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DID AMERICA'S GAY SINS CAUSE 9-11? YES!

Discussion in '2004 Archive' started by BrotherRobert, Mar 20, 2004.

  1. Helen

    Helen <img src =/Helen2.gif>

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    Question, guys -- is it better to preach FOR Christ or AGAINST sins?

    People can agree that sins are "bad", but if they never know how to be cleansed of them and reborn in Christ to be His follower, what good is it?
     
  2. Dr. Bob

    Dr. Bob Administrator
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    Must preach LAW before GOSPEL.

    But I've heard "rants" against Harry Potter (would not dignify them by calling them sermons) that did NOT deal with sin under the law, but just opinions and attacks.

    Noticed on an almost parallel thread that #1 on a list of 20 "evils" in America was "Harry Potter". That is absurd.
     
  3. dawna

    dawna New Member

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    and indiviuals live in america more people today have not heard the gospel than lets say 50 years ago or even 20 years ago there is less and less people going to church today they are off doing everything else. why did God give isreal the promised land ? in deuteronomy 9:4-5 says speak not thou in thine heart, after that the Lord thy God hath cast them out from before thee,saying , for my rightousness the Lord hath brought me in to possess this land; but for the wickedness of these nations the Lord doth drive them out from brfore thee.
    Not for thy righteousness, or for the uprightness of thin heart, dost thou go to possess their land but for wickedness of these nations the Lord thy God doth drive them out from before thee and that he may perform the word which the Lord sware unto thy fathers Abraham, Isaac,and jacob.


    it was these nations sins that the Lord took the Land away from them and gave it to the jewish people. What about us should we the people of america do we continue on doing things that the bible clearly says is sin? or do we repent and turn from doing things our way and do what God says is right? I vote we turn back to God
     
  4. vaspers

    vaspers New Member

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    I'll write any number of real sermons that deal with witchcraft as a very definite "sin under the law." You all should know the verses on this. If not, get a good Concordance.

    Is Harry Potter good...or evil?

    Is witchcraft, in fantasy or in reality practice, good...or evil?

    Are gays more evil than witches. God says both homosexuality and witchcraft are abominations, objects of extreme disgust to God.

    Are there playful innocent witches...and playful innocent gays?

    What are the sins of our nation?

    Are we hotly divided on this issue?

    As Christians can we not come to some sort of a consensus on this? If not, that's odd.


    :confused: [​IMG]
     
  5. jshurley04

    jshurley04 New Member

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    Hello!!

    Would someone show me in scripture where America is Israel Jr.?

    Thought so, therefore God is no more judging America for ANYTHING any more than the collective sins of a people group in any other point in History. America is no more special to God than my dirty Fruit of the Looms are holy to Mormans.

    If we are guilty of a group sin it is we Baptists who have so Americanized the scriptures that we cannot read them without reading ourselves into them. We are just second hand gentiles that God loves but no more worthy of any special place in God's plan than the Chinese or Russians, or Arabs or any one else for that matter.

    9-11 was the evil workings of a group of people who have been duped by satan into believing that they are the chosen people of God and everyone else are infidels and worthy of conversion or death. They probably prefer death first. It is a sign of the world condition, not a sign of the American condition.
     
  6. jshurley04

    jshurley04 New Member

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    I don't know about you, but my citizenship is not in or of this world. I don't care what people say about the condition of this nation, let it go commie for all I care, our priority as Christians is not to restore a nation or make it better or to pass laws to force people to do what is right. Our priority always has been and always will be to tell the world of a wonderful savior named Jesus Christ who lived the perfect life, fulfilled the Law of God 100%, was 100% man and 100% God, suffered a horrible and grusome torture and death in our place, shed His blood to make our repentance and remission possible. Raised Himself up from the dead to prove to us His power and authority in all things. Commanded us to tell all nations of this gospel, beginning at Jerusalem (Luke 24:47) and then to the uttermost part of the earth (at the same time; Acts 1:8). This is our purpose and our only purpose. It is nice if we can have an accidential impact on society to make things better but it will not happen. Look and the wickedness of the hearts of those in all the movements against us, it is pure sin driving that push, and eventually the god of this world will have his way. Our hope can only be that continue to support Israel in the future as we have done in the past, but I see that slipping fast as well.
     
