Cheney-Edwards Debate

I would agree that "narrow is the way", but you would have to do some MAJOR prooftexting to make that passage apply to the Bush invasion of Iraq.

 

Well, Gup20, God says "Thou shalt have no other gods before me" but "god's man" in the White House invited Muslims from all over the world to come and bow their heads to the White House floor and say prayers to allah. And "god's man" in the WH also says Islam is a great religion of peace.

 

Perhaps that signals a reason to 'give up on the world' and 'hasten its end' with a vote for John Kerry... but for me... I see the command to "occupy till I come". I see that God created us stewards of this world, and we are continue in that role till the master's return.

Luk 19:13 And he called his ten servants, and delivered them ten pounds, and said unto them, Occupy till I come.

I also see the commmand to 'go ye into all the world and preach the gospel to every creature'.

Mar 16:15 And he said unto them, Go ye into all the world, and preach the gospel to every creature.

I choose to continue acting as God's faithful steward until his 2nd coming... until his return. Regardless of the circumstances and what appears around me, I will serve faithfull until He comes again so that he can say "well done thou good and faithful servent".

Mat 25:21 His lord said unto him, Well done, [thou] good and faithful servant: thou hast been faithful over a few things, I will make thee ruler over many things: enter thou into the joy of thy lord.

Matthew 25 is the parable of the 3 stewards. The first two used what God gave them to advance their master's kingdom (the talents representing the material realm or 'kingdom in the earth'). The last one did NOT advance the kingdom of God with what they were given and was cast out.

This goes foundationally to why we are here - why we were created. This is to be God's steward to creation... God's representatives to rule on his behalf. We are created in His very image also to facilitate this.

Gen 1:26 And God said, Let us make man in our image, after our likeness: and let them have dominion over the fish of the sea, and over the fowl of the air, and over the cattle, and over all the earth, and over every creeping thing that creepeth upon the earth.
Gen 1:27 So God created man in his [own] image, in the image of God created he him; male and female created he them.
Gen 1:28 And God blessed them, and God said unto them, Be fruitful, and multiply, and replenish the earth, and subdue it: and have dominion over the fish of the sea, and over the fowl of the air, and over every living thing that moveth upon the earth.

Incidentally, this will also be our role for eternity... to serve the purpose for which we were created. You might as well begin fulfilling your purpose here now in advancing the Kingdom of God in all matters:

Rev 5:10 And hast made us unto our God kings and priests: and we shall reign on the earth.
Rev 20:6 Blessed and holy [is] he that hath part in the first resurrection: on such the second death hath no power, but they shall be priests of God and of Christ, and shall reign with him a thousand years.
Rev 22:5 And there shall be no night there; and they need no candle, neither light of the sun; for the Lord God giveth them light: and they shall reign for ever and ever.

 

Jesus broke bread with Publicans and Sinners. You should not mistake honoring the persons with honoring the object of the religion. This is the same stance christians should take with homosexuals, for example... love the sinner, hate the sin.

1 Chor 8 has some things to say about this issue:

1Cr 8:3 But if any man love God, the same is known of him.
1Cr 8:4 As concerning therefore the eating of those things that are offered in sacrifice unto idols, we know that an idol [is] nothing in the world, and that [there is] none other God but one.
1Cr 8:5 For though there be that are called gods, whether in heaven or in earth, (as there be gods many, and lords many,)
1Cr 8:6 But to us [there is but] one God, the Father, of whom [are] all things, and we in him; and one Lord Jesus Christ, by whom [are] all things, and we by him.
1Cr 8:7 Howbeit [there is] not in every man that knowledge: for some with conscience of the idol unto this hour eat [it] as a thing offered unto an idol; and their conscience being weak is defiled.
1Cr 8:8 But meat commendeth us not to God: for neither, if we eat, are we the better; neither, if we eat not, are we the worse.
1Cr 8:9 But take heed lest by any means this liberty of yours become a stumblingblock to them that are weak.

So long as Bush makes his faith and belief evident, it doesn't matter whom he allows into the Whitehouse. It was obviously a political move rather than a life-altering change of belief.

 

Maybe one day you will show it to me ... I am not holding my breath though ...

 

Jgrubbs,

You may be wasting your time. If Kerry wins the election, most of the Iraq war supporters will suddenly "discover" that it's not a good thing...a few months after the inauguration. It's all about loyalty to a man.

 

Well, Daisy, exactly what do you mean by "documented"? And, how do I know that when you use the letter "g", you aren't actually intending the letter "K"? And, what does the word "not" mean, in this context?

-Your frined, Humpty Dumpty

 

Anyone who studies the Muslim expansion will soon realize that they expanded and conquered people by force.

 

Riiiight. And stopping Hitler was a bad thing... and stopping Nazism and Facism were bad too... also stopping communism... we should have minded our own business there too right?.... those philosophies were leading so convincingly towards opening those countries to the Gospel of Jesus weren't they?

Wake up folks - Terrorism, Facism, Communism, Islam - all these 'evils' have the same author, and his name is NOT Jesus, but rather it is Satan.

