Credibility without Accountability?

Lorelei, no offense, but you are talking in circles and not saying anything that I can even remotely comprehend.

How can any man not be accountable to God?

Please, state your point in the simplist terms that you are able.

I get the feeling that you wish to say something that you consider to be important, but for the life of me, I have no idea what that is.

 

What she's saying is don't be dependent on everyone else (IE those who claim to be infalible) to spoonfeed you your beliefs. If you have a relationship with God and the Holy Spirit, you'll have no worries. Let God direct your studies. Grab a Bible and you'll do fine. A good lexicon such as blueletterBible.org helps. So does reading the King James version of the Bible in addition to other Modern day versions.

2 Timothy 2:15
Study to shew thyself approved unto God, a workman that needeth not to be ashamed, rightly dividing the word of truth.

Hebrews 4:12
For the word of God is living and active. Sharper than any double-­edged sword, it penetrates even to dividing soul and spirit, joints and marrow; it judges the thoughts and attitudes of the heart.

 

I have watched the Baptist's churches in my area split and split. It is always over interpretation of the Bible. Is splitting their way of keeping apostasy out? Is not the same Holy Spirit leading in each of these churches? If so, is He leading in different interpretations of the Bible that is causing division? I'm genuinely confused about this.

 

[“Prove that he is held accountable to God. If you disagree with His doctrine, can you prove Him wrong? How do you disprove someone who makes up all the rules?”]

Last time I checked it was God that made the rules. Be specific in your attack please then we can deal with it. Give me a concrete example of how the Pope is not accountable to God.

[“When does the death of a man in the name of Christ turn form simply killing in the name of Christ to brutality?”]

Do you know anything about the crusades? Or do you just spout the usual baloney?
Europe was under attack and threatened by the Moores. Is it not acceptable to defend against an enemy? War is hell and it is not pretty. I find it quite odd that the Catholics are guilty of war crimes and yet you do not hold those same standards to your own denomination. Try and brush up on your history. Here is a link for you.

URL=http://www.medievalcrusades.com/crusadesbegin.htm]medieval crusades[/URL]

As a Catholic I accept that our history is far from spotless. But it is easy to condem another's history when you have not one of your own isn't it?

God Bless you
Yours truly in Christ,

John

 

Lorelei,

I know it and disgaree with it, yet I am still baptist. What Calvin did in his life has no effect on me or my beliefs.


Interesting. So you belong to a Church in which you don't agree with some very fundamental, foundatoinal teachings? Now are they false teachers who are teaching these things? I find this statement quite intriguing.




"They don't understand it better, they invented it to suit their needs."

You don't even know what the teaching is. How can you make such bold statements? We wrote the book on defending the unborn. Every other Church has embraced contraceptoin after rejecting it in their past (i.e. invented it to suite their needs". You just haven't got a clue and I stand by my statements. You are coming accross with hatred. How do you justify that?

"As for the KKK, again you are excusing the sins of the man who supposedly is THE ruler of the church here on earth by comparing it to the sins of men whom you would call heretics. How is this justification for what your church leaders have done and are now doing that is contrary to God's will?"

No dearie, that is not what I am doing at all. I am mearly showing that the robes in your denominatoin aren't all white and pure. Oh wait, I guess they are. My point is not that this excuses the Catholic past. The point is your point about the Crusades proves nothing of the truth or error of the Catholic faith. And your broadbrushing of Catholic priests and bishops is abomniable. I guess I should hold all Baptists and their ministers accountable because some are involved in the KKK. The Catholic Church has not said what has been done to Children is okay. And i got news for you. I have a bunch of stories about Baptist Ministers doing the same thing. Where is the outcry. You just point your fingers at Catholics. Where is your outcry against Baptist Ministers. I am not justifying anything in the Catholic Church. You just don't like looking at the plank in your own eye.

"As a catholic, wouldn't you expect a person who is not part of your church to commit such atrocities? How does that excuse the pope and bishops for covering up and commiting sexual acts with children? How does that excuse the deaths that they have caused in the past? "

I got news for you honey. I expect it inside and outside of the Church. The Bible says there will be "wolves among you." Paul in 1 Cor 5 speaks of a scandal in Corinth that is being condoned by the local leaders. John rebukes those who are involved in scandalous behavior in Rev 3 & 4. In the Old testament there is much scandal going on. Sacrificing children, sex in the doorway of the tent of the meeting, david sending a man to his death so he can have his wife. Was Judaism false because of these things. You need to get a grip on reality woman.

"It doesn't excuse it but rather shows how even the pope has no greater power than any of us. It surely doesn't prove that his words of doctrine are inspired."

Yes, men will do evil. We know that. So what is your point. Some Catholics don't follow Church teaching. If you can prove the Church teaches homosexuality and pedophillia and sex with minors is okay then you will have a point. But you make outlandish accusations without even knowing Church teachings. And show me evidence that the Pope covered anything up. You speak out of hate. You hate Catholics. Not just Catholicism. You hate Catholics. I can see where the KKK got started.

Blessings.

 

Really? Have you seen the arguments in the other forums, where Baptists (who "have a relationship with God and the Holy Spirit") each "grab a Bible", often the same Bible? And those debates are *internal* to the Baptist denomination. Multiply those by a factor of 100 for debates with people grabbing Bibles from other denominations. Each debater argues for the position they believe is correct. Obviously not everyone correct, despite having a relationship with God and grabbing a Bible. The problem of "circular reasoning" for supporting doctrine is NOT a Catholic-only issue, and is NOT solved with a simple "grab a Bible".

 

"If this is the case why don’t you afford the same curtsey to the Pope?"

We Anglicans only "curtsey" to the Queen!!

(A little Episcopalian humor)

 

"I can prove that they practice sex with minors regardless of what they "teach" about it. That is the point, what is this a church that says do I say, not as I do?"

Same can be said about one of our local Baptist pastors in a nearby town!

 

Lorelei:

Seems funny that I might be defending the Catholic Church. However, please read the threads that deal with infalibility. It is obvious you don't understand it's meaning. I know the Catholics on this board have explained it before ad nauseum but for some reason it seems that people just aren't getting it.

Also, when Baptist ministers are also committing the same kinds of sins as Catholic clergy, I don't think you should be pointing fingers. Regardless of the Catholic Churches teaching that the pope may (in concert with the bishops)declare something to be an infallible truth, that does not mean that anything they say is infallible.

BTW, I don't (at this time) agree with their teaching

 

["We Anglicans only "curtsey" to the Queen!!"]

Bahaha. That is too funny. Well done. I like that.
I will try to be more careful next time.

God Bless you
Yours truly in Christ,

John

 

Again, Lorelei:

What do you think Catholics mean when they speak of papal infallibility?? I know what the word infallible means. You know what the word means. Now, what is papal infallibility???

 

Show me, nothing personal but you're beginning to sound just like everyone else in here. Not even the Catholics here know every single one of their Catechisms by heart. Don't try to make people jump through semantic hoops. It sounds about as silly as when someone else asked me 3 times the other day what the word "consult" means...

 

ABG:

I'm asking because it doesn't sound as if she has the same understanding that I have got from reading the catechism.

I'm here because I want to learn what their church REALLY teaches, not a Chick Publications theology.