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Featured Digging tools

Discussion in 'Baptist Theology & Bible Study' started by agedman, Nov 15, 2017.

  1. agedman

    agedman Well-Known Member
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    I went to school in a different century, and the digging tools were far different then I see used by the typical student and classroom of today. (I peeked at some pictures of student classrooms online,)

    Where once a library was stacked with research books, periodicals, journals, ... and students would gather great learning experience by having to actually spend hours reading (do they even have card catalogs and use the Dewey Decimal System?), the situation seems quite different.

    More often a student, by merely having to read so much of many other topics in search of the single topic of their assignment, the educational value was greatly enhanced. One, by nature of the searching, would reap a background knowledge that proved invaluable as at least having read much on many concepts in their search for that particular to their focused study. To my thinking, students were in fact better generally educated a century ago, then some, today. Where generally skinner, more dexterous, and often more polite because they were in a position of always having to ask and more often beg for someone to type while they continued to research. (That should bring back memories from some of you long ago learners)

    However, embracing modern technology has placed building massive personal libraries, in which shelving was always in short supply, to pushing buttons and on screen icons.


    Therefore, the topic of this thread.

    What would you suggest as the needed software of the beginning college student, and what one needs as a beginning seminary student.

    Remember, this is assuming the student has a very basic laptop and virtually no financial support.

    What “digging tools” would you recommend be purchased as “must have” as the start of their Biblical pursuits?

    On my iPad, I use “Bible Hub” because at my age it is easy, and provides many translations, is this enough? Admittedly, it was far better than what I took to school.

    Would that be sufficient, or would you suggest something far more robust such as “Logos?”

    Perhaps something in between such as “Olive Tree?”

    What would you recommend?

    Along this thread, those of you who were “a century ago student,” share some of the values of your own education in comparison to that perceived of today.
     
  2. John of Japan

    John of Japan Well-Known Member
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    A Bible college freshman can begin with the excellent e-Sword software. It's a free download, but a very excellent tool with many resources. For the resources, you can get such free gems as the original International Standard Bible Encyclopedia (ISBE, or "Is-be). There are other free or cheap software packages out there for the beginner. My goto basic package is Power Bible. I love the English, Greek and Hebrew search function on that.

    For the seminary student, a top drawer package like Logos or BibleWorks is necessary. I believe a seminary student can get a special deal on those through his or her seminary. Both of these programs are excellent in the original languages, offering multiple Greek and Hebrew packages, and even having the data from various manuscripts to access.

    I also have Bibloi, but it's more of a middle level package. However, it has a great search function for the church fathers, LXX, etc., so I still use it.
     
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  3. agedman

    agedman Well-Known Member
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    Excellent!

    I was very hesitant to put this out in the opening post, but Dallas Theological Seminary actually gives “Logos” to every student for free. .

    Well, free in the sense of included in the tuition costs.

    Perhaps others offer something free, too
     
  4. John of Japan

    John of Japan Well-Known Member
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    Actually, our seminary recently got the free offer too, so I downloaded it, but haven't used it much yet. What I do get is a ton of ad emails from Logos about expensive downloads! :confused: That's okay, though. It's a great program.

    My son (the PhD) uses a very high end program on his Mac, "Accordance." If you have the moola it is well worth it. Here is the website: Shared via Bible Study with Accordance
     
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  5. agedman

    agedman Well-Known Member
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    I like that they start off with what is free.

    Which brings up another question.

    I understand the need to cover expenses, but is there also an element of merchandising with all the companies.

    When does one look at what is offered, the expense, and then conclude it is a worthy investment for the furthering of the gospel?

    Sort of like a pastor who (back in the day) accumulated all the much books to display as if it puffed up his standing, when the simplest had more of God’s wisdom then he!

    I am all for education and digging tools, as long as they do not result in knowledge that is “puffed up.”
     
  6. John of Japan

    John of Japan Well-Known Member
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    This is where we profs must mentor the students. My son and I have open door policies so that the students can come to us any time and ask for help on resources. This way we are able to tell them what are good resources and unhelpful ones. We even have ways the students can check out resources from our own libraries, and many do so.

    The Internet is a fairly new ballgame, and can be daunting to a student trying to write a research paper but uncertain about good sources. We tell them: no anonymous sources; stick with scholars, not websites that can be corrected by anyone (Wikipedia, some of Theopedia, most Blue Letter Bible articles, etc.). We tell them that such sources can give a direction, but are not to be trusted.
     
