Amillennialism Debate -Part Three

So, the truth gets cut again?

 

DICTIONARY'S DEFININITION OF "...ITE"

Main Entry: [1]-ite1 a : native : resident [Brooklynite] b : descendant [Ephraimite] c : adherent : follower [Jacobite] [Israelite]

 

IS THIS A PASTORS WAY OF INSULTING?

 

HAD YOU NOT DELETED MY POST AND ACTUALLY READ IT YOU WOULD HAVE REALIZED THAT ANY DISPENSATIONALIST CAN LEGITIMATELY BE REFERRED TO AS A DARBYITE - NOT IN AN INSULTING WAY, BUT BECAUSE HE ACCEPTS AND BELIEVES THE DOCTRINE OF DARBY

 

I really didn't think much of the name calling because it has gone on since I've been on this board.

All would have to admit that it has gone on way too long with certain posters. I'm not talking about just this thread but other threads on here have I seen the same poster(s) try to belittle a brother or sister in Christ. It's uncalled for in any situation.

I enjoy a good debate, but not when its a personal attack rather than a defense of the word.

[rimshot]

We all need to take a break every once in a while and be lighthearted, like Dr. Bob.

 

Moderator Warning:

This is the second time we are asking that no one bring insults and name calling particularly the reference to anyone being a "Darbyite"----three warnings and the thread will be locked!!

Clear??

Bro. David

 

Following is the results of research (not just out-of-thin-air-claims) that I did on the Internet. If any moderator turns this into “insults” they are depriving me of my right to use this Board to inform.

In my post on the roots of dispensationalism and the era of its birth, I stated that it was a phenomenon that occurred within about a 40-70 year period of time when the major false religions of today got started – and I might add, that they seemed to all originate on the east coast of the USA which is very interesting indeed. This is not an attack on dispensational roots but is a “proceed with caution and check your roots” admonition for you to seriously consider. I would hope that a Christian brother would do that for me if I were not confident that Amillenialism was the predominant doctrine of the Christian church for 1,800 years.

I have not included the 16-year old visionary, Margaret MacDonald, which actually was the springboard for J. N. Darby’s idea of a secret rapture nor am I trying to state that dispensationalism is a cult as JW’s are. I am also not saying that dispensationalists are not Christians. I leave that up to God. I am saying, though, that the doctrine is in grave error and does justify a serious investigation if one is dedicated to following the Word of God in one’s belief system.

JOSEPH SMITH
Raised a Christian in Vermont and New York, Joseph Smith was the prophet and founder of the Mormon Church. According to Smith's account, he had a vision from God when he was fourteen years old. A messenger directed him to a hillside in rural New York… Smith, using the [suddenly discovered] stones, translated the word of Mormon to form the new canon of the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-Day Saints (also called the Mormon Church or LDS), founded in 1830.

CHARLES T. RUSSELL
Active in the Christian Congregationalist church in Pennsylvania, Charles T. Russell broke off and formed an independent congregation in 1880 called the Watchtower Bible and Tract Society. Russell wrote and lectured on Biblical prophecy, preaching that the return of the invisible spirit of Jesus Christ happened in 1874. Russell believed that Jesus would rule for 1,000 years, and that all people (living and dead) would eventually be divinely judged.

MARY BAKER EDDY
After a sudden recovery from a serious injury in 1866, Mary Baker Eddy began to formulate the ideas that would lead her to form the Church of Christ, Scientist. Beginning in the 1870s she wrote extensively, publishing Science and Health in 1875. In 1889 she chartered the Church of Christ, Scientist in Boston, Massachusetts.

ELLEN G. WHITE (Name at birth: Ellen Harmon)
Ellen G. White is one of the founders of the Seventh-day Adventist Church, which was officially organized in 1863. Although raised as a Methodist, Ellen Harmon was influenced by the "Adventist" movement of New England in the 1840s. Led by William Miller, a Baptist preacher, Adventists believed that Jesus would return to earth in either 1843 or 1844 (some pinned it down to 22 October 1844). In 1846 Harmon married a minister, James White, and together they devoted themselves to preaching religious principles based on visions she believed to be revelations from God.

