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Comma in 1 Thessalonians 2:14–15

Discussion in 'Bible Versions & Translations' started by Deacon, Jun 29, 2019.

  1. Deacon

    Deacon Well-Known Member
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    Can punctuation be anti-Jewish? At least one scholar thinks so. Frank Gilliard has argued that a single comma gave generations of Christians a very wrong impression of the Jewish people, tragically leading to much antisemitism throughout history. In 1 Thessalonians 2:14-15, most English translations have something along the lines of “…the Jews, who both killed the Lord Jesus and the prophets, and drove us out” (NASB). That sounds like an extremely strong anti-Jewish statement. But what if there should be no comma after the word “Jews”?

    Can a Comma Be Antisemitic? by Dr. Yeshaya Gruber - January 9, 2019 [LINK]

    Notice the evolution in the various translations concerning this verse:

    1 Thessalonians 2:14–15 (AV 1873)
    For ye, brethren, became followers of the churches of God which in Judea are in Christ Jesus: for ye also have suffered like things of your own countrymen, even as they have of the Jews: 15 who both killed the Lord Jesus, and their own prophets, and have persecuted us; and they please not God, and are contrary to all men:

    1 Thessalonians 2:14–15 (ASV 1901)
    For ye, brethren, became imitators of the churches of God which are in Judaea in Christ Jesus: for ye also suffered the same things of your own countrymen, even as they did of the Jews; 15 who both killed the Lord Jesus and the prophets, and drove out us, and please not God, and are contrary to all men;

    1 Thessalonians 2:14–15 (NKJV)
    For you, brethren, became imitators of the churches of God which are in Judea in Christ Jesus. For you also suffered the same things from your own countrymen, just as they did from the Judeans, 15 who killed both the Lord Jesus and their own prophets, and have persecuted us; and they do not please God and are contrary to all men,

    1 Thessalonians 2:14–15 (ESV)
    For you, brothers, became imitators of the churches of God in Christ Jesus that are in Judea. For you suffered the same things from your own countrymen as they did from the Jews, 15 who killed both the Lord Jesus and the prophets, and drove us out, and displease God and oppose all mankind

    - - - - - -

    1 Thessalonians 2:14–15 (HCSB)
    For you, brothers, became imitators of God’s churches in Christ Jesus that are in Judea, since you have also suffered the same things from people of your own country, just as they did from the Jews 15 who killed both the Lord Jesus and the prophets and persecuted us; they displease God and are hostile to everyone,

    1 Thessalonians 2:14-15 (CSB)
    For you, brothers and sisters, became imitators of God’s churches in Christ Jesus that are in Judea, since you have also suffered the same things from people of your own country, just as they did from the Jews 15 who killed the Lord Jesus and the prophets and persecuted us. They displease God and are hostile to everyone,

    - - - - - - - - -

    1 Thessalonians 2:14–15 (NIV84)
    For you, brothers, became imitators of God’s churches in Judea, which are in Christ Jesus: You suffered from your own countrymen the same things those churches suffered from the Jews, 15 who killed the Lord Jesus and the prophets and also drove us out. They displease God and are hostile to all men

    1 Thessalonians 2:14–15 (NIV [2000])
    For you, brothers and sisters, became imitators of God’s churches in Judea, which are in Christ Jesus: You suffered from your own people the same things those churches suffered from the Jews 15 who killed the Lord Jesus and the prophets and also drove us out. They displease God and are hostile to everyone

    - - - - - - - -

    1 Thessalonians 2:14–15 (NLT)
    And then, dear brothers and sisters, you suffered persecution from your own countrymen. In this way, you imitated the believers in God’s churches in Judea who, because of their belief in Christ Jesus, suffered from their own people, the Jews. 15 For some of the Jews killed the prophets, and some even killed the Lord Jesus. Now they have persecuted us, too. They fail to please God and work against all humanity


    I might argue that even the placement of the verse ending displays a bias.

    Rob
     
  2. Van

    Van Well-Known Member
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    I think an important key to correctly interpreting scripture is to ask "what is the least that is being said." When we expand the statement beyond the minimum, without support from scripture elsewhere, we are "adding" to scripture. "The things" may mean "all" the things or might mean "some of" the things. By itself, the phrase does not say.

    In our verse we find "the Jews" and expansionists claim it means "all the Jews" and is therefore antisemitic. And to fix this man-made by interpretation problem, the NIV rewrites it to say "some of the Jews."

    But that just validates the poor practice of reading expansionist fiction into the text. Obviously the meaning is not all the Jews, Christ's disciples were Jews.
     
  3. rlvaughn

    rlvaughn Well-Known Member
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    A minor observation:
    "...a single comma gave generations of Christians a very wrong impression of the Jewish people, tragically leading to much antisemitism throughout history." A clear exaggeration. One single comma didn't lead to much of the antisemitism throughout history.

    If this is read an anti-Semitic toward a racial/physically-related group of people, the interpreter of the verse is missing a lot more than just the "correct" placement of a comma. Even the author of the sentence was a Jew after the flesh.
     
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