1. Welcome to Baptist Board, a friendly forum to discuss the Baptist Faith in a friendly surrounding.

    Your voice is missing! You will need to register to get access to all the features that our community has to offer.

    We hope to see you as a part of our community soon and God Bless!

Arminius on Calvin

Discussion in 'Baptist Theology & Bible Study' started by Luke2427, Jun 6, 2011.

Thread Status:
Not open for further replies.
  1. Alive in Christ

    Alive in Christ New Member

    Joined:
    Jun 22, 2008
    Messages:
    3,822
    Likes Received:
    1
    Quantum posted...


    Truth.
     
  2. Rippon

    Rippon Well-Known Member
    Site Supporter

    Joined:
    Dec 12, 2005
    Messages:
    19,715
    Likes Received:
    585
    Faith:
    Baptist
    Better to take truth as far as possible instead of coming up short on the truth stick.
     
  3. Luke2427

    Luke2427 Active Member

    Joined:
    Jun 29, 2010
    Messages:
    7,598
    Likes Received:
    23
    I find this post to be derogatory, demeaning and disrespectful. :wavey:
     
  4. Skandelon

    Skandelon <b>Moderator</b>

    Joined:
    Jan 19, 2003
    Messages:
    9,638
    Likes Received:
    1
    I agree. It would have been very disrespectful of Arminus to call Calvin's view a "weirdo nameless theology...that swings open wide the door to damnable heresy." I can't imagine who would show that kind of disrepect for other brethren of the faith. Can you? :tear:
     
  5. Luke2427

    Luke2427 Active Member

    Joined:
    Jun 29, 2010
    Messages:
    7,598
    Likes Received:
    23
    Primarily because it would have been utterly ridiculous.

    Arminianism is not the big problem, imo.

    I was a devout Arminian for 10 years.

    I attended a thoroughly Arminian Bible College.

    I have been debating Calvinists since I was 18.

    And I can say that Arminianism is orthodox.

    My problem is this new weirdo nameless theology that opens wide the door to heresy- this eclectic hodge podge of doctrines that do not fit together and that stem from what is OFTEN a total lack of understanding, reverence and even interest in the Historic Christian Faith.

    The attitude and philosophy that gave rise to this new nameless stuff is, imo, the same that gave rise to Finney's theology, Pentecostalism, Mormonism, etc...
     
  6. quantumfaith

    quantumfaith Active Member

    Joined:
    Jan 26, 2010
    Messages:
    6,890
    Likes Received:
    1
    Not exactly certain what I must agree with here. I do immensely respect most anyone who dedicates a lifetime of intellectual (and otherwise) capital in pursuit of a passion, gift and calling. So yes, on those grounds I respect Mr. Calvin, but at the same time, that does not mean I find myself in agreement on most things, much like imminent scientists and philosophers, who I also respect, but reach different conclusions.

    As I attempted to communicate and will continue to do so, it is not so much the position that Luke (you and others) have, but the manner in which that position is articulated and supported.
     
  7. Jerome

    Jerome Well-Known Member
    Site Supporter

    Joined:
    Aug 21, 2006
    Messages:
    9,788
    Likes Received:
    698
    Faith:
    Baptist
    "I admit that some called, Calvinists, are the most quarrelsome set breathing, this is the reason—while they have the main part of the Truth of God, many of them are leaving out something important—therefore God chastises them because they are some of His best children! It may be a sign of life that they are so eager after Truth that they kill one another in order to get it, but I wish they would leave off their quarrelling, for it is a disgrace to our religion." —Charles Spurgeon, "The God of Peace"

    "How zealous they are for Protestantism! They would not only die for orthodoxy, but kill others as well. Perhaps it is the Calvinistic doctrine which they have received, and then the five points are as dear to them as their five senses. These men will contend, not to say earnestly, but savagely for the faith. They very vehemently denounce all those who differ from them in the smallest degree; and deal damnation round the land with amazing liberality to all who are not full weight according to the balance of their little Zoar, Rehoboth, or Jireh" —Charles Spurgeon, "Nothing But Leaves"
     
  8. Alive in Christ

    Alive in Christ New Member

    Joined:
    Jun 22, 2008
    Messages:
    3,822
    Likes Received:
    1
    Jerome posted...


    Wow. Never read that before. That quite interesting
     
  9. webdog

    webdog Active Member
    Site Supporter

    Joined:
    Mar 31, 2005
    Messages:
    24,696
    Likes Received:
    2
    Boy was he off... ;) :laugh:
     
  10. Alive in Christ

    Alive in Christ New Member

    Joined:
    Jun 22, 2008
    Messages:
    3,822
    Likes Received:
    1
    Luke...

    You posted....

    I agree with you regarding "weirdo" theologies that crop up from time to time.

    What specifically are you referring to? The "name it/claim it bunch? They are definetly problematic.


    Mormonism is cultic to the core. But you cant lump all of pentecostalism in with all of those others. Some pentacostal groups are indeed cultic, while some others are not in any way cultic.

