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Believers against the War

Discussion in 'Political Debate & Discussion' started by Salty, Dec 18, 2009.

  1. Salty

    Salty 20,000 Posts Club
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  2. Revmitchell

    Revmitchell Well-Known Member
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    This statement is based on a fallacy that we were unprovoked. Therefore the site has no credibility.
     
  3. Johnv

    Johnv New Member

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    Whether we were provoked or not isn't even an issue. We saw an opportunity to topple a corrupt mini-hitler, who slaughtered up to 1 million of his own people.
     
  4. Matt Black

    Matt Black Well-Known Member
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    Ah, I see. Perhaps you'd care to invade Zimbabwe next, then, based on that principle?
     
  5. Johnv

    Johnv New Member

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    Whether something is prudent from a practical standpoint is different than whether it was appropriate from a moral standpoint.

    But yes, if the leadership of Zimbabwe was unjustly and singlehandedly slaughtering large numbers of its own oppressed populus, yes, I would not oppose military action to liberate its people from said leaders.
     
  6. JohnDeereFan

    JohnDeereFan Well-Known Member
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    It's also based on the false premise that Christ was a pacifist and that we, as Christians, are to be pacifists.
     
  7. JohnDeereFan

    JohnDeereFan Well-Known Member
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    But the problem with that argument is that it isn't our job to topple corrupt mini-Hitlers.

    Regime change isn't our responsibility, nor is it Constitutional.

    And how would you justify that Constitutionally?

    But if it's not Constitutional, why are we doing it at all, regularly or not?

    No, for two reasons:

    The first is that there is a big difference between going to war to defend your country, your allies, and your national interest and going to war to remove a government you don't like.

    The second is that we were bound by treaty to defend Great Britain and its allies.
     
    #7 JohnDeereFan, Dec 18, 2009
    Last edited by a moderator: Dec 18, 2009
  8. Johnv

    Johnv New Member

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    Yes, it's not our job. That's why we don't do it regularly. When we do so, it's the exception, not the rule.
    By that reckoning, it was therefore wrong of us to fight against Germany in WWII.
    The US Constitution expressly states that the POTUS is commander in chief of the armed forces. Further, the Iraq War was approved by Congress in 2002, consistent with the Constitutional provision which says Congress has the power to declare war.
     
    #8 Johnv, Dec 18, 2009
    Last edited by a moderator: Dec 18, 2009
  9. Bro. Curtis

    Bro. Curtis <img src =/curtis.gif>
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    I agree that Christ was not a pacifist. But he lived in a country occupied by a tyrannical government, and never uttered a word against it. We cannot compare our lives ti his, he was not put here to overthrow governments. He was here to defeat sin.

    I am against the wars in Afghanistan, Iraq, & future wars against Somalia, Pakistan, North Korea & Darfur, because our troops have become nothing more than pawns in a political game. I am against sanctions towards those countris as a precursor to war, as they only starve the poor citizens of those countries. It seems we only fight wars approved by the U.N., the most corrupt, anti-Christian orginization on Earth.

    We have gangs right here in America that are a bigger threat than any foreign country. We have corrupt leaders that threaten our liberty more that Sadaam did. We should take the beam out of our own eye.
     
  10. JohnDeereFan

    JohnDeereFan Well-Known Member
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    As am I.

    I'm for sanctions.

    Agreed. Let's take our troops out of Iraq and Afghanistan and place them along the US-Mexican border.
     
  11. David Michael Harris

    David Michael Harris Active Member

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    Not looked at the site but will say that I am against war.

    Myself, I think that Christians should not be involved in the worlds politics etc.

    One sword is enough.
     
  12. Johnv

    Johnv New Member

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    It would certainly reduce the number of posts on the bb by at least 2/3 :eek:
     
  13. David Michael Harris

    David Michael Harris Active Member

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    :) Maybe we could all get on with the Gospel and helping the poor.
     
  14. Johnv

    Johnv New Member

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    Not likely. Too many here argue about how others are preaching the gospel (the old "if you're not preaching it my way, you're not preaching it" argument), complaining that feeding the poor isn't what churches should be doing, and plenty of nonsense like that. I'll never forget when someone called me a liberal for volunteering at a local soup kitchen.
     
  15. Matt Black

    Matt Black Well-Known Member
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    If you change 'slaughtering' to 'regularly beating, starving to death and stealing the land of', then you have it about right.
     
  16. David Michael Harris

    David Michael Harris Active Member

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    Isn't it just that eh!

    Things will change, one day soon hopefully.
     
  17. Salty

    Salty 20,000 Posts Club
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    So are you saying that the US should not have helped liberate France in '44-'45?

    Keep in mind that Germany never invaded the USA.

    Salty

    ps did we have any treaties with European nations in the '30's - '40's
     
  18. JohnDeereFan

    JohnDeereFan Well-Known Member
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    Perhaps "treaties" was a bad choice of words, but we did have several formal agreements that led to our becoming involved in the defense of Great Britain and the rest of Europe.
     
  19. David Michael Harris

    David Michael Harris Active Member

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    What on earth has the US and it's allies have to do with Christianity & Christians?

    I am a Brit ( Welshman ) btw, just living here in a wonderful country with the best health care in the world and a social security system that is very very kind and generous.

    And I have only voted once when I was 17, 46 now. Became a Christian at 20
     
  20. David Michael Harris

    David Michael Harris Active Member

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    What on earth has the US and it's allies have to do with Christianity & Christians?

    I am a Brit ( Welshman ) btw, just living here in a wonderful country with the best health care in the world and a social security system that is very very kind and generous.

    And I have only voted once when I was 18, 46 now. Became a Christian at 20
     
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