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Bush on Abraham Lincoln

Discussion in 'Free-For-All Archives' started by raymond, May 2, 2003.

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  1. raymond

    raymond New Member

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    Did anyone see the President land on that aircraft carrier?

    It is good to have a president I can hold up to my children as an example! I am sorry if that's a non sequiter, but it was truly an emotional event.
     
    #1 raymond, May 2, 2003
  2. Kathryn

    Kathryn New Member

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    Yes, I watched. I loved it. I also was struck with the thought of Hillary Clinton doing anything like that in the future. [​IMG]

    God Bless
     
    #2 Kathryn, May 2, 2003
  3. WPutnam

    WPutnam <img src =/2122.jpg>

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    Being a 30 year retired Navy type, I don't have to say a thing about the pride I felt in my president on this occasion!

    Hilary, did you say?

    Shoot fire, I can't even imagine bubba himself doing it! (Unless he wore one of those "adult diapers!)

    I am a "plank owner" (First crew member who initially put her into commission) of USS Forrestal CVA-59, the first of the super carriers, now languishing out of commission, probably waiting to be scrapped....
    [​IMG]

    God bless,

    PAX

    Bill+†+


    Regina Angelorum, ora pro nobis!
     
    #3 WPutnam, May 2, 2003
  4. BobRyan

    BobRyan Well-Known Member

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    It was outstanding.

    And I agree with Bill Oreilly's assessment of the Papal refusal to find in the Iraq war - a just war that frees suffering humanity. Makes you wonder how the Pope could have missed this huge one. Reminds me of the Jews in Germany.

    In Christ,

    Bob
     
    #4 BobRyan, May 3, 2003
  5. raymond

    raymond New Member

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    BobRyan&gt;&gt;&gt;&gt;&gt;And I agree with Bill Oreilly's assessment of the Papal refusal to find in the Iraq war - a just war that frees suffering humanity. Makes you wonder how the Pope could have missed this huge one. Reminds me of the Jews in Germany.&lt;&lt;&lt;&lt;&lt;&lt;&lt;&lt;

    Dear BobRyan,

    I had a feeling you might get around to that.
    One of the problems with being a Catholic, is that there are so many of us. We are not an American sect. Whenever we fight a war out of loyalty to our land, there are bound to be Catholics on the other side fighting out of loyalty to their land.
    This was the case in Iraq.

    The Pope has a responsibility to make it clear that wars have unintended consequences and that no side may simply state that God is on its side. As Catholics we have believed for over a thousand years that Catholic combatants can kill one another in a war without sinning. Were the Pope simply to put his stamp of approval on a war --say on our side, that would have given us the green light to pursue a war with much less regard for innocent civilians than the one which Messrs. Bush and Rumsfeld engineered.

    It now appears that we killed far fewer civilians in Iraq than we did in Serbia, a war with much more modest objectives. This was because we had a President at the time of that earlier conflict who could not afford to lose even one U.S. combat death. So we pursued a policy of higher risk for enemy civilians to reduce the risk for U.S. servicemen. This sort of cold calculation, the kind which led us to vaporize tens of thousands Japanese women and children to finish off WWII, is the sort of thing the Vatican has a problem with.

    It's all much more complicated than you admit. I doubt that you have ever objectively studied the Pope Pius XII's involvement in saving Jews during WWII. His role was considerable, but it's not the sort of thing you read about in mean-spirited and bigoted distortions put out by thepolitically correct crowd....

    your brother

    [ May 05, 2003, 02:23 PM: Message edited by: raymond ]
     
    #5 raymond, May 5, 2003
  6. BobRyan

    BobRyan Well-Known Member

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    First of all. I would NEVER want the US or any nation to enter into a war with the freedom to butcher the other side as we saw with Catholics in the dark ages. Genocide is wrong - even when Catholics do it to Waldensians to rival Catholic armies etc etc. I would never argue for such treatement of people in Iraq or anywhere.

    But the concept of a "just war" AS in opposition to Germany - ENDORSING the war AGAINST Nazi Germany and ENDORSING the war against the tyrant Saddam - on behalf of the children in prison and the people he slaughtered - is "obvious" for most Christians.

    In Christ,

    Bob
     
    #6 BobRyan, May 9, 2003
  7. Jude

    Jude <img src=/scott3.jpg>

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    Poor Senator Byrd-he's so upset...
    [​IMG]
     
    #7 Jude, May 9, 2003
  8. raymond

    raymond New Member

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    BobRyan&gt;&gt;&gt;&gt;First of all. I would NEVER want the US or any nation to enter into a war with the freedom to butcher the other side as we saw with Catholics in the dark ages. Genocide is wrong - even when Catholics do it to Waldensians to rival Catholic armies etc etc. I would never argue for such treatement of people in Iraq or anywhere.

    But the concept of a "just war" AS in opposition to Germany - ENDORSING the war AGAINST Nazi Germany and ENDORSING the war against the tyrant Saddam - on behalf of the children in prison and the people he slaughtered - is "obvious" for most Christians.&lt;&lt;&lt;&lt;&lt;&lt;

    Dear Bob,

    Do you not have a problem with us vaporizing tens of thousands of women and children in Japan in order to shorten a war, or even to win a war?

    Should the Pope have endorsed our fire-bombing the German women and children in Dresden? To endorse a war, as you say the Pope should have done, is to embrace it in its entirety, not just the nice parts. We had to keep communism in Russia from collapsing in order to beat the Nazis. Should the Pope have endorsed bolstering Communism in Russia? Are you going to tell me now that the jury is in and Communism is much less harmful than Naziism?

    Why don't you complain about Catholics butchering Muslims during the Middle Ages? Political winds against it? You seem to think that Catholics are the only villains in the world.

    your brother

    [ May 09, 2003, 04:27 PM: Message edited by: raymond ]
     
    #8 raymond, May 9, 2003
  9. Yelsew

    Yelsew Guest

    What an insult! Neither Bush nor Rumsfeld is French! Neither is cowardice enough to qualify for that title!
     
    #9 Yelsew, May 12, 2003
  10. raymond

    raymond New Member

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    quote by raymond&gt;&gt;&gt;&gt;
    --------------------------------------------------------------------------------
    Messrs. Bush and Rumsfeld
    --------------------------------------------------------------------------------&lt;&lt;&lt;&lt;

    Yelsew&gt;&gt;&gt;What an insult! Neither Bush nor Rumsfeld is French! Neither is cowardice enough to qualify for that title! &gt;&lt;&lt;&lt;&lt;&lt;

    I stand corrected. Amen to your point!

    your brother
     
    #10 raymond, May 12, 2003
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