  7. Phillip

    Phillip <b>Moderator</b>

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    I must post my opinion, as most of you know, and most of you duck, or change channels. :D

    It is my opinion that our wicked ways are simply the symptoms of a much deeper cancer running rampant in this country. And that is the "dropping away from Jesus Christ" as a nation. They can preach Jesus in Russia in a school now, where it is now illegal in America (unless, it is private).

    As we continue to move towards secularism, new-age, and especially "universalism" (which simply means that everybody can reach God their own way, whether they are Hindu, Muslim or Christian) the country will be spiraling downhill.

    As in Job, I think it would be wrong to point to 9-11 as a specific attack allowed by God because of our sin. If that were the case, it would be unfair to the victims and their families as they would be looked upon as the cause and we all know that is not the case.

    Sodomy is always a major issue, because the Bible mentions as in the days of Noah, then we have Sodom and Gommorah. It was obvious that they were sinful to the extreme and it was obvously homosexuality. I think that homosexuality is just a sign of how far down we have allowed ourselves to go. Like other posts. There is nothing more evil about that than committing adultry with another man's wife, or being married and committing adultry. We have sin all around us.

    But, with media and television bringing it into our homes and running out of "shock" effect, the networks keep striving for more ratings by reality games and going to the extreme. The reason, that is what society demands in order to keep their short-term attention today.

    I am by no means, saying that, as country we are headed for disaster, but I think it will be a more wide-spread issue, such as internal strife, drugs and maybe financial problems. As a private investigator, I see more and more of societies symptoms each week and the business is only getting better, because the society in America is getting worse.

    That's my peace and piece.

    By the way if anybody needs a PI, write me a pm. :D A little advertising won't hurt, now will it Dr. Bob? [​IMG] :rolleyes:
     
  8. vaspers

    vaspers New Member

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    Witchcraft and violent video games have invaded the church, primarily the youth, far more than any sex perversions or even drugs/alcohol.

    Good Christian parents are "too busy" to ask little Johnny or Mary: "What's that you're watching? What are those cards you're playing with? What movie are you and your friends going to? What are you and your friends going out into the woods to do...naked? wearing horse heads? Huh? Doing what to little bunny rabbits?"

    Or they see it but don't research it a tiny bit.

    God save the youth with "Christian" parents!!!

    [​IMG] :cool: [​IMG]
     
  9. Phillip

    Phillip <b>Moderator</b>

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    Boy, your kids in Illinois must be having fun if they are into the occult to the level of "horses heads" and "bunny rabbits" and "running naked into the woods".

    I can't say much about "bad movies", "rock and roll", but OUR problem IS sex and drugs. Not occult and YES some people do watch closely.

    I would say if your kids in Illinois are that deep into the occult, you do have some major problems on your hands up north. [​IMG]
     
  10. vaspers

    vaspers New Member

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    Good reply Phillip.

    Keep your eyes open and your ears alert. Do you really know what your Junior High sunday school students do the rest of the week?

    One student of ours was accused of sending a pornographic email photo to a girl in our Jr. Hi sunday school class. The girl who is generally credible, stubbornly stuck to her claim, and the boy (I used to be one) acted guilty, sheepish, hemming and hawing around, so it may be true.

    Just an example of what a kid who "asked Jesus into his heart" and got baptized can still do in the unrenewed sector of his behavior.

    What I know for sure is this:

    They bring YuGiOh cards and play them as they wait for "Pioneer Club" to start. They admit they love to play violent games like Grand Theft Auto: Vice City. Good "Christian" kids from faithful churchgoing parents. And they resist my warnings. They persist in ungodly attitudes and activities. Guess I'm too old and out of touch with "what's cool." We have some real debates though. As you could probably guess, knowing me.


    They bring Harry Potter books to church and read them avidly, while the adults ignore them and attend to their adult "head in the sand" prayer meetings.

    Pastor: "What's that you're reading? Oh. That's nice." Walks away. Ridiculous.

    I said to same kid once: "Just remember, Harry Potter is not real. Jesus Christ has miracle working powers, and He is truly real."

