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Are we saved forever ??

Discussion in 'Other Christian Denominations' started by dan p, Jul 8, 2010.

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  1. dan p

    dan p New Member

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    Hi to all , and as a teenager , I remember hearing my car radio as I drove to my So Bap church on Sunday .

    This preacher was tellin me that we are saved and always saved and could not believe what I was hearing and did not believe it .

    I arrived at church and told my Pastor what I heared and this is what he said .

    We believe in Saved , always Saved , but he did not tell me why we are saved , always , saved .

    This is why I believe in Eternal Life ;

    #1 , Rom 6:23 , " but the gift of God is Eternal Life by Jesus Christ our Lord ."

    #2 , And Col 1:27 , reveals that we are " in Christ " and that means PART of Christ .

    #3 , Then Eph 2:8 , " For by grace are ye saved ."

    #4 , The Greek word for saved /SOZO , is in the Greek Perfect Tense , which means Past Action with Continuing Results .

    Which means we are also in the Present , and a good example of the Perfect Tense is when Jesus was on the cross , He said " it is finished ."
    It is finished is also in the Perfect Tense and the Past Action was His death on the Cross and from then on He keeps saving all that have faith in Him .

    Does Jesus go back on the cross ? NO , is right . The Perfect Tense also means that He will NEVER go back and be crucified AGAIN .

    #5 , It is also in the Passive Voice , which means it was God that did the saving and NOT US .

    #6 , It is also in the Indicative Mood , and that means SAVED ALWAYS SAVED , THANK GOD , and it means that it is a FACT .
     
    #1 dan p, Jul 8, 2010
  2. Athanasian Creed

    Athanasian Creed New Member

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    If saved, always saved!

    I've heard Cavinists repeat their pet Scripture time and time again -

    John 10:28 And I give unto them eternal life; and they shall never perish, neither shall any man pluck them out of my hand.

    Yet, they forget vs. 27 -

    John 10:27 My sheep hear my voice, and I know them, and they follow me:

    One who has backslidden/forfeited salvation by continuance in sin does NOT hear Christ's voice (their consciences become hardened to the point of no longer hearing or the Spirit refuses to call that person to repentance - Gen 6:3a) "The blessed Spirit strives with sinners, by the convictions and admonitions of conscience, to turn them from sin to God. 2. If the Spirit be resisted, quenched, and striven against, though he strive long, he will not strive always, Ho 4:17. 3. Those are ripening apace for ruin whom the Spirit of grace has left off striving with." (Matthew Henry Commentary). And they do not follow Christ (present tense) since Christ has called us to "be holy" and to "abide in Him" They, in their rebellion, have chosen to stop following Christ - and their eternal destiny will be the Lake of Fire!

    John 15:6 If a man abide not in me, he is cast forth as a branch, and is withered; and (lit. Gr. they (angels) gather them), and cast them into the fire, and they are burned.

    If any one abide not in me - By living faith; not by Church communion only. He may thus abide in Christ, and be withered all the time, and cast into the fire at last. He is cast out - Of the vineyard, the invisible Church. Therefore he was in it once. (Wesley)


    Matthew 13:41-42 The Son of man shall send forth his angels, and they shall gather out of his kingdom all things that offend, and them which do iniquity; And shall cast them into a furnace of fire: there shall be wailing and gnashing of teeth.


    Ray ;)
     
    #2 Athanasian Creed, Jul 11, 2010
  3. Jedi Knight

    Jedi Knight Well-Known Member
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    You sound jealous. Pretty hypocritical to call "pet" scriptures and you pull the same "pet" scriptures out like Matthew 18 over and over. BTW being hypocritical to another believer....would that cause you to loose your salvation? Or is that just a "pet" sin?
     
    #3 Jedi Knight, Jul 11, 2010
    Last edited by a moderator: Jul 11, 2010
  4. billwald

    billwald New Member

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    Why does it matter?
     
    #4 billwald, Jul 11, 2010
  5. Dr. Walter

    Dr. Walter New Member

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    What you fail to understand in John 10:27 is that the present indicative is DECLARATIVE not subjunctive or conditional. In othe words the grammar does not present "hearing" and "following" as conditions but makes them DECLARATIVE or INDICATIVE as facts that characterize all true sheep. You are presenting them as "conditions" to be sheep whereas Christ is declaring these as consequences of being sheep.

    John 15 is a misunderstanding based on thinking that "in me" or "in Christ" always refers to our state of redemption. In regard to redemption "in Christ" they are already cleansed (v. 3). So salvation is not the issue here. The issue is FRUIT PRODUCTION and EXPERIENCE of blessings (joy, love, usefulness) on a daily basis. Abiding "in Christ" here has reference to our EXPERIENTIAL walk "in him" (Col. 2:6; Gal. 5:24-26).

    As we "abide in him" we experience the blessings of salvation here and now and at the same time are used for the glory of God. However, if when we are not abiding in him, fruit is not being produced, blessings are not being experienced, and therefore we are failing in "redeeming the time" (Eph. 5:17 and our life is lost forever as you can never redeem wasted time, wasted years, but it goes up in smoke. Furthermore, men judge your life according to your fruit and a life without fruit in the eyes of men is lossed in the fires of judgement in the court of human observation.


    This refers to "in Christ" by experience as in Col. 2:6 or as in Gal. 5:25-26.

     
    #5 Dr. Walter, Jul 11, 2010
  6. Robert Snow

    Robert Snow New Member

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    I would settle for only half of eternity! :jesus:
     
    #6 Robert Snow, Jul 11, 2010
  7. Jon-Marc

    Jon-Marc New Member

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    Half of forever is still forever since eternity has no end. I thank God I was given ETERNAL life on May 18, 1963. I just canpt imagine what we are going to DO for eternity. I get bored with 24 hour days. Still, there are only two options--eternity with Christ or eternity without Him. I choose with.
     
    #7 Jon-Marc, Jul 12, 2010
  8. billwald

    billwald New Member

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    How terrible! I've never been bored. There is always something to do or to think about.
     
    #8 billwald, Jul 12, 2010
  9. dan p

    dan p New Member

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    What ???

    Hi Ray , and first I am not a Calvinist , maybe you will be willing to explain T U L I P TO us all and enlighten us all ??

    Second , tear apart the OP .

    Third , your Context has nothing to do with my OP .

    Fourthly , how did you get into that Kingdom of Matt 13:41-42 ?
     
    #9 dan p, Jul 12, 2010
    Last edited by a moderator: Jul 12, 2010
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