Hbr 2:14 Forasmuch then as the children are partakers of flesh and blood, he also himself likewise took part of the same; that through death he might destroy him that had the power of death, that is, the devil;
Hbr 2:15 And deliver them who through fear of death were all their lifetime subject to bondage.

It should be pretty obvious that terror's main weapon is fear. Fear is a corruption of faith (if you fear something you believe very strongly in it's ability to hurt you). One might say that fear is the equal and opposite of faith. Fear is to Satan as Faith is to God. The Bible makes a clear case where fear originates - the Devil. It makes a pretty clear case as well that fear is the antithesis of freedom.

Hitler had nothing to do with Pearl Harbor. Saddam had nothing to do with 9/11 - that doesn't mean defeating Hitler and defeating Saddam are not equally important in defeating the REAL enemy of our respective times... the ideas and philosophies these individuals stood for. OBL is nothing without the environment of hate that he capitalizes on. Destroying his base of support is more effective in the long run to defeating OBL and Al Quieda than capturing or killing OBL himself could ever be. Kerry/Edwards simply do not understand that. You see... when there is a base of support, you can cut off the head and another will grow back in it's place - someone else would simply rise up and take OBL's place. However, if you deal a critical blow to the body, the head will eventually wither away... and you have mitigated the creature's ability to damage you significantly in the process. When freedom comes to the Middle east, so will the Gospel of Jesus which will defeat our enemies much more effectively than bombs.

Eph 6:12 For we wrestle not against flesh and blood, but against principalities, against powers, against the rulers of the darkness of this world, against spiritual wickedness in high [places].

We have always fought for freedom in all the history of the United States. The enemy of our soul (Satan) knows that where freedom prospers, so does God's Word.

The Koran demands this.... if people will not convert, you are to kill them. That is the way Islamic/Muslim beleif is spread. It also says directly that you are not to try to convert Jews or Christians... but that you should KILL them where ever you find them. The author of that belief system (Satan) knows exactly who his enemy is... it is the only two groups of people on this earth who worship the only Real God... the God that kicked that author (satan) out of heaven.

 

All mimsy were the borogoves and the mome raths outgrabe!

 

Gup20, I pretty much agree with what you have posted. That's why I wish we had not spent the blood of our soldiers and hundreds of billions of dollars to set up a Muslim Theicracy in Iraq.

 

Theocracy, not Theicracy

 

That's clearly a mis-representation. Why don't you have a love for the truth, like me? I have never posted anything that was incaccurate, and am always perfectly objective, unlike you.

 

Speaking of ...

Anyone who reads here knows that I have never made that claim. I have posted inaccurate stuff before and when I have realized it, I have corrected it. I have never lied (until yesterday and then it was purely in jest and clearly not to be taken seriously, so it was not even a "lie.").

Nor have I made that claim. I am, as a general rule, more objective that many in here, simply because I don't have an axe to grind and I have no "horse in this race" so to speak. As a whole, I prefer Bush only because there is no better candidate that is electable. But as Daisy so aptly pointed out (and unwittingly proved herself wrong), I am not a big supporter of his. My support is tepid, not the kind of support he wants.

However, I am objective enough to offer just criticism, who offer unjust criticism, some of which is based on outright lies or misrepresentations.

The fact remains that, as much as Daisy would like to prove me a liar, she has yet to offer even one place where I have lied. It is certainly not from a lack of effort. I wish she would quit making these ridiculous assertions. The board here doesn't need to be afflicted with her personal issues with me.

 

Pray for Bush. If he is doing God's will, then God's plan in Iraq will be fulfilled regardless of appearances. This is only the beginning. Who is to say that at the first election, a theocracy will be defeated. Bush and his administration are promoting democracy and freedom... this will lead inevitably to preaching the gospel freely.

How many spend as much time (or more) praying for their leaders as they do criticising them. The Bible tells us to pray for those in authority over us.

Pro 29:2 When the righteous are in authority, the people rejoice: but when the wicked beareth rule, the people mourn.

1Tim 2:1 I exhort therefore, that, first of all, supplications, prayers, intercessions, [and] giving of thanks, be made for all men;
1Tim 2:2 For kings, and [for] all that are in authority; that we may lead a quiet and peaceable life in all godliness and honesty.

 

I guess it's an issue we will have to agree to disagree about. You think democracy is a good thing, I think democracy is a dangerous thing. Those who work to set up democracies around the world, will work to destroy our Constitutional Republic by setting up a democracy here, if they haven't already done so.

 

That would be their new constitution. It specifies that Islam is the state religion, and the laws of Islam govern the nation, or some words to that effect.

 

http://www.cpa-iraq.org/government/TAL.html

Doublespeak. Islam Law (Shariah) is not democracy.

 

Wouldn't it be if the majority chose it?

 

Yes, actually, and that's the problem with "democracy", and why our founders hated it and gave us a Republic instead.

Bet, anyway, the majority didn't choose anythying; the constitution was written by whoever we assigned it to.