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  7. Deacon

    Deacon Well-Known Member
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    Frankly Logos just wouldn't fit the budget!

    -newest SSD computer/laptop
    -the higher the price, the better the deal

    I've collected books since I started reading - Logos was an obvious choice for me.

    I was around when studying the Bible meant a couple of piles of books on the dining room table.
    I've passed many of those books on to the church library where they get dusted off every once in a while.
    No one, (or at least very few people) dig into old-fashioned dead-tree research material anymore.

    But if you look at my desktop I've a few stacks of commentaries along side my laptop to supplement the digital works.
    Sometimes a good hardback commentary can be picked up for pennies on the dollar.

    Digital is the way to go but frankly you get what you pay for - cheap software offers inferior results
    Pay as much as you can reasonably afford.
    Look for deals.

    Rob
     
  8. agedman

    agedman Well-Known Member
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    It is true that scholarship is necessary for the student to look in formulating their own views.

    The problem with most students is not knowing the history bias or influences of socio/political upon the writings of most scholarship.

    it is necessary for the student to grasp the perspective of the scholar as well as the view of the scholar. Not to esteem any but hold all before the statement of the Scripture principles.

    For example, at times a reference to the writing of Dietrich Bonhoeffer would be used. Now, that man did write some good, but also not so good. For one to place him as an unquestioned authority or scholar without regarding the influences that impacted his views would actually be unscholarly. So time would be taken to teach discernment - which to me was a far better lesson than any other.

    The same could be said of Ryrie, Walvoord, .... excluding none, of any age.

    Therefore, I probably wouldn’t be as put off as some with the beginner bringing information that was not “scholarly” but useful as a teaching tool to allow students to engage critical learning skills and build discernment.
     
  9. John of Japan

    John of Japan Well-Known Member
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  10. agedman

    agedman Well-Known Member
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    I found the same thing happens, few visit the church library.

    It is true that a part of the “digging tools” must explore what is both appropriate, what is cost effective, and what is just overpriced and unworthy of stewardship.

    It is hoped that this thread might examine the picks and shovels to value the handles, the metal, so that the reader may find what is fitting to their hands (both as beginners in the sandbox or skilled in the quarries) and have the required metal to survive the required job.
     
  11. agedman

    agedman Well-Known Member
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    Good.

    When will it be in digital form with internal links, word search, and side by side comparison, downloadable as a free app?

    :)
     
  12. Deacon

    Deacon Well-Known Member
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    #12 Deacon, Nov 15, 2017
    Last edited: Nov 15, 2017
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  13. John of Japan

    John of Japan Well-Known Member
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    Sure, but he might charge you some digital money. :Whistling
     
  14. John of Japan

    John of Japan Well-Known Member
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    It will be in digital form from the start, but only available through Logos software, in Dec. Deacon says. Probably not free. :Coffee
     
  15. John of Japan

    John of Japan Well-Known Member
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    I agree with this except that I do esteem some Bible scholars based on 1 Tim. 5:17.

    Agreed. Bonhoeffer has impressed many evangelicals, but he was neo-orthodox.

    At least Ryrie and Walvoord were conservative Bible believers.

    Wisdom and discernment are certainly not limited to the scholar, though many have it--my son in particular. (He just had an article accepted by a British theological journal.)
     
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  16. evangelist6589

    evangelist6589 Well-Known Member
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    This assumes they are using Windows!
     
  17. evangelist6589

    evangelist6589 Well-Known Member
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    I agree. It’s why I use my iPad to buy books these days. I have no need for books in print unless they are not available in the iBooks store.
     
  18. JonC

    JonC Moderator
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    Why? (Doesn't those programs also work on iOS?)
     
  19. agedman

    agedman Well-Known Member
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    I tried using Ubuntu for a while, but few products work without widows and the wine work around was cumbersome. I understand the latest release is a good bit better.

    Logos apparently works with iOS.

    Is Logos worth the cost?
     
  20. JonC

    JonC Moderator
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    I would like to have Logos, but for me it is not worth the investment. I have wordsearch and probably about $700 invested (over the years) along with a descent library and digital collection. I just can't justify the cost.

    It's a want vs need thing for me.
     
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