Being "Young" and Southern Baptist?

drfuss: Hopefully, the decline in SBC membership is only due to more SBC churches changing to an integrity in membership approach, i.e. dropping those from the membership rolls that have not attended in years. If all SBC churches reported only active members, the membership may drop by more than 50%.

 

Not sure if this even applies to anything previously discussed on this thread but you mentioned SBC numbers so I wanted to throw this out there.

The average child per home in America is about 1.9 (just below replacement rate). We are not having enough children to replenish our numbers. Evangelism is not working either. It currently takes an average of 40 Southern Baptist to reach and baptize one. Based on these numbers the SBC will be under 1 million in 5 generations or so.

Just some food for thought. Enjoy!

 

Tom, that's cooler dude. The frown had to go.

 

Children do not automatically become Christians because they are born into a Baptist home. More than 85% of kids who participated in SBC youth programs until high school graduations become inactive shortly afterward. They remain inactive well into their 30's. Then they become "re-dedicated". (whatever that is supposed to mean)

"Evangelism" is not working because we don't evangelize. It doesn't take 40 southern baptists to reach one person. It only takes one Christian willing to testify of the truth of God's Word, and Holy Spirit to convict that person of the truth of the gospel and draw them to Christ.

We "invite" people to church instead of telling them how God has transformed our lives. Is it because we can't really articulate how God has transformed our lives?

We encourage them to "repeat after me, just say this prayer" instead of encouraging them to repent and believe the Gospel, then live their lives in works meet for repentance.

We tell them "you are saved, don't let anyone tell you differently", instead of telling them the validation of a profession of faith is a life lived for the cause of Christ that perseveres even to the death or until Christ's return, whichever comes first. If you aren't living your life for the cause of Christ, you shouldn't have assurance of your salvation; you should be weeping for mercy.

We tell them "a good Christian will be in church every time the doors are open" instead of telling them a Christian's passion is to serve His Lord and strive to be conformed to His image.

We argue and fight and split ourselves into factions, based on personalities and man-made methods instead of dedicating ourselves to following the Word of God wherever it leads us....even when it contradicts the things we have been taught, or what we want to believe.

If the church is dying, its because its not really God's church. Its just of bunch of people doing a bunch of stuff that will not last past their own generation.

peace to youraying:

 

Look at the youth forum and get on the discussion about why we loose 70 to 80% of our students. Parents need to step up and stop putting the burden of discipleship on the church. The stats on the 40 to 1 ration simply prove what you are saying. People are not sharing their faith. So I agree....

 

drfuss: The OP talks about the recent decline in SBC membership, see below:

Quote: From OP
Recently my friend Ed Stetzer released a Lifeway study showing that the Southern Baptist Convention actually declined in membership in the past year. Ed (together with Southern Baptist president Frank Page) caution Southern Baptists that this probably reflects a drift of the "younger" generation of Southern Baptists away from the SBC. Ed's research is convincing... he shows that this is a 50 year trend, not just a one year blip. Ed ends the article with a very penetrating question, "Now is the moment for us to hone our vision and take on a bigger battle—we must battle to build upon our Conservative Resurgence and make it a Great Commission Resurgence...

I was simply responding to the OP by giving a possible reason for the decline in membership.

 

It is one thing to make a claim and quite another to live it. It is one thing to have a creedal faith and quite another to possess genuine salvation.

The majority of people I know who have left the SBC did not leave for theological reasons but for other reasons. None of them are pew sitters today. The quicker the SBC quits rubbing its own back and congratulating itself the quicker it will gain some humuility and God will heal the organization. Until that time God will humble them.

"Humble yourselves before God has to do it."

 

What? There is a credibility issue wth all you ant-SBC mentaility. Move on.

 

You cannot find fault with an organization is above reproach and has nothing to hide. I do not know of one time that anyone has found fault with the BGEA do you?

Perhaps you should read about the credibility of the trustees at SWBTS when Dladay was fired. The Bible calls them liars. Is that the kind of leadership you endorse? Perhaps you should read about who was the chaiman of the trustees at the time who was shacking up with 2 ladies in his church at the time? Are those the kind of leaders that you suggest are above reproach?

Perhaps you should read about the BFA scandal. How does it feel to know that church offerings were being invested to make more money rather than investing in ministry and it wass lost? The money given to churches for ministry was lost to the world. Does that remotely remind you of what Jesus did with the tax gatherers?

Can you not see that the SBC is falling apart from within?

So there is a credibility with the anti-SBC folks? If so what is it.

 

Sorry, to disappoint....... Just a stranger and sojourner..... this ain't my home....... And the message isn't "Peace and Safety" It's "Wake Up"!

 

Dilday needed firing to be sure. No the SBC is not falling apart. It has cleared out liberal theology which was needed.