    That was before I went on an all out campaign of poster, teachings, and newsletters denouncing the Harry Potter frenzy and its seduction to more advanced books and practices of Black Magic.

    The HP books are clumped together in many book stores next to Necromonicon, Book of Lies, Aleister Crowley, Carlos Castenada, Blavatsky, and other deep occult writers' books. Go to any Barnes and Noble or other big bookstore, and check out the New Age, Nature Worship, Mysticism, or whatever they label it, section.
     
  11. BrotherRobert

    BrotherRobert New Member

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    Dear Folks:

    I'm thankful for so many excellent posts from fellow Christians.

    Yes, homosexuality and abortion are only 2 of the many rampant kinds of sins we see in the world today - both outside and inside The Church.

    It's been noted that "blessed is the nation whose GOD is The LORD." The opposite of that is also true.

    As America has devolved into ever deeper heathenism, I maintain that GOD has withdrawn His Divine blessing and protection. Again, this allowed 9-11 to occur.

    Divine judgement and punishment of this once Christian nation is yet to come. And when it does, we don't need to go far in Scripture to find out how it will end - just as with Sodom & Gomorrah.

    :( :( :(
     
  12. onestand

    onestand New Member

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    BrotherRobert,

    911 was caused because leaders from another culture and religion hate. The reason it was allowed by God is because we are all allowed to make choices everyday of our lives no matter how sinful the choice is. Mixing opinion with real truth won't make make tragedys such as 911 a judgement of God.
     
  13. vaspers

    vaspers New Member

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    brother robert:

    preach it man. I'm cheering you on. Be a new Jeremiah.

    America is sleeping in stupidity, arrogance, sin, unconcern.

    People don't like to think that sin and witchcraft and heresy can have any effect on a nation...or an individual...

    ...ssshhh...they are sleeping and having nice unreal dreams...ssshhh...you might wake them up.
     
  14. Johnv

    Johnv New Member

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    Sorry, but it's much easier to blame easy targets than take responsibility for our own actions.

    Face it folks, homosexuality didn't cause 9-11. Osama Bin Laden caused 9-11. Every time we blame someone other than him, then he has achieved his objective. Period! End of story!!
     
  15. just-want-peace

    just-want-peace Well-Known Member
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    Johnv sez:
    That's a mighty strong statement; do you have a source of info not available to the rest of us peons? You infer that God DID NOT withdraw His protection because of queers; is that what you are really saying? I could accept your saying "I don't believe God allowed 9/11 because of queers.", but you seem to be speaking for God with the statement you made!

    Speaking for God again? Perhaps you had best read the times God used other nations to chastise Israel. Incidentally, I don't see this as blaming God (-- blame someone other than him,) but simply saying that He allowed this tragedy.
    ( I hope you aren't saying that God was/is too impotent to have prevented this fiasco should He have so chosen!)
     
  16. jshurley04

    jshurley04 New Member

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    STOP IT VESPERS!!!

    I do not know this young man or the situation, but don't you ever SHARE a situation like this about a young man and only be able to say MAY have done this. Just because a young man acts sheepish and other things does not mean that he did this and how dare you use him as an example of your sick twisted mind set of seeing life in its worst possible way. I know a little bit about being accused of things and to say that I am enraged at your casual use of this situation is very much an understatement.

    You have no right to use this situation to press your sick idea of what is wrong with America. Until this situation is resolved beyond a shadow of a doubt, you have no right to even look at this young man as someone less than what you see of him at church. If this kid is found beyound a shadow of a doubt, then he deserves GRACE and he needs it by the truck loads. He does not need your condecention or lofting as the poster child for what you think is wrong with kids today. This young man should be redeemed and reclaimed by the local New Testament church, not branded and torched. Since you don't know that he did or did not do what you said then you should have never used this as an example.

    As Christians we absolutely must stop our desire to see all the wrong in the world and joyfully proclaim their doom rather than stand up for the gospel of Christ. Too many Christians live on mount Olympus and only come down to the sinners when they must mingle for the sake of living life. This attitude of I am better than the world because I am saved is repulsive. Christ called us out from the same filth as the rest of the world is in now, including homosexuality, and cleaned us up and set us back to get another person who needs an escape from the same crap we were rescued from. I doubt that you are adult enough to go to this kid or any young person for that matter and extend an offer to be their friend and begin the discipling process. It seems you would rather talk down about the youth that needs our help.

