Are men feminized in our churches?

It has to do with submission to authority and leadership. Women should not to be in authority over men and leading them. One of the reasons is that men will not typically follow a woman. It is not a normal thing. They will follow another man and women will follow a man. Men also need leadership to teach them how to lead others and in their home. Men will become strong leaders when they are led by strong leaders.

It is God's plan for men to be strong leaders among men and in mixed groups.

 

It depends on what they want.

 

I was not thinking of that.

 

Read I Timothy chapter 2. Is "local gathering of Christians" or church mentioned once? It doesn't say "I will that men pray in church"; it says "every where". Is Paul saying that women should dress modestly at church only?

 

Jim1999...

You better believe it.

It certainly does.

I dont either. Shame on those who do. May someone throw their shoe at them! :laugh:


:godisgood:

 

If you take a look around the world you will also notice natural orders. One is that in societies where women do all the work men do all the leading. It is typical that as the number of women work in a society it is also related to the percentage of women who are in leadership until it reaches 50%. When it reaches 50% it turns around. as the number of women who work in society goes over 50% the percentage of women in leadership goes down.

I was not making any reference about respect but about leadership and submission. I was not making reference to work but rather the church. Show me a feminine led church and I will show you weak men or very few men. In a male led church you will see strong leadership among men.

Women will follow men much easier than another woman and men will follow men better than a lady.

FYI, my boss is a woman and she is great. She is very good. She is feminine and provides a lot of help for people to succeed. I am in a profession where leadership is not much of an issue. I teach at a university so we do not deal with spiritual issues. We work together a lot and there is a lot of comraderie. The field I am in is not very subjective but quite objective. We do not deal with spiritual things. From time to time we may have spiritual conversations with another but never in a meeting. She does not teach us. She is more of a facilitator among us. We are all experts in our area that we teach in. So there is very little overlap among us. Each of us have our own turf in a real sense.

 

I have several thoughts on the subject...

1. The handbag comment was priceless.

2. God uses who He wants to use.

3. I don't like Sunday School (See Jerome's first post).

4. There are bossy women out there and they are not in their place. I have no problem with women filling certain roles----it's the brashness at which some do it---think Joyce Meyers. A meek and mild spirit is best. No man likes to be bossed around by a woman. Women need to be careful, here.

5. I think some men LET women feminize them and I think that's a shame. I think a real man knows the value of his position and neither rules with a rod of iron, or allows himself to be walked on.

 

self edited . . .

 

Paul doesn't say turkeys should be in charge....though I suppose it happens:wavey:

Of course it can and it should when the verse is clear.

Well, that just isn't true. I do look at the whole picture, and accept scripture in context. What many do, IMHO, is ignore or dismiss scripture they disagree with.

I actually had a PHd (from a SBC Seminary) tell me that he "disagreed with Paul's interpretation of scripture" concerning the I Tim. 2 passage (those were his very words). He knew what it meant concerning female leadership. That could not be denied. He simply decided he knew better than Paul concerning the issue.

peace to youraying:

 

Expect that more will be coming.

 

One might read Hebrews 13:8-9

I do not know of any.

In Judges 4-5 I find that Deborah, a prophetess was put in authority over men because no other man would "man up". God was treating the Hebrews as children (spiritually that is what they were for they had gone back to idol worship after Ehud.
I can find where there were females who prophesied but, I do not find in the NT where they were in leadership. In fact, I can not find any women in the NT that spoke in toungues. (tho this was the least of all gifts)



The Church did not exist in the OT. Paul set forth the way the NT Church was to be governed. This was not Paul's own words but words inspired by God.
I do not see nothing that prohibits women teaching along side men with men in authority. We are all given gifts from God to use in our ministries.
Are there positions in the Church that men and not women are to fill? Absolutely! Pastors, Bishops, Overseers, Elders and Deacons are positions with qualifications, in the scripture, that only men can fill. There is a certain way God wants things done. They do not have to make sense to us but we need to use our faith that God knows what He is doing and doesn't need our consent.

 

Gina, I said that I could only find that circumstance in the OT.
I believe what Paul writes for the Church in the NT. Nowhere does he state women are suppose to do men's jobs in the Church. We are instructed to treat our women as Jesus treats the Church. How can we keep our women on a pedestal (my words) if we require them to deal with the grime of Church government? Why would women want to do what God has told men to do?

 

"Should be" in most cases for practical and spiritual reasons.

John Toppass:
Believes women can take charge only when men won't "man up" and that all positions in a church with qualifications are for males only. [/quote]
God is not limited by "our" doctrine. I know a Baptist woman along with another woman who started a church among a tribe of people who had never heard the name of Christ. A man from the outside (especially one who was an American and because of his comparative wealth) would have been a threat to the men in the village. The men in the village cared for those two women. That gave them communication and access to the male leaders in the village. Those two women led some men to Christ. They also taught the men who became Christians and then the men led.

 

I wasn't necessarily either.

I am sure people followed Priscilla (and Aquila--I wonder why her name goes first. )

I am sure people followed Sapphira.

I am sure people followed Lydia.

I am sure people followed Euodia and Syntyche.

 

Sorry Saggy,,,,there are many who will write those biblical woman off or explain them away. I gave up on the question.

Cheers,

Jim

Even the leader of the PB's accepted that there were female deacons in the NT church. Believe me, that is a huge admission!

 

I try not to write anyone off, male or female, they all have a wonderful place in the ministry of the disciples of Jesus Christ.

What the leader of the PB's says is of no concern to me when I try my best to follow scripture. No man can overide scripture no matter how many followers he may have.

 

You used the term "forever". I simply meant that when Christ returns, there will no longer be any question about who has the leadership role.

There is alot we do not know about our heavenly, resurrected bodies. Jesus did tell us we would not have marriage in heaven. Based on that, I don't believe we will have the need or desire for intimacy as you find between a husband and wife.

Will we still have gender? I don't really know. It seems what little we know of heaven tells us we will recognize the person that was on earth, but whether gender is essential for that recognition.... I don't know.

One thing I am certain of, however, is that when we get to heaven we will not be judged according to what positions we held in the church but how faithful we were to God's Word in living out our lives for the cause of Christ.

peace to youraying: