Baptists and protistants

The Bible. The RCC mass in no way resembles any of the New Testament sermons I have read.

And if Jesus gave Peter the keys, and you guys are responsible for continuing Christ's work on Earth, why aren't you speaking out on the idolatry going on in Mexico ? </font>[/QUOTE]All Christians believe the Bible and are based on it; any Christian can claim to find their church 'in' the NT. You'll have to do better than that to explain historically that Baptist churches have always been around since Pentecost, unless you're 'relying' on the rather unreliable Mosheim. Name some of the groups which you claim are Baptist prior to c.1611, apart from the Anabaptists.

And, no, I'm not a Catholic either, I'm a Baptist, so it's not up to me but to the Catholic bishops to get their act together in Mexico; I have enough trouble trying to keep clean my own ecclesiastical backyard. It does seem however that your definition of Catholic seems to be 'anyone who is not my kind of Baptist'.

Yours in Christ

Matt

 

Why are we even having this conversation? Anytime any evidence is asked to be presented, all people do is give justifications for their own presuppositions, and that proves nothing except that maybe you already believe in what you believe, which we already know...my goodness, if an assertion is given BACK IT UP PLEASE! It makes everybody's lives easier, and it makes for better conversation.

Pax Christi,

Stephen

 

don4326 if the Bible was ment to be the only way to God it would say so don't you think? Where does scripture say it is to be used alone as the only authority? It says scripture is usefull but it also say hold fast to traditions, whether oral or by letter 2 Thes 2:15, hold fast to traditions I handed down to you 1 Cor 11:2, shun those acting not according to tradition 2 Thes 3:16, and my favorite is the "church" (not scripture) is called the pillar and foundation of truth 1 Tim 315.

I could give you many more examples!

peace in Christ,
grace56

 

If any Baptist would claim to be Christ's sole representative on Earth, then I would speak out. But since Baptist churches are independant, I am forced to pray to Christ, that he covict them of error. There is no Baptist pope in authority.

Apples & oranges. Your pope, supposedely "God on Earth", encourages idolatry. He builds castles to honor dolls, and himself pays pilgramage to the dolls.

If you read the epistles, you will see several great examples of error that can creep into lazy churches. To say the RCC is protected from error is to ignore evidence to the contrary. Need I remind you of the trouble the RCC found when it ignored the sexual abuse perpretrated by priests, and ignored by the catholic chain of command ?

Twisting scripture doesn't prove, to me, that Christ gave the RCC the keys to his kingdom.

 

Curt,

Whoa I almost missed you becase we were talking so fast past each other. You are not willing to even listen to what I am saying, and so, until I read the some of the articles and get back to you, perhaps it would be best if we avoided such pointless speech back and forth yes?

Pax Christi,

Stephen

 

Curtis, please answer my question

Yours in Christ

Matt

 

Matt Black, are you telling me to repond to a question of yours, while you avoid the thread I started on Mexican idolatry ? You have some nerve.

 

I don't know why you get so wound up and angry in these debates, Curtis, but...take a chill pill, bro'! Where have you started a thread on idolatry? I haven't been made aware of that thread. In any event, for the record, I condemn idolatry and do not practise it; but as I am neither a Catholic nor live in Mexico I'm not sure what else you want me to do about it if it's happening there

I do note, however, your ongoing unwillingness to engage with the question I asked, which I find noteworthy

Yours in Christ

Matt

 

And I believe I answered the question. I see no example of any RCC doctrines in the N.T.

No infant baptism. No prayer to mary. No help from humans in obtaining Christ's forgiveness. No purgatory. No veneration of saints. No rules against priests marrying. The list is endles.

 

And who says I'm angry ? Are you trying to change the subject ?

 

For clarity, I therefore repeat my request:-

I await your reply

Yours in Christ

Matt

 

How about John the baptist ?

Your asking me the impossible. I'm not saying the original churches called themselves Baptist. What I am saying is there were always fundamental, New Testament churches. The Romans made the RCC, Christ built the New Testament church.

 

Please show me where in the Bible it syas that John the Baptist adhered to the Baptist distinctives. It is far from clear that John even had a full understanding of salvation. You have failed to cite any evidence to endorse your assertions; you have merely restated and then expanded your original assertions and I therefore find them without justification

Yours in Christ

Matt

 

And I care not how you find them.

John the baptist knew all about salvation. And Jesus walked about 45 miles to be baptized by him, so he must have known something about it. John knew who he was, and identified him as such.

 

If you care not how people find your unsubstantiated claims, then you must equally accept that they will not take them seriously. I think you'll find that not only is there no evidence in the Bible for your latest assertion re John, but that Scripture actually contradicts it: Acts 18:24-19:6

Yours in Christ

Matt

 

How do those passages say John didn't know about salvation ? 'splain please.

 

Matt,

Sometimes I wish I lived in these people's world. It must be quite nice to just come up with your own presuppositions, without any evidence, and run with them.

Pax Christi,

Stephen

 

I believe the initial question regards whether Baptists and protestants are the same? I just took a test last night which had that question as one of the essays...as the RCC began the counter-reformation at the Diet of Speyer (1529) some of the German princes present lodged a protest to the Catholic church's response to Lutheranism, thus they were called "Protestants"...the word originally did not apply to baptists but has begun to be understood to refer to any who are not "Catholic"

 

LDB, I believe it is you who is running away. And your thinly veiled insult isn't helping you prove anything.

 

One of those early groups were the Montanists, who Tertullian joined in his latter years. The Montanists were much aligned by their enemies and thus heresies were attributed to them which were not actually true.
The Montanist movement grew out of a reaction to the growing corruption in the existing churches of that time. It was a call to purity, both morally and doctrinally. It is no coincidence that the rise of the Montanist movement was contemporary with the beginnings of the Catholic Church.
DHK