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Big Corn

Discussion in 'Political Debate & Discussion' started by KenH, Sep 16, 2007.

  1. KenH

    KenH Active Member

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    "So here comes Big Corn. Make that Very, Very Big Corn. Sooner or later, our experience with this huge public gamble may make us yearn for the efficiency, capacity, lower cost and--yes--superior environmental record of "Big Oil." "

    - meat of the column at www.opinionjournal.com/forms/printThis.html?id=110009587

     
  2. 2 Timothy2:1-4

    2 Timothy2:1-4 New Member

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    I wonder just who it is that has a better plan to become free of fossil fuels? Come on Kenny give it to us.
     
  3. KenH

    KenH Active Member

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    The best plan is to leave it up to the free market to decide. When the government attempts to pick winners and losers, as in the old Soviet Union, things generally don't turn out well.
     
  4. church mouse guy

    church mouse guy Well-Known Member

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    What gets me....

    What gets me about big corn is that it is not efficient to produce and can only be done with a tax subsidy. A lot of people in Indiana are cashing in on the government for a worthless product.
     
  5. Don

    Don Well-Known Member

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    Bingo. Leave it to free enterprise to determine the best way to make it happen. Keep the governmental controls only to keep the capitalists from extorting the customers.
     
  6. hillclimber1

    hillclimber1 Active Member

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    Nothing can fuel the world like fossil fuels. Corn or any other commodity should be eaten by man and beast. See what the price has done so far do to the govts. nonsensical approach. Corn is a major commodity in feeding the world, and this is soooo wrong.

    The answers America seeks are along the west coast, in the gulf of Mexico, and in the vast wasteland of northern Alaska. And if the price continues to rise, in the coal shale deposits in mid America.
     
  7. billwald

    billwald New Member

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    Count on food costs doubling for the working class. Before WW1 half of the working people's life energy went into getting enough calories to stay alive. The U.S. economy is reverting to the historical norm with mostly working poor living hand tomouth.
     
  8. hillclimber1

    hillclimber1 Active Member

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    This push to develop alternative fuels from veggies, salves the publics energy conscience enough to dismiss the only real fix which is developing more domestic oil.

    Not alternative vehicles that cost a premium and who's batteries wear out after 3 years. Not in recycling, which consumes vast quantities of energy, in a feel good scheme. These only fool us into thinking we are doing something.

    But conservation methods aimed particularly at the consumers pocket book. As in saving the consumer money. True energy efficient products, fluorescent bulbs, extra insulation in attics, and walls, etc.

    The heat pump system I'll get next spring will cost far less per month than the so called high efficiency heaters and window air conditioner we now have. And that translates into savings in my pocket.
     
  9. 2 Timothy2:1-4

    2 Timothy2:1-4 New Member

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    Heat pumps cannot work in the dead of winter in Oregon. There must be some amount of heat outside to pull in the house. Once the air temperature is lower than freezing the trusty old heat coils must do all the work. Heat pumps really only find their value in the south.
     
  10. hillclimber1

    hillclimber1 Active Member

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    They can and do very well if the air supplied the condenser is supplied at ambient ground temperature, which is about 53 deg. It's done around here rather often using a number of methods, including underground insulated salt vaults, and buried 6-8 inch pipe of up to a hundred yds. long. The best method is probably using well water as the heat exchange medium.
     
  11. 2 Timothy2:1-4

    2 Timothy2:1-4 New Member

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    What kind of reduction are you seeing in your heating costs using this? My interest is a result of sellling Trane heating and Air for a time.
     
  12. hillclimber1

    hillclimber1 Active Member

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    Won't be doing this till next spring....expensive.....I also have HVAC in my past and a continued interest in this technology.

    A close friend built a 3 story cement and block house on about 4 acres with many new ideas. This was in the late 70's. He had a greatly modified wood fired boiler in the basement, which provided all the heating for the house, and hot water for domestic use. He installed about 80 yds. of 8'' underground pipe that was the sole supplier of cooling in the summer, and this house was a comfortable in the third floor as the basement. Many details I don't remember, but i know a labyrinth of tubing was laid over a special 3" insulation on the basement floor for hot water in the winter.

    This home had 8" filled block walls, and outside that was foam board insulation, faced with brick, so the whole interior tended to have an even temp, I guess due to this construction technique. He sold it a couple years ago for a fortune.

    Oh yes, this system consumed only 3.5 cords of wood in the worst of years.

    Trane seems to be a good company. I used to install Lennox and Carrier equipment, and a couple other cheapies, but that was back in the late 60's and early 70's.

    I have more stories of extremely efficient homes I've seen/worked on in our area.
     
  13. 2 Timothy2:1-4

    2 Timothy2:1-4 New Member

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    Trane is probably the best. They recieve some of the highest ratings. But eeexxppeennssiivvee!
     
  14. poncho

    poncho Well-Known Member

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    It's already doubled and then some, I'd count more on it skyrocketing outta sight.
     
  15. hillclimber1

    hillclimber1 Active Member

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    The one we've potentially chosen is the Carrier Infinity 17 heat pump. It has a SEER rating of 17 and an HSPF rating of 9.5. It operates at 67 dBa's compared with a normal fridge at 70 dBa. Our little home only needs a 2 ton system. I didn't get along with the local Trane dealer, and the Carrier business is owned by my neighbor.
     
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