Discord

1. I'm a five-point convinced Calvinist and along with myself and all other well-bred Calvinists on BB your statements are totally inaccurate.

2. Either these statement reflect lack of understand of what true Calvinism is or they are meant as sadistic strawman arguments to feed your accusation of discord against Calvinists.

3. The Doctrines of Grace are so sweet. Just ask Jonathan Edwards, John Bunyan, George Whitefiled, Charles Haddon Spurgeon, Adoniram Judson and countless others who had a passion to save souls.

 

The doctrines of grace are sweeter than anyhing I can imagine! I am so glad God did not simply "offer" me salvation and depend upon my choice.

Any doctrines contrary to grace by nature create create fear, stress, resentment and discord. Just look at the legalistic and works-based doctrines that aim to place man back under the burdens from which grace set us free! These people preach fear, and ignore the verses that assure us that we are NOT in bondage again to fear, and that the perfect love of God drives out all fear! No, thank you. I will take the doctrines of grace over any works or legalism-based doctrines.

 

This is exactly why participating in Calvin-free will debates is about as useful as a hampster turning a wheel.

Has anyone ever noticed, half of the threads, despite their appearance of different titles, carry the agenda of both sides?

Hasn't it dawned on any of you super highly educated scholars that you are not going to change anyone's mind?

These are the facts:
God is sovereign.
Within that sovereignty, man has free will as God allows and has ordained.
Neither you posters or any other human being understands the mind of God.
You are going to change no one's mind.
You will not know for sure until eternity, then will not care.
Your silly threads cause nothing but discord and accomplish nothing.

If anyone wonders why we have the Catholic Church, the various Orthodox churches, hundreds of Protestant churches, and some weird off shoots that dont even resemble Christianity anymore, a mere 2000 years after the Church was in one accord, with one Spirit in the Book of Acts, then look at the nonsense that goes on within these threads, and this is just one major faith. Multiply that by centuries and there is your answer.

Education, thinking you are right, and your opinion does not equate to Biblical truth.

 

Yep, I have noticed, so thanks for the compliment!!! :laugh:

 

Amen. Well-said. :thumbsup: I think there are some, and I pray not the author here, just want to attack.

 

Over the years, my pastors have been God-honoring, Bible-preaching, with a zeal for evangelism and missions. Some have been Calvinists, some not.

Most of the non-Calvinists I have known in my Christian lifetime have been God-honoring, inerrantist, holding a high view of scripture. I would not accuse any of them of holding a "devilish" doctrine.

As a Calvinist who believes in a sovereign, omnipotent, omniscient God; as one who desires to glorify God in worship, in witnessing and in ministry; as one who is grateful for God's mercy in hauling me out of the miry clay and setting my feet on the solid Rock, as one who is grateful for God's electing grace and love; as one who believes that Jesus' death on the cross actually secured my salvation, thus making him worthy of my worship and obedience; as one who conntributed nothing to my salvation--if what I believe is devilish, then words have lost their meaning and civil discourse is no longer possible on this board.

 

We must remember that to study Calvinism-----is to study something that is a little bit less than inerrant, inspired, and also a little bit less than infallable!

 

BB , Calvinism is the substance of biblical teaching .

 

Not sure, but that sounds like a warped version of Hebrews 11:1 that says "Now faith is the substance of things hoped fro, the evidence of things not seen."

I agree with Calvinism, and believe he was a man used by God. However, do I think of that the way I do the Bible, inerrent, no, I don't. Those who do, it is merely an opinion, not Biblical truth.

Those who take it to this level, (and free will on the other side) are those who cause the holy crusade of discord in these threads.

 

Obviously, I disagree, but your comment is something we can honestly debate without rancor, and is a far cry from labeling it as devilish.

 

Maybe I am missing something. When did ps 109 use the word "devilish?" If he did not, maybe this proves my point. Or maybe I missed it.

 

So, Tom!!! You're willing to debate Calvin's work as infallable, inerrant, and inspired???

Great day in the morning!!! Now I've heard everything!!! Calvinists go on like Calvin is Jesus Christ reincarnate!! I can't believe anyone would think to place all of their confidence in one man's work of theology!!!

 

Not this silly calumny again... *sigh*

 

So, you're a 5 point Calvinist ?

 

No, no, no, erase, erase, erase. I mis-spoke, let me clarify.

I believe the doctrines of grace are correct and biblical, a conclusion I have drawn by a study of the inspired, inerrant scriptures. But my interpretations of those scriptures are by a fallible human being, subject to error. So are Calvin's writings.

When I wrote this:

my mind was thinking one thing and my fingers were typing something else.

Actually, my mind was probably a total blank

 

Dance classes are open folks. We are teaching the side step.

 

Well, I don't quite see that Scripture the way you do. And the true Calvinist doesn't see that the way you do either. I see that Scripture as stating that "whosoever believes in Him" will not perish precisely because he has eternal life, which is why he believes. You see it, (correct me if I am wrong) as meaning one can only not perish if one believes because only then, if he believes, can he have eternal life.

And again, the tension in the Scripture is not caused by the Scripture itself but by the way men interpret the Scripture. For example, in the Scripture you cited there is much debate amongst Calvinists and Arminians.

The Arminians insist that God wants ALL men (as in mankind in totality) to be saved. The Calvinist usually says that ALL men does not mean all mankind in totality but all men as in irregardless of race, creed, tongue, social class, and so on.

But the real question is : saved from WHAT ?

If saved from the wrath of God, didn't Jesus Christ accomplish that for those whom the Father gave Him ? If this desire of God is for the eternal salvation of all men, then didn't He himself cause Daniel to quote Nebuchadnezzar as saying that He is a God who does whatsoever he desires in the army of heaven and earth ?

Apparently, God's desire that all men be saved is not in the eternal sense, because He did that in Christ. If not in the eternal sense, then there can only be the Doctrinal, Moral, and Gospel sense, where men are taught and discipled in truth and the narrow way, since God did save all He wanted to save in Christ but apparently not all will be taught of and hear about the gospel.

While the Calvinist may be right about the need to reach out to God's people, bear in mind that not all who have God's word can have the ability to reach all who need to be reached. Only the Holy Spirit, who is God, and therefore Omnipresent, can do that.