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Communication

Discussion in 'General Baptist Discussions' started by TexasSky, Sep 30, 2005.

  1. Bunyon

    Bunyon New Member

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    "In thread after thread, I notice Larry's lack of compassion toward those less fortunate than he."--------------------------------------------

    And yet there are some people who just because they buy into the kind of institutional-do gooder- welfair compassion of today, consder their do gooderism to be supperior to all others.
    And don't mind Judging people who don't buy into their particlular program.
     
  2. AMEN !
     
  3. OCC

    OCC Guest

    "And yet there are some people who just because they buy into the kind of institutional-do gooder- welfair compassion of today, consder their do gooderism to be supperior to all others.
    And don't mind Judging people who don't buy into their particlular program."
    ------------------------------------------------
    Oh?
     
  4. Michaelt

    Michaelt Member
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    Fantastic idea Rachel!!
    From what I've experienced on this forum since returning a few days ago is that a number of the members, both regular members and "forum staff", have gotten very lack with their posts, and have gotten "caught up" in the heat of moments without considering your proposal. Perhaps cooler heads will prevail, given time. lol
     
  5. hamricba

    hamricba New Member

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    I think he was objecting to you ignoring the context of Matthew 7:1. MT 7:5 easily refutes this universal application of "do not judge," when Jesus says there is a difference between pigs and dogs.

    Discernment/Judgment is a big part of the Christian life. Paul is outraged in 1 Corinthians 5-6 about the Christians FAILURE to judge each other!

    (Note: I am not making any explicit comments about the rest of this post, or the discussion as a whole other than what is stated here. My point is simply "do not judge" has a specific context made visible in MT 7, and is abused when we try to apply it outside that context. This is not failing to be compassionate- this is simply trusting what Jesus taught as He taught it!)
     
  6. OCC

    OCC Guest

    Right on Woodymdt.
     
  7. Rachel

    Rachel New Member

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    Fantastic idea Rachel!!
    From what I've experienced on this forum since returning a few days ago is that a number of the members, both regular members and "forum staff", have gotten very lack with their posts, and have gotten "caught up" in the heat of moments without considering your proposal. Perhaps cooler heads will prevail, given time. lol
    </font>[/QUOTE]I doubt cooler heads will prevail (for very long) :D , but I understand completely because I am the same way. I try to take my own advice or just not respond to alot of posts. :cool:
     
  8. OCC

    OCC Guest

    Rachel, you are a strong person. [​IMG]
     
  9. Michaelt

    Michaelt Member
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    I think if one can respond in a way that is respectful, and still get their point across, then that can be accepted among all. What I've witnessed is that people like to interlace their posts with "barbs" and that is disconcerting because that actually takes a little more thought process and "intent", rather than just lashing out at something without thinking about what one is actually posting.
     
  10. TexasSky

    TexasSky Guest

    Bunyon,

    If I misquoted you regarding they and we, I missed your pointing that out to me, and I apologize. May I ask why it was relevant? Did "them" vs "us" matter to the discussion?
     
  11. SAMPLEWOW

    SAMPLEWOW New Member

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    [​IMG] [​IMG] [​IMG] wow!

    YOU GUYS SHOULD GET A LIFE!
     
  12. Bunyon

    Bunyon New Member

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    TS, you said you were ashamed to know some people on this board. And you said it was because some blamed the victims for complaining, and you qouted me, but I actually said, "we" so I was not blaming the victims. I was talking about us.

    My opinion on this thead is we can tell someone his argument is silly, but when we say the person is silly, that is when we cross the line. We need to deal with the arguments and not characterize the people making them.
     
  13. Pastor Larry

    Pastor Larry <b>Moderator</b>
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    Did I say "most" single parents? I don't recall that. However, I do have a pretty good handle on social demographics. I routinely read the reports. And I never said that the children deserved anything. I merely pointed out the facts, something you have a hard time dealing with for some reason. You keep making stuff up.

    This is simply not true. I never excluded widows from help.

    Yes. These two things do not necessarily contradict. You should konw that. You keep reading the worst into something. I shouldn't be surprised. But I am the kind of person who gives people the benefit of the doubt.


    Yes, many times.

    Becuase, as someone pointed out, I actually read the context of it, and realize that Christ is talkign about hypocritical judgment, the whole mote and beam things.

    Nope, didn't miss any of that, and nothing I have said here contradicts it. I have the added advantage of having studied those texts and knowing what they are talking about.