 

So when the trustees lied about Dilday to the press, faculty and students that was okay because it served a higher purpose?

So it is okay to have liars running a seminary as an example of what to do in case there is something you do not like?

Ponzi schemes in the BFA were okay too?

It is okay to have a man as chairman of the trustees who shacks up with women in his congregation?

Do you really call that conservatism?

You may call that theological conservatism but I call it practical atheism. One church I pastored in the SBC had a practice for over 25 years of inviting the Mormon bishop to come and preach at events they sponsored in town. later I found out that the SBC leaders had known about it for years. It did not stop until I put a stop to it. The deacons were quite unhappy too. One very well known leader involved in the conservative resurgence told me to just leave the church. The local association told me that there was nothing they could do. That is the same SBC conservatism you are talking about.

Many pastors in that state stood against the practice of the BFA, and were shunned. That is the same conservative SBC we have today.

So you think the practices of the SBC are great when one considers the trustees lying to the press, the chairman of the trustees at SWBTS who shacked up with some adies in his church, and the practices of the BFA. Somehow I may be rather ill informed and stupid but I do find anywhere in my Bible that condones those practices. Do you?

Help me to understand how can you in any way know about such practices and call the SBC conservative? The two just do not seem to agree.

 

So when the trustees lied about Dilday to the press, faculty and students that was okay because it served a higher purpose?

So it is okay to have liars running a seminary as an example of what to do in case there is something you do not like?

Ponzi schemes in the BFA were okay too?

It is okay to have a man as chairman of the trustees who shacks up with women in his congregation?

Do you really call that conservatism?


You may call that theological conservatism but I call it practical atheism. One church I pastored in the SBC had a practice for over 25 years of inviting the Mormon bishop to come and preach at events they sponsored in town. later I found out that the SBC leaders had known about it for years. It did not stop until I cam along. One well known leader involved in the conservative resurgence told me to just leave the church. The local association told me that there was nothing they could do. That is the same SBC conservatism you are talking about.

Many pastors in that state stood against the practice of the SBC in the BFA and were shunned. That is the same conservative SBC we have today.

So you think the practices of the SBC are great when one considers the trustees lying to the press, the chairman of the trustees at SWBTS who shacked up with some adies in his church, and the practices of the BFA. Somehow I may be rather ill informed and stupid but I do find anywhere in my Bible that condones those practices. Do you?

 

All this coming form one who is obsessed with Dr. Pattersons home. As far as this post is concerned "so you say".

 

Obsessed? I have not even thought about it since until your last posting. But since you brought it up maybe you could give me answers to my questions.

It could be that I am totally wrong. So could you help me to understand how it is being a faithful steward and a leader as Jesus taught for the president to put himself ahead of those he leads by using money that was given to the seminary to add onto a home that was about 4000 square feet already and then later telling people that the seminary is in need of more money? I am wondering how Patterson demonstrated leadership as Jesus taught in that decision?

I just happen to believe that it is God's money and all of us will die. Therefore that money should have been spent to advance those things which will last for eternity. Every president before him found that home satisfactory. So I am wondering how that money was well spent, especially considering the fact that some students come with so little financial resources that they would have never been able to even afford a plane ticket in their life time if someone else had not helped them. How does a 7500 square foot house do more to advance the kingdom than any other president before him who had a smaller home? If he somehow more special to God and is able to do kingdom work because of a house that is about twice a big as before.

I wonder how George Truett or Charles Spurgeon would have handled the matter? What do you think Jesus would have shown his leadership in dealing with the matter?

 

As usual your accusation have no support or evidence. You continue to be a false witness.

 

Call me a liar if you like. That is what people do who cannot debtae the issues. Those who cannot win by debating the issues seek to attack the person. If you can find something wrong in me then have at it.

If you read your Bible you will find that many similar things were said about the prophets too.

I thought that perhaps if you thought I was wrong that you could provide some substantive correction instead of your interest in denial. Apparently you seem to be a Southern Baptist Catholic and believe everything the SBC tells you and wants you to believe, and are as loyal as Catholics are to the pope.

Apparently you are too young to remember or chose to ignore the investigation of the BFA which was on the national news several times. So I will give you some websites to look at.
http://www.azag.gov/victims_rights/BFA/bfa.html
http://www.nysscpa.org/cpajournal/2003/0703/dept/d075003.htm
http://www.rickross.com/groups/bfa.html
http://www.bfalt.org/

 

I've been Southern Baptist all my life and I've never heard of such an animal.

 

We were talking about Patterson. You switch to this? Again you are a false witness.

 

How am I a false witness?

Your conservative theology is showing in your attitude and ability to answer questions. Do you not have a faith that stands scrutiny or it is a worthless faith that quickly falls apart?