JOHN NELSON DARBY
A “particular interpretation of Christ's return ... was developed by an Irish Protestant, John Nelson Darby (1800-1882)." Darby saw a second coming of Christ, which he "believed would precede the time of troubles, or 'tribulation,' mentioned in several New Testament passages, [which] he called the 'secret rapture.'

Darby began to develop his seven-age dispensationalism about [1830]. By 1835 he added 'secret rapture,' and had gradually added dispensations up to 1838.

John Nelson Darby spread his beliefs while visiting the United States and Canada 1859-1877. At first he tried to win members of existing Protestant congregations to his sect, but met with little success.

Geographically, the doctrine moved from its original foothold in the large cities of New York, Boston, Chicago, and St. Louis to the northeast and Midwest. Later it spread to the West and South.

C. I. SCOFIELD
Darby, as well as his teachings, probably would be unheard of today were it not for his devoted follower, Scofield[/b].. Scofield came to know him and became enamored by his teachings. Scofield wrote many books, founded what is now called the Philadelphia College of the Bible, and, in 1909, published his Scofield Reference Bible. All these efforts inculcated the Plymouth Brethren teachings learned from Darby.

MOODY BIBLE INSTITUTE OF CHICAGO
In 1890, C. I. Scofield began a Comprehensive Bible Correspondence Course, later taken over about 1914 by the Moody Bible Institute (Dwight. L. Moody, founder of the Moody Church, had converted Scofield, and Scofield preached and presided at Moody's funeral in 1899). While in the US, Darby was invited to speak at D. L. Moody's church in Chicago.

DALLAS THEOLOGICAL SEMINARY
Walvoord was the Professor of Systematic Theology at Dallas Theological Seminary for over fifty years. He also served as the President of the seminary from 1953 to1986.

The two men who most influenced Walvoord, as he developed as a thinker, were Lewis Sperry Chafer, the first President of Dallas Theological Seminary, and C.I. Scofield of the Scofield Reference Bible. Walvoord actually served on the committee to produce the New Scofield Reference Bible (1967).

So, be the roots and the era of new teachings, and various promoters of Darby’s dispensationalism. These are not trumped up theories, they are facts that can be found anywhere in books and on the internet.

 

I have ASKED that posts that are offensive be pm'ed to me so that the situation can be dealt with.

Where did he call you a liar? Did you lie and he was making an observation? (I will consider both, as I do with all complaints) </font>[/QUOTE]Post #6, page 8; I present the pertinent quote for your convenience.

Now a lie is a false statement made with deliberate intent to deceive.

There is a vast difference between saying something that may be untrue because of lack of information or because of false information and deliberately making a false statement to deceive someone. According to DHK's [and Democrats] rationale President Bush lied about WMD in Iraq but we know that his statements were based on intelligence reports by most intelligence services in the world and, therefore, he did not lie.

Any way you slice it DHK called me a liar both in his second and third statements. So I ask you again, is there a double standard on this forum.

As to his point #1 if I did not think I was correct it would be a little foolish to spend time debating. I assume the dispensationalists on this forum, including you, sincerely believe you are correct. I sincerely believe that you are wrong, that is the basis for debate.

May I also say that I have disagreed as vigorously as possible with those who follow dispensational doctrine. I have on occasion used sarcasm. But I have not questioned anyones integrity, salvation, morals, or intelligence. I have not even called anyone a liberal [which you accused amillennialists of being] though from the classic definition of liberal dispensationalism would certainly be considered the most liberal of the 4 major eschatological doctrines since it is the most recent.

1st & 2nd. amillennialism or historic premillennialism, depending on whose record you read, 1st &/or 2nd century.

3rd. Post millennialism,after the reformation, possibly as early as the 17th century, most likely not prominent until the 18th.

4th. Dispensationalism, 19th century.

 

[attack snipped]

[ March 03, 2005, 02:12 PM: Message edited by: Dr. Bob ]

 

You're a pompus *****!

[cussing snipped; poster suspended]