    Because when people's lives are involved in sin, the most loving thing you can do is point it out and help them change. That is my perspective on it. And it is hte Bible's perspective. It is never loving to allow someone to continue in sin, and to subsidize that sin. That is very unloving, since it increases their punishment.

    I don't know how you could say that since you have never met me. And I am not the one complaining about judgmental people. That was you. And you showed yourself to be hypocritical. You are more than welcome to come up here and get involved in this ministry. I am very concerned about loving people and work very hard to make sure that we do.

    Another mistruth. You just can't help yourself it seems. I never said they "all" brought it on themselves. You need to read closer.

    This isn't true. If you think it is, then you have a gross misunderstanding of what I have said and what Christ said. When Christ saw the woman in adultery what did he say? He confronted her sin and told her to do it no more. That is love, and it is what I practice. When you continually accuse me of not wanting to help, you are not telling the truth. I do want to help. The problem is that you define "help" very different than I do.

    But the biggest problem is that you are being dishonest with what I have said.
     
  14. Pastor Larry

    Pastor Larry <b>Moderator</b>
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    [Then you haven't read very well. I challenge you to show any place that I have not been compassionate. Remember to define compassion biblically. That will greatly change this discussion.

    How do you think I feel? I have committed myself to ministering in a lower income area and reaching out to more low income people. I have committed myself to loving them and teaching them and working with them. Towards the underprivileged, I feel great compassion and heartbreak, and continually look for ways to help them. If you think that needs to be re-examined, then we will jsut have to disagree.

    I haven't cast judgment on any particular person. I have made general statements about biblical and social issues. I am not sure what you would take issue with.

    I am not sure how it was intended. I am sure it is misguided.

    Thanks for repeating what I have been saying for several days. I appreciate your support.
     
  15. Pastor Larry

    Pastor Larry <b>Moderator</b>
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    Well put. It is what I previously said. TS has a habit of not reading what I actually say, and so that may be why she missed it.

    Again, well put, and we could multiply many examples of this throughout Scripture where failure to judge is a sin.

    Let me try to summarize a few points:

    1. The vast majority of the poor could change their situation. Some could do it by not being lazy. Some could do it by finishing their education or pursuing more education. Some could do it by dressing better. Some could do it by learning the talk better. There are all kinds of issues that go into this complex issue. But poverty is not required of anyone. It can be changed.

    2. People who live in conditions that are the result of sin should be confronted in their sin with love and grace. They should be urged to repentance. We should not help them escape the consequences of their sin. That is not God's way. Proverbs is very clear about this. It is not loving to bail someone out of the consequences of their sin.

    3. Some people find themselves in an unfortunate situation not of their own fault. We should generously and gladly help them, materially and spiritually.

    4. We should all be careful to read what is actually said, and not read more into it than what is said. Much of this conflict stemmed from people's failure to read what was said. They assumed the worst and made false accusations. No one should do that. My statements from the beginning were carefully worded to avoid "always," "all," "never," "none," etc. Some of you missed that point. I was clearly not making categorical statements, but rather general statements. I have dealt with this issue (both helping people and communication) for long enough to know.

    Lastly, please refrain from personal attacks. Calling me the most hateful person you know means two things: 1) you need to get out more, and 2) you need to get to know me. That idea would very quickly go away. One of the problems with this internet communication is that body language, voice inflection, and heart is very hard to see. All you see are black and white words. And when you read them with the worst in mind, things escalate very quickly. In the future, if you are confused, then ask.
     
  16. Bunyon

    Bunyon New Member

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    ---"I would think that as a pastor who lives off the donations of others,"--------------------------------------------------------------------------

    The workman is worth his wages- Holy Bible.

    Pastor Larry should not have to feel self concious about this, or give concessions because of it. He is worth his wages, period!
     
  17. OCC

    OCC Guest

    It is never loving to allow someone to continue in sin, and to subsidize that sin. That is very unloving, since it increases their punishment.
    -------------------------------------------------
    Larry, hence the fact I point out what people "in authroity" do wrong. Just like John the Baptist...I don't care who someone is...I speak up.

    "please refrain from personal attacks. Calling me the most hateful person you know means two things: 1) you need to get out more, and 2) you need to get to know me. That idea would very quickly go away."
    yes...let's refrain from the personal attacks. So if nobody attacks me, I won't attack them. [​IMG] Also...anyone who attacks me first needs to get to know me as well. My family and friends know me. God bless.
     
  18. buckster75

    buckster75 Member

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    maybe some of this edukashun is just gettin in the way . let me see Jesus studied at ...where was that again?
     
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