, that it is not so much the alter call itself which is the issue (because it is nothing more than a plea to respond to the message) but it is more 'how' or the manner in which the alter calls are done, and for what reason "some" seem to be done. That is really the isse and not the alter call itself.

    And to the above I understand and agree with 'that' issue.
    If people think walking to the front saves, if they think just praying a prayer saves, ect.. then it is not result of an alter call (as some assume) but if this be the case, it is the result of very poor or a miscommunication on the part of the minister and whoever else.
     
    #22 Allan, May 11, 2009
    Last edited by a moderator: May 11, 2009
  3. Spinach

    Spinach New Member

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    I think altar calls are often mechanical. I'm not for a scheduled altar call. I am for an open-altar. If that means that you need to go pray in the middle of the song service, it is open to you.
     
  4. ~JM~

    ~JM~ Member

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    You're weclome Alive in Christ. His radio programs are archived and he has some gems.

    Allan, I understand the point you're making.

    :flower:
     
  5. Tom Butler

    Tom Butler New Member

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    The problem is not the use, but the misuse, abuse and manipulation that can occur.

    Here's an example. I've heard some folks give their salvation testimony as "I went forward."

    Another person I know was horrified when my pastor ended a service without an invitation. She asked, "how are people going to get saved if you don't have an invitation?"

    Have you ever heard the preacher exhort us to "come to the altar?" Of course you have. Where is the altar in a Baptist church. He meant come down front, but what is the purpose of an altar in a Baptist church?

    Have you ever heard the preacher exhort the lost to "come to Christ." He meant, of course, come down here. But the message is, in order to get saved you have to come down here.

    Have you ever been in a service where the preacher was so eager for a response that he'd try anything? If you don't need saving, do you need to rededicate your life? Do you have a burden you need to pray about? Come down here to the altar. I've even seen him say, "is there someone here that has had an influence on your life? Go tell them so, give them a hug. Of course, we all have people in our church that have influenced us, so it's a no-brainer to get a response.

    By the way, on the Day of Pentecost, Peter never gave an invitation. In fact, he never got to finish his sermon. He was interrupted by the anguished cry "what shall we do?"
     
  6. EdSutton

    EdSutton New Member

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    "Should we altar the 'alter call' perhaps?

    Or should the title of the thread be altered, in the alternative?

    It does appear that some altered state of awareness has altered the ability to discern and distinguish between these 2 words, so that it has taken 11 posts, including 3 by this above poster to notice the difference. ;) "

    Signed, Language Cop

    P.S. Language Cop is the alter ego of EdSutton :D
     
    #26 EdSutton, May 11, 2009
    Last edited by a moderator: May 11, 2009
  7. EdSutton

    EdSutton New Member

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    C'mon, Allan.

    After reading many of your own well-informed posts for almost 3 years, I suggest that you, along with a couple of others who are posting on this thread, are definitely among those who should 'get it' here.

    'For cryin' out loud,' please alter the spelling, here, and permanently altar the incorrect phrase of "alter call."

    [Edited to add] Although Language Cop notes he did not find any obvious instances of the usage of "altar" as a transitive verb at a quick glance, he assures all that this rare usage is not incorrect. It means to lay some 'object' on 'the place of sacrifice' such as the improper use of the phrase "alter call" for the purpose of 'killing' it.

    Ed
     
    #27 EdSutton, May 11, 2009
    Last edited by a moderator: May 11, 2009
  8. preachinjesus

    preachinjesus Well-Known Member
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    ah yes, the Language Cop provides us a voice of sanity. :)
     
  9. EdSutton

    EdSutton New Member

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    "The job can be extremely trying, at times, and even one demanding a great deal of restraint.

    However, given the passing a little more than a year ago of the late, great William F. Buckley, Jr., along with with the fact that grammarians extraordinaire Edwin H. Newman and James J. Kilpatrick are both slowing down greatly, if not even starting to slip a bit, with both now nearing 90, IMO, someone should occasionally attempt to fill these shoes that are very large indeed (and certainly far beyond my own abilities) into this growing void.

    Unfortunately, although I can only offer some very limited talent to this end (and will very willingly cede the job who one proves more qualified than I), nevertheless IMO, someone should still undertake the effo..." ;)

    Signed, Language Cop
     
    #29 EdSutton, May 11, 2009
    Last edited by a moderator: May 11, 2009
  10. Old Scholar

    Old Scholar New Member

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    For a preacher to say that anyone can “make the decision” now is an inaccurate statement of how a person can be saved. Man is not able to save himself. He may read, study, inquire and learn what he needs to be saved from but it is Christ to fix the time when man shall believe. This is the sovereignty of God and no man can do anything to save himself. It is not works that does it but the grace of God.

    This can be damaging to the souls of men by insisting they “come forward” now and accept Christ on the spot. It just doesn’t work that way unless the person has been doing the studying and getting his mind in order as is necessary so that when God calls him, he is ready. If a man is spiritually unprepared and tries to come forward at the preacher’s request, go through the motions and then go away thinking they have received Christ, it can be very damaging because they have not done the necessary steps of receiving Christ prior to the emotional request of the preacher but instead got “wrapped up” in the emotional plea of the pastor.

    This leads to many ‘false’ conversions and the way some pastors do it, can be called “bullying” and interferes with the work of the Holy Spirit in the man’s heart. Decisions made in these cases result in man taking it upon himself to bring that work to a conclusion that is too early—like picking fruit before it is ripe—and the false conversions may harden the man’s heart and lead to hypocrisy. Such an appeal to make this immediate decision presupposes that men are free to “accept Christ” at any time; and that can be disastrous, providing an issue of a false and, in my opinion, un-scriptural view of sin.

    If a man responds to an altar call, can we call it an act of faith? Faith is not a physical act at all. It is not a sinner doing something for himself but rather the sinner relying upon Christ to do something for him. We can’t call ‘going forward’ a ‘good work’ either because a ‘good work’ is only as God has commanded in His holy word and not devised by men upon any pretense of good intention.

    We must remember that conversion follows regeneration and conversion consists of repentance and faith and while some may say that is a reason for having an altar call, just remember that things devised by men are not really good works at all as there is no Biblical foundation for such a method.

    True worship, to me, is the gathering together, singing of songs, reading of the Scriptures, preaching the gospel and so on. Until someone demonstrates that the altar call is either expressly set down in Scripture, or that it may be legitimately deduced from Scripture, then we can’t justify it in its most common form.
     
  11. EdSutton

    EdSutton New Member

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    Welcome to the Baptist Board. :wavey:

    Ed
     
  12. rbell

    rbell Active Member

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    Wow. My God's big enough to use lots of things to draw people to Him.

    Can it be abused? Of course. Is it outright wrong? That's not our call to make. Let's let God use what He wants to use to draw people unto Himself.

    I think we always need to be careful about assigning a certain entity to the realm of satan. That's dangerous territory to say, "That's never of God, and He doesn't use it." I'm not willing to go there.
     
  13. Alive in Christ

    Alive in Christ New Member

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    Ed Sutton...

    I'm sorry language cop, but I jus dont thingk that your srvices are needded hear. Speking for myseff, my grammr is jus fine, thnk you very mush.

    :thumbs:
     
    #33 Alive in Christ, May 11, 2009
    Last edited by a moderator: May 11, 2009
  14. ~JM~

    ~JM~ Member

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    That's not what I posted, you're reading into the statement something that isn't there...

    :jesus:
     
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