    We shouldnt engage in "carpet bombing", so to speak.
     
  11. Rippon

    Rippon Well-Known Member
    Site Supporter

    Joined:
    Dec 12, 2005
    Messages:
    19,715
    Likes Received:
    585
    Faith:
    Baptist
    I would think that C.H.S. was especially targeting hyper-Calvinists in the above quotes.
     
  12. JesusFan

    JesusFan Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Jan 4, 2011
    Messages:
    8,913
    Likes Received:
    240
    Don't you find many Arminians group all of us cals together in the "Hyper Cal" camp though?

    Not knowing there varying degrees of Cals in Christianity?
     
  13. Jerome

    Jerome Well-Known Member
    Site Supporter

    Joined:
    Aug 21, 2006
    Messages:
    9,788
    Likes Received:
    698
    Faith:
    Baptist
    Varying degrees?

    Really?

     
  14. JesusFan

    JesusFan Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Jan 4, 2011
    Messages:
    8,913
    Likes Received:
    240
    Well

    IF you go into the "reformed" Calvinists pretty much ALL see it strictly as the Creed/Councils TULIP all points etc

    have a hunch IF you go into Baptist Churches you would tend to see mor eprominent "4 pointers" we who are the "fake" Calvinists!

    Don't worry... IF you believe that grace IS iressible, and that God HAS TO elect out his own people directly, still would have to be a cal, as no Arminian would agree with that!
     
    #34 JesusFan, Jun 7, 2011
    Last edited by a moderator: Jun 7, 2011
  15. Rippon

    Rippon Well-Known Member
    Site Supporter

    Joined:
    Dec 12, 2005
    Messages:
    19,715
    Likes Received:
    585
    Faith:
    Baptist
    In my post #31 I said nothing of varying degrees. I said that Spurgeon was probably targeting hyper-Calvinists in the two quotes you provided.
     
  16. Jerome

    Jerome Well-Known Member
    Site Supporter

    Joined:
    Aug 21, 2006
    Messages:
    9,788
    Likes Received:
    698
    Faith:
    Baptist
    I know you didn't. JesusFan did.

    Interesting. . .are you of the opinion that HyperCalvinists were/are particularly quarrelsome, savage, etc.?
     
    #36 Jerome, Jun 8, 2011
    Last edited by a moderator: Jun 8, 2011
  17. Luke2427

    Luke2427 Active Member

    Joined:
    Jun 29, 2010
    Messages:
    7,598
    Likes Received:
    23
    You must not follow Jerome at all. He posts that about twice a week I believe.

    Spurgeon equated Calvinism with THE GOSPEL- yet Jerome supposes that this quote means that Spurgeon would have been against Calvinists contending for it.

    That is the impression, I suppose, Jerome would like to give. Anybody who knows Spurgeon knows better.

    Here is a quote by Spurgeon that best represents his feelings about Calvinism and his feelings about those who would preach anything ELSE BUT Calvinism:

    So don't pay Jerome any attention with his out-of-context Spurgeon quotes.
     
  18. Luke2427

    Luke2427 Active Member

    Joined:
    Jun 29, 2010
    Messages:
    7,598
    Likes Received:
    23
    What is the official name of your theology? I think that it is whatever THAT is that I am talking about.

    Is it not nameless?

    You do not call it Calvinism, right? (Norman Geisler does, but you do not)

    You do not call it Arminianism, right? (Though you are really 4/5's Arminian, are you not?)

    You do not call it Amyraldianism, right?

    You do not call it Molinism, right?


    This is the part where most of the guys who think like you say something like- "I Call it THE BIBLE!" or "I am a BIBLICIST!" or "I don't follow a man!!! I follow Jesus (just like the Corinthians who Paul rebuked along side those who he rebuked for saying they were of Paul and those who said they were of Apollos.)

    If you are not going to respond with something akin to the above- what DO you call your theology?

    When was it systematized?

    What are it's historical roots?
     
  19. Van

    Van Well-Known Member
    Site Supporter

    Joined:
    Mar 4, 2011
    Messages:
    26,913
    Likes Received:
    1,018
    Faith:
    Baptist
    Lets name it and claim it: Reformed or Calvinistic Theology
    Arminian Theology, or Catholic Theology, or Mormon Theology.
    So being able to label a theology does not support its validity.

    How about Minimalist Bible Theology. It is based on the idea of avoiding corrupting God's word with man-made additions, or nullifying verses that do not mesh with an idealized theology based on selected interpretations of selected verses.
     
  20. BobinKy

    BobinKy New Member

    Joined:
    Aug 6, 2010
    Messages:
    845
    Likes Received:
    0
    The above statement, refined and edited somewhat, would make a very good thread. Say something like this--

    Why do the doctrines of many churches started in the last 100 years have a lack of understanding, reverence and interest in the Historic Christian Faith?​

    ...Bob
     
Thread Status:
Not open for further replies.
Loading...