    To say that you struck a nerve is an understatment.
     
  17. vaspers

    vaspers New Member

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    jshurley04:

    Thanks for your reply to my post.

    What is it you desperately want me to stop?

    You plead with me to STOP IT VASPERS.

    What is my "sick idea of what's wrong with America?"

    Does anyone know what this poor upset soul is talking about?

    You mean witchcraft is okay?

    Have you ever had the responsibility for a Junior High Sunday school class and their Wednesday night Youth Group?

    Have you ever tried to teach Junior High students about the love and peace of Christ and His high moral teachings...

    ...while they roll their eyes and can't wait to play Grand Theft Auto II: Vice City, and watch their Harry Potter videos, and play with their Magick and YuGiOh cards?

    Do you not care that witchcraft is an abomination to God?

    Preach Jesus, yes. And He preached, "Repent! Deny self! Take up cross and follow Me!"

    Church epistles spend abundant text speaking of various works of the flesh to avoid and cease.

    Ever read Romans 7 and 8? Galatians 5?

    Or are you too busy making excuses for the occult practices and violent video games and violent music interests of our youth?

    Disagree with me aggressively...I love it.

    Agreeing people are nice, but not exciting.

    I like debate. I like the search for truth.

    But commanding me to STOP?

    To stop expressing my thoughts and experiences?

    Are you the webmaster here? If so, I will indeed stop. If not, what's your point?

    STOP--expressing things you disagree with?

    hmmmm....somebody woke up on the wrong side of the bed today, me thinks.

    That boy whom you don't know but think you should defend...he has done many things that are not nice. But he looks up to me and respects me, and I encourage him and feel almost like he is my own son.

    Sorry you got so bent out of shape.

    Use your righteous anger to uproot and remove the occult and other abominations from your church and your community...in whatever spiritual strategy God instructs you in.


    [​IMG] :cool: [​IMG] [​IMG]
     
  18. onestand

    onestand New Member

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    May I also say that it disturbs me when people automatically assume the worst of lifestyle in kids at home (or adults)it's really between them and God and of course their parents. Also..."head in the sand prayer meeting"????? A talk with God is now placing a head in the sand because you don't approve of what their children are doing, playing or reading? Aye!
     
  19. onestand

    onestand New Member

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    Vaspers...my thoughts would be if the youth are rolling their eyes waiting for the first chance to play video games my question to you is...why aren't you making what your teaching interesting??If you are so concerned about the issues of these kids and their entertainment choices, make your lessons and challange them, note I said challange not point a finger, ultimately what they do is left up to their parent's descretion and their permission as well as the Holy Spirit's conviction on their lives but to stop the rolling eye balls...get down to the nitty gritty and start interesting discussions...CHALLANGE THEIR THINKING!! That's what they want, reaching a kid on their level is actually pretty easy in my opinion, I've been doing so for years now.
     
  20. vaspers

    vaspers New Member

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    Good to hear from you onestand! You're alive and well...I hope.

    I could learn from you. Sounds like you have more experience than I. Yes: interesting is the key. Thanks for saying that.

    I'm not a negative thinking guy. I believe 2004 will be the Year of Joy in the Lord, for all of us.

    You'd have to know that church I used to go to. Man, they didn't care about the youth much. They tossed a craft and a cookie at them and treated them like they were babies or lunatics.

    My Junior High kids seemed to really like me. Some told their parents many details of my teachings and such...the parents told me this.

    Not to brag, but to make a point: the adults were amazed that I volunteered to teach Jr. High kids, and joked constantly about the class being a "lion's den" of discipline problems.

    "Head in the sand" prayer meetings, I mean they glorified their ailments and problems, then prayed for God to solve their problems, with little faith or glorification of God expressed...

    ...and didn't seem to know how to deal with rampant violence and occult stuff in youth culture.

    Pastor: "I don't care if the youth are heavily into witchcraft. I don't want to preach against it. I want to preach against gay marriage."

    That did it. I left that rotten corrupt church.

    [​IMG] [​IMG] [​IMG]
     
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