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Arminians That I Admire

Discussion in 'Baptist Theology & Bible Study' started by Rippon, Aug 10, 2006.

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  1. Bob Alkire

    Bob Alkire New Member

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    Thanks for your reply. I know of him being pastor of Calvary Baptist Church. I went their a few time, when I was passing through that part of the country. As far as Dr. L-Jones I don't know, but wouldn't be surprised, I went to Hargrave Military Academy before I went to college and at our chapel all ministers had stipulations on them before they spoke.

    I still wouldn't put him in either camp. But with that said I wouldn't put me in either camp. People in each of those camps put me in the one they aren't in.
     
  2. Rippon

    Rippon Well-Known Member
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    You misunderstood. Lloyd-Jones made some stipulations before agreeing to preach at the church Wiersbe was pastoring.

    I said that Wiersbe was at Calvary Baptist in the 70's. Actually he was pastor there from 1961-1971.

    Wiersbe also pastored at Moody Memorial Church and one other assembly. I don't know which one Lloyd-Jones preached at Wiersbe's behest.

    Wiersbe's not a Calvinist.
     
  3. Jim1999

    Jim1999 <img src =/Jim1999.jpg>

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    Wiersbe, in fact, spoke of both systems, with high regard for aspects of both. I still contend he was a turn of the last century American Calvinist, as were, and are, so many Baptists to-day..it is that "foreknowledge" thing.

    Cheers,

    Jim
     
  4. Rippon

    Rippon Well-Known Member
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    You are employing the term Calvinist in a very elastic way. You have a big-tent approach.

    I know that there is some variety in the Calvinistic camp soteriologically -- but not nearly as much as you hold to.

    I have no idea what you are talking about here. Please elaborate Jim.
     
  5. Bob Alkire

    Bob Alkire New Member

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    Thanks again, I did miss understand your statement.

    I know when he was in Covington and Moody and Back to the Bible. I too, admire his service.


    We both agree on this. I respect him much.

    I'm also in accord with Jim1999 on, he was a turn of the last century American Calvinist, as were, and are, so many Baptists to-day. I also agree with Jim on Wiersbe speaking of both systems, with high regard.
     
  6. Jim1999

    Jim1999 <img src =/Jim1999.jpg>

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    Rippon, I am a strict theological Calvinist, all 5-points including the absolute sovereignty of God.

    Many Baptists claim election and predestination to be based on the foreknowledge of God, allowing man to make the choice freely unto salvation. Those same Baptists would claim to be Calvinists.

    Many of the Fellowship pastors are of that persuasion. Those of us from the Regular Baptist group are strict Calvinists and believe foreknowledge is a natural attribute of an eternal God and not a causative factor in election and predestination.

    We are not in post-reformation times and the names are virtually useless, in my opinion. Most would abhor the label of Arminian as would all my good friends on the Back to the Bible program.

    Most of the professors at the Fellowship Seminary are of the Dallas ilk and would follow the foreknowledge scheme along with dispensationalism.

    Hope that clears up what I am saying.

    Cheers,

    Jim
     
  7. Rippon

    Rippon Well-Known Member
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    So were the names useless from 1700-1999 as well? That period was post-Reformation too.

    Wouldn't they also abhor being called Calvinists too?

    That's the thing. Folks don't want to be associated with the name Arminian even though that soteriological position most resembles their own from an historical theological standpoint.

    But they certainly don't want to be tainted with being thought of as Calvinists and all the bad luggage that entails.

    So they are stuck. They'll opt for being called biblicists -- which in reality is Arminian without having the guts to admit it.

    You mentioned Dallas -- they would, for the most part be Amyraldian.
     
  8. Pipedude

    Pipedude Active Member

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    HOT dawg, now Rip's seen the light! :godisgood:
     
  9. kyredneck

    kyredneck Well-Known Member
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    ..........you should be ashamed of yourself.........:laugh:
     
  10. kyredneck

    kyredneck Well-Known Member
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    Yes they do. Man, talk about putting the cart before the horse; it's another attempt to explain away God's sovereign grace and insert the will of man where it is not.

    As I've stated before; I have foreknowledge of what's going to come up in my garden because I planted it. The foreknowledge of God is just that simple.
     
  11. Jim1999

    Jim1999 <img src =/Jim1999.jpg>

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    To my mind, anything that deviates from the five points, deviates from Calvinism. Further, the essence of Calvinism is the absolute sovereignty of God. We cannot strip God of any aspect of that sovereignty and still be a strict Calvinist.

    On the other hand, there are many who do deviate, but still label themselves Calvinistic. It is the one way of keeping the doctrine many call, "Once saved; always saved."

    Part of Amyraldianism is the blood of Christ on the cross being sufficient to save all, but efficient for the elect. I believe this to be true of Calvinism, as did Calvin, not in the Institutes, which written early in his lifetime, but in his commentary on Romans, which was written much later.

    When we employ the term post-reformation, it has a limitation on time, as do all historical writings. Obviously anything dated after Luther is post-reformation. If we use post-reformation in a non-specific way, we can also label the church as post Barthian.

    Cheers,

    Jim
     
  12. Carico

    Carico New Member

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    None. If anyone is speaking the truth it's because God has put His word into the hearts of that person. But if one keeps contradicting the bible (which Arminians do), there is no reason to respect what he stands for.
     
  13. Pipedude

    Pipedude Active Member

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    Well, even if we contradict the Bible, at least we capitalize it. :saint:
     
  14. Rippon

    Rippon Well-Known Member
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    A Golden Oldie

    Time to revive this thread. Calvinists, at least most of them do not despise Arminians --but consider them brothers and sisters in the Lord.

    A.W. Pink advised someone who liked Alexander MacLaren's sermons not to feel bad about it. He went on to say that one's theological life would be much poorer without reading the works of good and godly Arminians.
     
  15. Yeshua1

    Yeshua1 Well-Known Member
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    CS Lewis
    Norman Geisler
    Josh McDowell
     
  16. Revmitchell

    Revmitchell Well-Known Member
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    Those men are not arminians
     
  17. Yeshua1

    Yeshua1 Well-Known Member
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    Dr Geisler is one, as represented by his Systematic Theology, and CS lewis did not hold to reformed views on salvation, and think josh is a free wiill Baptist, isn't he?
     
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